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Old 20th February 2016, 11:31   #36281  |  Link
AngelGraves13
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madshi, will you be extending the GPU queue to maybe 32 or 64 eventually? Same question for frames to present in advance.

I've noticed higher values produce smoother motion with smooth motion turned on. I'm guessing it has to do with how many frames are blended together.
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Old 20th February 2016, 12:02   #36282  |  Link
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Originally Posted by AngelGraves13 View Post
madshi, will you be extending the GPU queue to maybe 32 or 64 eventually? Same question for frames to present in advance.

I've noticed higher values produce smoother motion with smooth motion turned on. I'm guessing it has to do with how many frames are blended together.
Present in advance can't be increased, thats a limit of the Direct3D API.
And personally I seriously doubt that increasing the queues increases the smoothness, as long as the value is high enough for the algorithm to work. It won't blend infinitely many frames, just the exactly right amount.
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Old 20th February 2016, 14:04   #36283  |  Link
James Freeman
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Fellows I have to express my findings.
Super-xbr 150 does wonders to Chroma, it makes the very lossy 4:2:0 appear as though it is 4:4:4.
Reconstruction (sharp/placebo) does something very similar but a lot harder on the gpu than super-xbr.
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Last edited by James Freeman; 20th February 2016 at 17:00.
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Old 20th February 2016, 16:38   #36284  |  Link
hdboy
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I'm an avid madVR user but I was slightly bemused with all the effort to support 3D, now that it appears that Samsung and LG are about to pull the plug was it and is it really worth the effort for what appears to be a dead format in its current guise ...
I'm think LG may keep it alive a bit longer. Their passive 3D on OLED is getting rave reviews for being the best 3D ever.
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Old 20th February 2016, 16:52   #36285  |  Link
James Freeman
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Yeah, it's quite ironic that Nev and Madshi implemented support for 3D right at the end of 3D life cycle in the TV industry (unexpectedly I assume).
Nevertheless it's awesome for whom loves full resolution frame-packed 3D and madVR together.
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Old 20th February 2016, 17:46   #36286  |  Link
nevcairiel
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Originally Posted by hdboy View Post
I'm think LG may keep it alive a bit longer. Their passive 3D on OLED is getting rave reviews for being the best 3D ever.
Unfortunately their OLEDs cost an arm and a leg. Wonder if their 2016 S-UHD screens are any cheaper and still good.
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Old 20th February 2016, 20:08   #36287  |  Link
FDisk80
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Yeah, it's quite ironic that Nev and Madshi implemented support for 3D right at the end of 3D life cycle in the TV industry (unexpectedly I assume).
Nevertheless it's awesome for whom loves full resolution frame-packed 3D and madVR together.
I'm calling it now. VR Movies! It's 3D and surround.
Just think about it. You can watch the same movie over and over and always find something new that you didn't see before because you just didn't turn your head to look at it before.

Nev and Madshi get to work
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Old 20th February 2016, 20:36   #36288  |  Link
James Freeman
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I'm calling it now. VR Movies! It's 3D and surround.
Just think about it. You can watch the same movie over and over and always find something new that you didn't see before because you just didn't turn your head to look at it before.
Try NNEDI3 256 on that...
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Old 20th February 2016, 20:39   #36289  |  Link
FDisk80
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Try NNEDI3 256 on that...
Ha!
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Old 21st February 2016, 01:30   #36290  |  Link
thewildsun
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Originally Posted by FDisk80 View Post
I have the same problem if I use MPC-BE with internal filters.
But if I use MPC-BE with LAV filters the problem goes away.

Just tested and it's the same problem also with the latest madVR version.
I have the same issue in PotPlayer and Windows 10. It doesn't make a difference if I use the latest LAV nightlies or PotPlayer's internal decoders. The only way I've been able to work around this issue is to uncheck D3D11 in madvr. Has anyone found a way to avoid the issue while keeping D3D11?
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Old 21st February 2016, 03:06   #36291  |  Link
CarlosCaco
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Originally Posted by James Freeman View Post
Fellows I have to express my findings.
Super-xbr 150 does wonders to Chroma, it makes the very lossy 4:2:0 appear as though it is 4:4:4.
Reconstruction (sharp/placebo) does something very similar but a lot harder on the gpu than super-xbr.
What a coincidence, I was messing with the configuration and tried the placebo and sharp, was very very clear the diference from soft, só i tried xbr on 150 because performance hit and achieve great results, so i came to the fórum and reads your post, have the same finding! Great!

By the Way madshi thanks for the great improvements on madvr

Ssim 2d is detailed clean sharp a great addition to the renderer
Great job!

