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Old 29th December 2017, 18:23   #1381  |  Link
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Thanks for the thanks!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bandits View Post
I use BDSup2Sub to extract .sup to .xml, merge 2 .xml files together, then create a new .sup, all from command line (I never use GUI). After your testing it would seem best to use ++ to extract and 4.0.0 to create new .sup? Everything is automated so using 2 versions would not be an issue. I just want the best possible results without missing subtitle events.
I plan to do something similar for BD3D2MK3D. Currently, the user has the choice of the version to use, but I think that the result will be consistently better if I can use always the ++ version to create the XML/PNG, and any java version for the conversion of XML/PNG to the output format (BD Sup or DVD Sub). Of course, BD3D2MK3D uses also the command line only. I'll let you know if I encounter a problem...

BTW, I forgot to specify that the ++ version doesn't have the same command line parameters than the Java versions. That may be a bad point for your automation tool.
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Old 29th December 2017, 19:30   #1382  |  Link
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Are you using ++1.0.2 or ++1.0.2a?

I'm familiar with the differences in the commands. I have used most versions at some point. I probably can find a version of Blu-Ray Ripper that had used the different commands and just cut paste.

Once again thanks for taking the time to check the different versions.
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Old 29th December 2017, 19:57   #1383  |  Link
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I use ++ 1.0.2. I did not know the existence of 1.0.2a. Do you know where it is coming from, and what is its difference with the previous version ?
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Old 29th December 2017, 22:51   #1384  |  Link
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https://www.videohelp.com/download/b...1.0.2_Win32.7z Says its from 2016 but file date is 2013. Has 102a in title. Also there is an 102a from Jan 2013 that hashes the same.

https://www.videohelp.com/download/b...1.0.2_Win32.7z From Apr 2013

All old versions

BDSup2Sub++ 1.0.2
Bugs

Fixed issue in BD SUP parser that could trigger palette not being updated with subtitles that used fades.
Fixed issue where "move from original y position" did not work properly with positive values.

Enhancements

Settings are now stored in AppData folder on Windows and $HOME on *nix platforms.


BDSup2Sub++ 1.0.2RC
Bugs

Fixed issue where scaling filter specified by CLI didn't recognize the option.
Fixed issue that caused empty SUP files to crash the application
Fixed issue importing an invalid palette INI file would cause all colors to be set to black
Fixed issue where processing via CLI did not result in bit-exact output as through the GUI

Enhancements

Properly handles BD SUP that contain subpictures that use multiple composition objects
XML/PNG input/export properly handles events with multiple graphics


BDSup2Sub++ 1.0.2
Performance optimization, memory leak, and crash fixes.

Also under old versions there is another 102a from 2013. I can tell you the 102a keeps the .ini in its same folder. Other than that I haven't done any testing but to launch them to see version number. I can find no change log for 102a.
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Old 29th December 2017, 23:46   #1385  |  Link
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Sorry, I can't find the ++1.0.2a that doesn't save its ini in the same dir. Your two first references link to the same file, so I don't know to which file you refer. It seems that there are several archives containing the same 1.0.2a at VideoHelp, but not the "good" version.

Anyway, I suppose that that version is not due to the same developer, as otherwise he should have released 1.0.3. And since the development has stopped, I think I'll keep the last version of the official author of the ++ branch, the one that I have tested.
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Old 30th December 2017, 00:30   #1386  |  Link
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I don't know why my links went to the same place.

I see a bdsup2sub++1.0.2_Win32.7z (supposable 2016) that is the same as bdsup2subplusplus102a_win32.7z (1/30/2013) that are both 3.6megs and hash as the same file. I also see bdsup2subplusplus1.0.2_Win32.7z that is 3.8megs and shows no "a" on the title bar. The non "a" version appears to be the latest file date at 4/17/2013. Is that the version you are using?
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Old 30th December 2017, 11:14   #1387  |  Link
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Yes. The only "a" version that I have is dated 30/1/2013 21:49 as seen in Properties -> Details tab. (I don't trust the date of the archive or the release date shown at the VideoHelp site.) It stores the ini in the program's dir. Also, it cannot handle the multiple subtitles at the same time (bug 5). I haven't tested it fully, but obviously, it's an old and useless version.

