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Old 2nd December 2012, 10:17   #15901  |  Link
AndreaMG
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Hi @madshi,
I think it has already been asked, but since I think it could be helpful for a lot of us I just wanted to ask if for you is high priority or not: it could be awesome to be able to select the appropriate upscaling algorithms depending on the resolution of the video without everytime having to do ctrl+j to see if frame dropping is occuring and then via shortcut keys adopting another less demanding algorithm. If too difficult to implement I guess it would be great to implement it just for 720 videos. Thanks
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Old 2nd December 2012, 11:01   #15902  |  Link
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Originally Posted by AndreaMG View Post
it could be awesome to be able to select the appropriate upscaling algorithms depending on the resolution of the video without everytime having to do ctrl+j to see if frame dropping is occuring and then via shortcut keys adopting another less demanding algorithm.
Different algorithms have different visual effects. Judging one or the other to be "better" is a perceptual thing. While Jinc maybe the darling of the moment around here, I personally use Spline 3-taps with no anti-ringing filter. Other people undoubtedly have setups they prefer for the type of content they play most, so it wouldn't be possible to set up this system without adding the complexities of multiple user-defined profiles for different "levels"of up-scaling.

Also, I sometimes have frames drop right at the very start of playback or when jumping from Windowed to Fullscreen view, I wouldn't want MadVR automatically "downshifting" the method of up-scaling because of these dropped frames when it's only a temporary issue.
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Old 2nd December 2012, 11:18   #15903  |  Link
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Originally Posted by nx6 View Post
Also, I sometimes have frames drop right at the very start of playback or when jumping from Windowed to Fullscreen view, I wouldn't want MadVR automatically "downshifting" the method of up-scaling because of these dropped frames when it's only a temporary issue.
But I do not want MadVR to automatically switch scaling algorithms based on framdrops, where did I say that? The problem for me (and for many others I guess) mostly occours while playing 720p videos with the same demanding upscale algorithms that runs perfectly fine with SD resolutions I agree with you that every one has his preferences (mine is Jinc), I simply would like a feature (don't know though if easy to implement) like the following one: if video resolution is less than 720 pixels height than use these user define upscale settings, if not use these otheres. Hope I made myself clearer
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Old 2nd December 2012, 11:33   #15904  |  Link
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Okay, I read that as you wanted it to use a given algorithm but if frame dropping was occurring it should change itself to a lower one. :S

It's more then the resolution that determines of something is going to play back smoothly or not anyway. The 720p video could be in a less demanding h264 profile from one file to another, or just lower bitrate, not to mention frame rates can vary...
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Old 2nd December 2012, 11:50   #15905  |  Link
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Originally Posted by nx6 View Post
The 720p video could be in a less demanding h264 profile from one file to another, or just lower bitrate
You are right, for sure out there there are 720p videos that could be easily upscaled with the same SD heavy settings, that said I by far prefer to have the choice to play ALWAYS a 720p video with lower upscale settings and "taking the risk" that some of those 720 videos could have run the same even with highest settings than having almost every time a play a 720p video to manually change the upscale algorithm That said please notice that playing a 720p video with a less demanding upscale algorithm is not necessarly a bad thing, for what I understood the upscale quality of algorithms is much more noticible the lowest the native resolution is.
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Old 2nd December 2012, 11:57   #15906  |  Link
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Originally Posted by AndreaMG View Post
But I do not want MadVR to automatically switch scaling algorithms based on framdrops, where did I say that? The problem for me (and for many others I guess) mostly occours while playing 720p videos with the same demanding upscale algorithms that runs perfectly fine with SD resolutions I agree with you that every one has his preferences (mine is Jinc), I simply would like a feature (don't know though if easy to implement) like the following one: if video resolution is less than 720 pixels height than use these user define upscale settings, if not use these otheres. Hope I made myself clearer
You can already do this with a "hacky" launcher of your own if you can code a little.

Create a drop target that you might drag and drop a movie onto (MKV or some such).

Use something like mediainfo.dll to get the file properties, then instantiate a madVR settings object to set the scaling algo based on some set of rules against the file props (ie. rez, bitrate, etc.).

THen, launch the player with the movie file.

It's hacky because your player of choice can't already be running with a madVR instance.....and other reasons that maybe aren't so obvious.

IMO, this type of functionality might be better in the player rather than the renderer, but either way, it's handy to have.
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Old 2nd December 2012, 11:59   #15907  |  Link
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Originally Posted by nx6 View Post
It's more then the resolution that determines of something is going to play back smoothly or not anyway.
I agree, but at least for me (GTX 460M overclocked) jinc has such an impact on the GPU that makes the difference between SD and 720p videos. Other things like for instance high bitrates do not have the same performance hit
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Old 2nd December 2012, 12:01   #15908  |  Link
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You can already do this with a "hacky" launcher of your own if you can code a little.
Thanks, not an option
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Old 2nd December 2012, 12:09   #15909  |  Link
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Right now, for debugging the problem I'm having. Also you could more easily switch back and forth to see the difference (some screens allow non-60Hz input while still displaying at 60).