B
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Old 21st February 2016, 03:41   #36292  |  Link
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Doesn't reconstruction sharp and placebo create a green halo for you guys? It's not subtle. Soft is the only choice for me.
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Old 21st February 2016, 04:04   #36293  |  Link
CarlosCaco
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Doesn't reconstruction sharp and placebo create a green halo for you guys? It's not subtle. Soft is the only choice for me.
I don't see any green halo...

Madshi there is a way to reduce the perfomance hit on reconstrution placebo and sharp?
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Old 21st February 2016, 06:15   #36294  |  Link
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Doesn't reconstruction sharp and placebo create a green halo for you guys? It's not subtle. Soft is the only choice for me.
I definitely see ringing with reconstruction and sxbr.

I find nnedi3 to be the sharpest, and it's comparable to the performance hit taken by reconstruction sharp AR and placebo AR.
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Old 21st February 2016, 06:45   #36295  |  Link
JarrettH
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And by halo, I mean ringing. When I was watching an episode of Family Guy it was quite apparent. Basically any cartoons. The ringing happened to look like an opposing colour
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Old 21st February 2016, 09:27   #36296  |  Link
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And by halo, I mean ringing. When I was watching an episode of Family Guy it was quite apparent. Basically any cartoons. The ringing happened to look like an opposing colour
So if NNEDI3 is too taxing, would you say Jinc AR is the next best option for chroma?

Currently, I use reconstruction soft (previously I used Jinc AR) for chroma when NNEDI3 can't be used. I'm seeing ringing in some cartoons too but not sure if it's just the shitty SD source.
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Old 21st February 2016, 09:52   #36297  |  Link
Manni
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Fellows I have to express my findings.
Super-xbr 150 does wonders to Chroma, it makes the very lossy 4:2:0 appear as though it is 4:4:4.
Reconstruction (sharp/placebo) does something very similar but a lot harder on the gpu than super-xbr.
Are you saying Super-XBR 150 gives a better result than NNEDI3 32? Is this with bluray?
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Old 21st February 2016, 11:22   #36298  |  Link
James Freeman
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Are you saying Super-XBR 150 gives a better result than NNEDI3 32? Is this with bluray?
I painted a test pattern with thin and thick lines of blue and red circles in 4:4:4.
Then video captured the screen with CamStudio (screen recording software).
Then compressed the RGB (4:4:4) video through x264 to YCbCr 4:2:0 lossless.

I simply compared the original 4:4:4 video with the 4:2:0 video and chose a chrome upscaler which looks closest to the original 4:4:4 video.

To my eyes Super-XBR 150 almost recreates the thin chroma data without touching much the thick circles.
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Old 21st February 2016, 11:33   #36299  |  Link
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Are you saying Super-XBR 150 gives a better result than NNEDI3 32? Is this with bluray?
All neuron counts with NNEDI3 for chroma look basically identical. It's pretty much a waste using more than 16 neurons on it for chroma IMO as
I Rolled a 16 neurons screenshot and a 256 neuron screenshot back and forward and I can't tell the difference viewing it 1 foot away.

I've noticed that when anti-ringing is enabled with super-xbr and to a lesser degree Jinc (both with AR enabled and not along with some other scalers) can bring green tinges and possibly other colors if the source white contains some inside, which isn't ideal. This is only noticeable upon close inspection however.

The below screenshot comparison shows how bad this can be but you'd be hard pressed to notice it while watching.

super-xbr 150 vs super-xbr 150 AR

Also for comparison NNEDi3-16 taps vs Reconstruction sharp

I'm actually really liking super-xbr 150 for chroma... I wonder if it'd be possible to make a combination of it and reconstruction?
So it looks like I've got a new preference for chroma..

James can you share your videos? Thanks for testing it BTW, I wouldn't have considered it useful for chroma if you hadn't mentioned it.

Last edited by ryrynz; 21st February 2016 at 12:19.
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Old 21st February 2016, 12:37   #36300  |  Link
Manni
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Originally Posted by James Freeman View Post
I painted a test pattern with thin and thick lines of blue and red circles in 4:4:4.
Then video captured the screen with CamStudio (screen recording software).
Then compressed the RGB (4:4:4) video through x264 to YCbCr 4:2:0 lossless.

I simply compared the original 4:4:4 video with the 4:2:0 video and chose a chrome upscaler which looks closest to the original 4:4:4 video.

To my eyes Super-XBR 150 almost recreates the thin chroma data without touching much the thick circles.
Thanks, I'll give it a try.

Do you notice an improvement compared to NNEDI3 with real content, especially bluray chroma upscaling?
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