I have never seen an "a" version that doesn't store the ini in its dir.

I will definitively keep the latest version without the "a". It is 4.059.136 bytes (3.87 MB) and is dated 17/4/2013 18:39 (again in Properties). It's the version I have used to do the tests.
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Old 30th December 2017, 14:19   #1388  |  Link
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Damn! I did some additional tests, and I've found that ++1.0.2 fails miserably when it converts some subtitles streams to XML/PNG. It creates often several PNGs for the same subtitle (probably when the Java versions issue the Fade out detected warning). When it's the case, the entry for that subtitle is wrong in the XML. Furthermore, it references sometimes non-existing PNGs. For example, I've converted the French subtitles of Avatar to XML/PNG, and I see this in the XML:
Code:
    <Event InTC="00:08:48:21" OutTC="00:08:50:15" Forced="False">
      <Graphic Width="0" Height="0" X="0" Y="0">Avatar_fr_exp_0101_0.png</Graphic>
      <Graphic Width="0" Height="0" X="0" Y="0">Avatar_fr_exp_0101_0.png</Graphic>
      <Graphic Width="0" Height="0" X="0" Y="0">Avatar_fr_exp_0101_0.png</Graphic>
      <Graphic Width="0" Height="0" X="0" Y="0">Avatar_fr_exp_0101_0.png</Graphic>
      <Graphic Width="0" Height="0" X="0" Y="0">Avatar_fr_exp_0101_0.png</Graphic>
      <Graphic Width="474" Height="126" X="557" Y="794">Avatar_fr_exp_0101_5.png</Graphic>
    </Event>
Only the 0 and 1 PNGs exist, and of course it is impossible to import that XML/PNG stream back in any version of BDSup2Sub.

With this subtitle stream, it seems that the first picture (with the _0 extension) is always good, so it should be possible to write a little script to patch the XML to remove the bad entries and change the file name of the entry with the correct dimensions, like this:
Code:
    <Event InTC="00:08:48:21" OutTC="00:08:50:15" Forced="False">
      <Graphic Width="0" Height="0" X="0" Y="794">Avatar_fr_exp_0101_0.png</Graphic>
    </Event>
Bot of course, I cannot be sure that the first PNG is always the one to keep.

I'm still investigating that bug, and I will try to find a workaround. I'll report here when I will have a solution. In the meantime, do not assume that the ++ version works correctly to convert from PGS to XML/PNG.

[EDIT] It seems that ++1.0.2a and ++1.0.0 do not have that bug. It's a pity that they have the multiple subtitles bug. :-(
I can't find ++1.0.1. Does it exist?
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Old 30th December 2017, 15:32   #1389  |  Link
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I have understood why BDSup2Sub++ does that strange thing with the _1, _2... extensions. It's to deal with the problem of the multiple subtitles appearing at the same time. The sample provided by Scorpius666 here to demonstrate the problem of the double subtitles is a good example.

That stream contains two subtitles. The first subtitle with the word "INCOMPETENT" is shown near the top of the screen from 00:17:10:19 to 00:17:14:08. The second subtitle "Isn't it more like this?" is shown in the bottom of the screen only from 00:17:12:02 to 00:17:13:09. It is therefore displayed when the first subtitle is visible. That subtitle disappears with all Java versions except Enhanced, and ++ prior to v1.0.2 as well as 1.0.2a.

BDSup2Sub++ translates that two subtitles to XML/PNG as 3 subtitles, like this:
Code:
  <Events>
    <Event InTC="00:17:10:19" OutTC="00:17:12:02" Forced="False">
      <Graphic Width="379" Height="45" X="773" Y="108">Multiple Subs Sample_exp_exp_0001_0.png</Graphic>
    </Event>
    <Event InTC="00:17:12:02" OutTC="00:17:13:09" Forced="False">
      <Graphic Width="377" Height="43" X="773" Y="108">Multiple Subs Sample_exp_exp_0002_0.png</Graphic>
      <Graphic Width="473" Height="43" X="739" Y="928">Multiple Subs Sample_exp_exp_0002_1.png</Graphic>
    </Event>
    <Event InTC="00:17:13:09" OutTC="00:17:14:08" Forced="False">
      <Graphic Width="379" Height="45" X="773" Y="108">Multiple Subs Sample_exp_exp_0003_0.png</Graphic>
    </Event>
  </Events>
There are indeed two subtitles shown at the same time between 00:17:12:02 and 00:17:13:09.
I don't know if specifying two BMPs for the same subtitle is legal, but it's a way to handle the difficult problem of the two subtitles.

