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Old 26th February 2019, 11:41   #54981  |  Link
Manni
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Just to update regarding the 8bits/12bits difference with madTPG on the new JVCs. It looks like you need to enable the BT2020 flag in 12bits to get the native gamut. Problem is, you also need to do this with a rec-709 calibration. In 8bits, this isn't necessary. The gamut is linear whether you enable the BT2020 flag in the calibration tab or not.

So I highly recommend to calibrate in 8bits. In fact, I have resolved my banding issue in 8bits, it was due to the "auto" setting in madVR not detecting that the driver is set to 8bits. I discussed this with madshi and currently, the "auto" setting is based on the display EDID, not the driver settings to 8bits or 12bits. Madshi might fix this at some point. In the meantime, if you set the driver to 8bits, you have to force the bit depth to 8bits in madVR.

With 8bits dithering, there is no visible banding compared to 12bits, even with HDR 10bits content. So given all the issues with 12bits with post-385.28 drivers at least with the JVCs (no custom refresh rate, can't select 12bits, calibration issues, borked video levels), I'm using 8bits now, both for playback and calibration. That way, madVR can generate a custom refresh mode that stick,s I only have to enable it in the nVidia CP as it's disabled by default.

I couldn't use 8bits with the rs500 due to the magenta bug, but it's gone with the rs2000.

Thanks to Huhn for his help resolving this.
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Last edited by Manni; 26th February 2019 at 11:45.
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Old 26th February 2019, 13:36   #54982  |  Link
Warner306
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ryrynz View Post
Anyone compared a Geforce 2060 to a 1080 with madVR?
The RTX 2060 is about equivalent to a GTX 1070 Ti in performance, so it is still below a GTX 1080.
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Old 26th February 2019, 14:51   #54983  |  Link
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Originally Posted by tp4tissue View Post
But I think it's prolly just coming up short after cropping to 1918 or 1919, after doubling, short of 3840.
Exactly, and this is the issue: the condition is only evaluated after cropping and before upscaling, but not after individual scaling steps.
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Originally Posted by tp4tissue View Post
But with 3840x2160, I have a file, it'd crop to 3839, detection works here, even though chroma is also NGU.
So I guess it all comes down to whether there is a second round of scaling. the first round is detected properly
I'll say it another way: it has nothing to do with how many rounds of scaling there is or if NGU is enabled somewhere, but with the difference in definition between the cropped image and the final definition the image needs to be displayed in.
Let's say your screen is 3840-wide, you set the setting to "disable scaling if image size changes by only 2 lines or less" and you have 2 black lines to crop in each of those two examples:
- 1920-wide source on 3840-wide display ==> madVR evaluates "my source is now 1918-wide, that's more than 2 lines difference with 3840, so I'll scale", then NGU gets you to 3836 and then has to use another scaler to get to 3840. The condition is only evaluated once before any scaling, so it doesn't even check after using NGU that it's now at less than 2 lines from the display def. In effect, it behaves as if it was playing back a native 1918-wide source!
- 3840-wide source on 3840-wide display ==> "my source is now 3838, that's 2 lines or less difference from 3840, I won't scale."
The setting is evaluated after cropping and before any upscaling operation, and only once. It has nothing to do with how many rounds of scaling are needed, or if NGU is enabled for chroma, or anything else.
Which is why it would be nice if madshi could change the behaviour of this setting to be checked after any scaling step, as Asmodian suggested. You could set it to 5 lines or less and it would handle 5 lines on a 3840 source or 2 lines on a 1920 source.
1920-wide sources is probably the only case where you'll encounter this specific issue as 960x540 video isn't a standard consumer def, but you could in theory also encounter it if you played that source def on a 1920x1080 screen, and also on 640x360 video with a 1280x720 screen.
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Last edited by el Filou; 26th February 2019 at 15:17. Reason: bad idea
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Old 26th February 2019, 14:57   #54984  |  Link
huhn
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just use mpc-hc video frame double size for now.

Quote:
EDIT: or better, madVR should avoid cropping black bars in the source definition if their size is less than the configured setting for this option, that way it wouldn't need to do checks after each scaling step.
1920-wide sources is probably the only case where you'll encounter this specific issue as 960x540 video isn't a standard consumer def, but you could in theory also encounter it if you played that source def on a 1920x1080 screen, and also on 640x360 video with a 1280x720 screen.
black bar detection is also run on the CPU so it's not that easy.
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Old 26th February 2019, 15:15   #54985  |  Link
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Yes, thought about that afterwards.
I think re-evaluating that zoom control setting after each scaling step would be best and also not that hard to implement, IMHO.
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Old 26th February 2019, 17:13   #54986  |  Link
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Originally Posted by el Filou View Post
Yes, thought about that afterwards.
I think re-evaluating that zoom control setting after each scaling step would be best and also not that hard to implement, IMHO.
Or u know, disable vertical bar cropping, solves 90% of the cases of this issue, not perfect, but i mean, it's a good sweep
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Old 26th February 2019, 19:33   #54987  |  Link
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sometimes there is 4:3 or 14:9 hardcoded in 16:9 source
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Old 27th February 2019, 01:38   #54988  |  Link
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Originally Posted by el Filou View Post
sometimes there is 4:3 or 14:9 hardcoded in 16:9 source
I'm not saying a better solution isn't possible.