But for something actually useful - changing the refresh rate takes time and sometimes messes with background programs. When watching random short videos, I'd rather just stick to 60Hz, even in fullscreen.
IMO it fits nicely with the other on/off keyboard shortcuts already present.
Maybe later, but not now.

Quote:
Originally Posted by AndreaMG View Post
Hi @madshi,
I think it has already been asked, but since I think it could be helpful for a lot of us I just wanted to ask if for you is high priority or not: it could be awesome to be able to select the appropriate upscaling algorithms depending on the resolution of the video without everytime having to do ctrl+j to see if frame dropping is occuring and then via shortcut keys adopting another less demanding algorithm. If too difficult to implement I guess it would be great to implement it just for 720 videos. Thanks
Yes, it has already been asked. And as I said before, there will be a solution for this some time in the future, but not soon.
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Old 2nd December 2012, 12:13   #15910  |  Link
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Maybe later, but not now.
Yes, it has already been asked. And as I said before, there will be a solution for this some time in the future, but not soon.
Thanks a lot
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Old 2nd December 2012, 15:31   #15911  |  Link
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I personally don't like the idea of madVR changing scaling algos based on frame drops. I guess because there are many thing that can cause framedrops that are not related to GPU being overstressed. I would say a better solution would be to have the ability to choose different scaling algos based on video sizes, format and framerate.
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Old 2nd December 2012, 15:31   #15912  |  Link
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image upscaling - Jink 4 or 8 select
go to
croma upscaling - Jink 3
go to
image downscaling - Spline 4
go to
image upscaling - Jink 4 or 8 be in false
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Old 2nd December 2012, 16:37   #15913  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Razoola View Post
I personally don't like the idea of madVR changing scaling algos based on frame drops. I guess because there are many thing that can cause framedrops that are not related to GPU being overstressed. I would say a better solution would be to have the ability to choose different scaling algos based on video sizes, format and framerate.
Just base it on rendering times.
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Old 2nd December 2012, 17:04   #15914  |  Link
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Originally Posted by Keiyakusha View Post
Very rarely people really benefit from [hardware acceleration].
There are ivy bridge ulv chips out there that are only dual core and are low frequency. I imagine high bitrate h264 would have noticeably higher cpu usage when decoded through software.
So, I think even with modern platforms, it is still possible to get a benefit.
And if you do a lot of multitasking or run something cpu intensive in the background, performance with software decoding can dip.
Lastly, you have this video decoding stuff taking up valuable die space on your gpu, might as well use it.

Last edited by mindbomb; 2nd December 2012 at 17:10.
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Old 2nd December 2012, 17:09   #15915  |  Link
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Hardware acceleration should be used whenever possible. And to quote nevcairiel:

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Hardware decoders usually use less power, because they are running in fixed-function hardware and not in general-purpose hardware like the CPU.
Additionally, some slower/older CPUs may have issues with complex formats (especially VC-1 interlaced requires quite some CPU because the decoder isn't well optimized for multi-threading)
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DXVA2 Native uses the least power, and if you don't need software post-processing like ffdshow raw or VSFilter, you can use it and benefit the most from it. If you use such post-processing, i would recommend either CUVID or DXVA2-CB, as thats most likely your active GPU, and QuickSync only works if the Intel GPU is active.
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Old 2nd December 2012, 18:36   #15916  |  Link
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For a fast PC, power usage is the only possible advantage you get, and some people just don't care and prefer the more reliable software decoder, which is just fine. /me shrugs
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Old 2nd December 2012, 18:56   #15917  |  Link
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In my case, DXVA CB cause many dropped & delayed frames with all algorithms, is it normal ?
Right now, I set Lav with no Hardware Acceleration and I have 0 dropped or delayed frames.
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Old 2nd December 2012, 20:31   #15918  |  Link
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DXVA CB doesn't work well on AMD before the 7000 series, AMD doesn't like when you copy stuff from the GPU to the system memory.
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Old 2nd December 2012, 21:30   #15919  |  Link
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Personally, I don't like DXVA because you're dependent of GPU drivers, and I don't trust AMD drivers (I don't trust Intel or Nvidia either).
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Old 2nd December 2012, 21:56   #15920  |  Link
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Originally Posted by nevcairiel View Post
For a fast PC, power usage is the only possible advantage you get, and some people just don't care and prefer the more reliable software decoder, which is just fine. /me shrugs
Also, for people like me who have a powerful CPU and relatively weak GPU (i7-920 @ 3.8 GHz + GTS250), using software decoding might result in a quieter system because it stops the GPU fan kicking in.
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