BTW, BDSup2SubEnhanced use probably a similar trick, since it creates also 3 subtitles out of the two original subtitles, and it uses the same time codes than the ++ version. I don't know if it is smart enough to merge the two bitmaps together for the new combined subtitle. Anyway, it is unable to save the stream correctly as XML/PNG. Pity.

I will try to find a method that works with all kind of source subtitle streams. It will probably be necessary to save the original stream to temp files to avoid some bugs. Anyway, I'll do that later. I'm tired of the numerous problems encountered with all versions, and I have to prepare the new year eve...

@Scorpius666: If you have some time, can you have a look at the palette/transparency problems of your versions ? I can give you some examples. It's the only major bug of your version, and if you can fix it, we will have a good solution. Thanks in advance!
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Old 30th December 2017, 19:35   #1390  |  Link
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I will start testing a few files. I am currently extracting the Avatar subtitles which I know have issues in different version. I also know Close Encounters of the Third Kind gives different results. Test Subtitle. 4.0.0 reports 1071 events as well as 5.1.2, ++ reports 1077 events, and enhanced crashes.

I will do some extractions to see differences.

Quote:
Originally Posted by r0lZ View Post
I can't find ++1.0.1. Does it exist?
Can find all ++ versions from the link in my signature. As well as the test subtitle. Be aware the version numbering is strange for ++ versions. I included file dates in the fine names to see correct release order.
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Old 30th December 2017, 19:41   #1391  |  Link
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If there are sometimes several subtitles at the same time, it is normal that ++ reports some additional events, as I've explained above.
How can I dl your tour test subtitle? If I follow the link, I end up in my DropBox space.
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Old 31st December 2017, 12:20   #1392  |  Link
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I have modified the list of bugs here to include the ++ bug discussed above (as bug #7).
I am currently trying to find how to detect the bugs when running the different versions of BDSup2Sub from the command line, and if it's possible, I will try to find a workarounds for each of them, but that will take some time...
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Old 1st January 2018, 18:11   #1393  |  Link
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You mentioned using 4 different streams you are testing. Can I ask which ones? I have Avatar and I downloaded the other you posted but are there 2 others?
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Old 1st January 2018, 19:51   #1394  |  Link
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I use the subtitles from the Avatar 3DBD because BDSup2Sub++ detects wrongly multiple ODS, and it creates blank and/or missing PNG files when it tries to convert it to XML/PNG. Note that loading that stream in ++ and saving it as a new BD SUP solves that problem. The copy is bug free, and doesn't contain false multiple ODS any more.

I use also the little sample file provided by Scorpius666 in this post, because it demonstrates clearly the problem of the multiple ODS, and here, it's not a false positive.

I use also the subtitles from the musical 3DBD Scorpions Live in 3D, Get Your Sting & Blackout (2012). It cumules two problems. The Java versions produce the subtitles with bad palette or transparency values (or both). Also, many subtitles are embedded in larger transparent areas, and that makes BDSup2Sub++ fail when it loads the XML/PMG. The X positions are almost always wrong.

The fourth stream is not really necessary. I kept it because it's an example of multiple ODS I've found a long time ago, but Scorpius666's sample is better.

BTW. I have now a method that works to convert from BD SUP to XML/PNG and again to BD SUP (or DVD SUB) with all problematic streams I have tested so far. I have has to write a little script to combine the PNGs of the multiple ODS events to form a single PNG and therefore a single ODS. That works already well, but I still have to finish it. I'll release it here when it will be ready. The method is this:

1. Load the original BD SUP in BDSup2Sub++ v1.0.2 (not v1.0.2a!) and export it as a new BD SUP. That's sufficient to solve the problem of the Avatar subtitles. Do NOT use a Java version, as otherwise you will experiment the bad palette problem.

2. Load the new BD SUP in ++ and export it to XML/PNG. The XML/PNG should be correct, without blank PNGs or bugs in the XML.