Only that as a quick and dirty fix that would resolve most of the issue is also very straight forward by disabling vertical bar detection

Moving ahead, we're mostly dealing with widescreen.
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Old 27th February 2019, 08:38   #54989  |  Link
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Possible bug:

in madVR 0.92.17

In keyboard shortcuts, if I set a key for 'chroma upscaling algorithm - Bicubic' the keybinding will do nothing. If I set keys specifically for the other chroma upscalers such as Lanczos, Spline, and Jinc they will work. This might have to do with the different options Bicubic gives you (75,100,150, etc.). If I set a key for 'chroma upscaling - toggle' it does select the last Bicubic I used once I toggle over to it.
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Old 27th February 2019, 09:18   #54990  |  Link
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Pop it up on bugs.madshi.net
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Old 27th February 2019, 12:05   #54991  |  Link
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madVR 0.92.17
with KMPlayer, in fullscreen, player's seek(bottom)/function(top) bars are in auto-hide. When I try to use the seek bar, the video frame moved down, is there option(s) to "fix" that with MadVR? Cause that does not happen with EVR or older versions of KMPlayer.

* please ignore my Setup in signature
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Last edited by totalz; 27th February 2019 at 17:23.
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Old 27th February 2019, 15:30   #54992  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ryrynz View Post
Anyone compared a Geforce 2060 to a 1080 with madVR?
Unless someone owns both, it's difficult to compare, because they could be using different paths, different drivers, different amount of shaders, somehow the memory is accessed in a different way, power setting, power limits..

Guessing isn't super useful.. we'll just have to wait until someone buys one..
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Old 27th February 2019, 15:56   #54993  |  Link
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there is no need to own both the 1080 is clearly faster without a doubt.

the only way to make the 2060 faster then the 1080 would be new code in madVR that uses new features from the Turing architecture and that's clearly not the case yet.
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Old 27th February 2019, 21:24   #54994  |  Link
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I know the 1080 would be faster, I'm curious about the performance delta though given things like card size and power draw. Thanks to the 1660Ti there should be some good prices on 1060s second hand/New? for all you people still using 950/960s or lower, or just straight up go for a 1660Ti for the best performance per dollar new.
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Old 27th February 2019, 22:03   #54995  |  Link
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Originally Posted by ryrynz View Post
I know the 1080 would be faster, I'm curious about the performance delta though given things like card size and power draw. Thanks to the 1660Ti there should be some good prices on 1060s second hand/New? for all you people still using 950/960s or lower, or just straight up go for a 1660Ti for the best performance per dollar new.
No price drop yet, if anything, the good 1060 models went up by $5-10 recently.

Only the super shitty 1060s go for the $150 range.

A while back 1060 FTW/FTW+ could be had for $150/160

580 is the best deal for gamers right now, good models go for $150 routinely. BUHHHH then Huhn's gonna be like, NGU NGU NGU..
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Old 27th February 2019, 22:06   #54996  |  Link
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Yeah, same though. Love ma supersampling.
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Old 27th February 2019, 22:09   #54997  |  Link
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there is no need to own both the 1080 is clearly faster without a doubt.

the only way to make the 2060 faster then the 1080 would be new code in madVR that uses new features from the Turing architecture and that's clearly not the case yet.
I don't think this is entirely accurate, in most gaming benchmarks I've seen OC 2060 is more or less as fast as stock 1080, sometimes it almost matches stock 2070 (while being quite cheaper on top of it), I assume this at least partially reflects madVR performance as well. Besides, madshi said on another forum that when choosing between RTX or GTX cards, he recommends former.
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Old 27th February 2019, 22:19   #54998  |  Link
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Originally Posted by KoKlusz View Post
I don't think this is entirely accurate, in most gaming benchmarks I've seen OC 2060 is more or less as fast as stock 1080, sometimes it almost matches stock 2070 (while being quite cheaper on top of it), I assume this at least partially reflects madVR performance as well. Besides, madshi said on another forum that when choosing between RTX or GTX cards, he recommends former.
WHY did he recommend RTX, that's important. What did he say in the other thread ?
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Old 27th February 2019, 22:20   #54999  |  Link
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Yeah, same though. Love ma supersampling.
Also, how are you guys making those image comparisons with the red and blue dots.
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Old 27th February 2019, 22:24   #55000  |  Link
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Dunno what anyone else is using but I use Beyond Compare https://www.scootersoftware.com/download.php

I believe madshi's recommendedation was mostly down to future proofing. If there is going to be any tensor core code it's probably a year or two away if not more...
MadVR 1.0 coming 2025 hold your pants.

Last edited by ryrynz; 27th February 2019 at 22:29.
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direct compute, dithering, error diffusion, madvr, ngu, nnedi3, quality, renderer, scaling, uhd upscaling, upsampling

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