3. Process that XML/PNG with CombineMultipleODS (my script). It will combine the PNGs of the subtitles with multiple ODS as single PNG and produce a new XML file with the references to that new PNGs. Therefore, the stream is now "pure", without multiple ODS any more.

4. Do whatever you need to do with the fixed XML/PNG. (In my case, I need to convert it ti 3D SBS or T&B.)

5. Load the final XML with a Java version of BDSub2Sub. Any version should be OK, since the XML/PNG is clean and without multiple ODS. Do NOT use ++, as if there are subtitles in larger canvas, it will crop them and fail when computing the new X coordinates.

6. Export in the final format you need. You should obtain a perfect result, without missing subtitles, bad palettes or wrong X coordinates.

I will probably release CombineMultipleODS tomorrow...
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Old 2nd January 2018, 03:13   #1395  |  Link
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So use ++1.0.2 as a filter by converting SUP to SUP. (Fix bad palette)
Use ++1.0.2 to export to XML. (Proper detection of multiple ODS)
Combine PNG's for Java version to properly detect in XML.
Use any Java version to create new SUP from XML. (++1.0.2 fails on some X/Y offsets)

Seems simple enough and easy to implement for my use.

How are you squashing the PNG's together? GDI?
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Old 2nd January 2018, 10:04   #1396  |  Link
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Yes, it's exactly that, except that the first conversion (from SUP to SUP) fixes only the false positives of the multiple ODS (the "Avatar bug"). ++1.0.2 doesn't have the palette/transparency bug.

The script I've made uses ImageMagick's convert.exe. It's somewhat slow, but since there are usually only a few multiple ODS, it's fast enough.
The command line looks like this:
Quote:
convert.exe -size "474x864" xc:none "test/test_exp_exp_0002_0.png" -geometry +34+0 -composite "test/test_exp_exp_0002_1.png" -geometry +0+820 -composite "test/test_exp_exp_0002_combined.png"
Where the size is the size of the transparent bitmap receiving the two (or more) subtitles and the -geometry parameters are the X/Y coordinates of the PNGs within that bitmap. Both are easy to compute from the values in the XML. You can add more -geometry +x+y -composite "sub.png" chains if there are more than 2 subtitles to compose, but I have never encountered that.

The script checks also if there are bad entries in the XML, with <Graphic Width="0" Height="0" X="0" Y="0"> or missing PNG files, as they are the sign that a stream causing the "Avatar bug" has been converted directly to XML/PNG. Anyway, that buggy XML/PNG streams cannot be loaded in any version of BDSup2Sub, due to the missing PNGs.
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Old 2nd January 2018, 12:33   #1397  |  Link
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CombineMultipleODS

Here is the little dirty script I wrote to fix the problem of the multiple ODS bug. It is written in Tcl, but I have compiled it as an exe, so that you don't have to install Tcl/Tk to run it.
It works from CLI only, but you can also drop an XML file on the exe to convert it automatically (but the DOS window will be closed automatically at the end of the operation, so you will not see the error messages).

The script works on XML/PNG streams only. When there are multiple ODS (several subtitles appearing at the same time on screen), BDSup2Sub++ v1.0.2 saves them as several PNGs for the same event. BDSup2Sub++ is the only program able to reload that streams correctly. Unfortunately, since BDSup2Sub++ has a big bug when it crops the PNGs, it is not safe to use it to load an XML/PNG stream. For that reason, it is necessary to merge the PNGs of those multiple subtitles as one single subtitle. It's what CombineMultipleODS does. (Note that it does NOTHING if there are no multiple ODS in the stream.) You should finally load the fixed XML in any Java version of BDSup2Sub to export it to the final format. As an additional bonus, all multiple ODS will be removed (since they have been replaced by the combined subtitles), and you can be sure that any player supporting the BD SUP format will display all subtitles. You can also convert to DVD SUB (that doesn't support multiple ODS) if you want.

In the archive, there are also 3 sample SUP files to demonstrate the 4 big bugs of the various incarnations of BDSup2Sub, and convert.exe (from the ImageMagick package) used to combine the PNG files together. The source tcl script is also included.

Download: CombineMultipleODS.7z
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