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Old 2nd November 2014, 22:30   #1  |  Link
huhn
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media play deinterlacing/ivtc quality

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Originally Posted by turbojet View Post
What type of videos play jerky in MadVR but not MPDN? Realizing madvr's film/video detection could use a lot of work. With film mode on all the telecined film and 29 fps video I deal with plays fine. With the little 59 fps video I watch it still works but missing half the frames are noticeable in high motion scenes. OTOH mpdn plays telecined 1080i terribly, with the dupe frames just like any other renderer except madvr's film mode, with the exception of wmc. How does wmc play everything very smoothly? Would be interesting to know. AFAIK it uses the same renderer and default decoder as wmp but wmp doesn't play things smoothly.

If it's wanted I could make a batch script that checks video framerate, monitor refresh rate and switches, if needed, before playing a file in MPDN. I had done something awhile ago to test madvr not switching to certain refresh rates. The only downside to this is all video files need to be opened with the batch script.
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Originally Posted by huhn View Post
madVR can play 29i at 60 fps so what are you talking about?

and it uses the same deinterlacer as WMC the DXVA deinterlacer from your GPU. there is a trade quality for performence option that deinterlace 29i to 30 fps but this is optional.

feel free to post such an major issue in the madVR thread.
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Originally Posted by turbojet View Post
With film mode on it doesn't play 29i at 59 fps and the film/video auto detection is mostly broken.

If WMC uses the same dxva deinterlacer than it's doing something else that plays all 29i telecine material smoothly without dupes at 60hz, it doesn't look like interpolation. SiliconDust's proprietary player QuickTV plays 29i just as smooth as WMC with less cpu/gpu load. No other free players/renderers handles it nearly as good as these 2 except madvr with ivtc which works great with most material at the correct refresh rate or smoothmotion enabled. MadVR and EVR deinterlacing 29i telecine is nearly unwatchable imo, it's just not the same as what you get on your tv from consumer electronics, WMC and QuickTV. If you don't believe me comparehttp://www.mediafire.com/watch/rkctk..._telecined.mpg in WMC to the others.

If WMC's deinterlacing method was available it's the one to use. There's judder with 25p, 24p and lower progressive video at 60hz with it though.
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Originally Posted by huhn View Post
think about a new thread or we should at least switch to the madVR thread. this thread is not the best choice i guess

i just checked your sample on my windows 10 preview PC it is a normal 3:2 cadence telecine file that should be detelecined and dispalyed with 23p. WMC is no part of windows 10 so i check it later with my windows 7 PC.

will be interesting to see how WMC get's this smooth with a deinerlacer that should be the DXVA deinterlacer.
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Originally Posted by turbojet View Post
I don't think any of this belongs in the madvr thread. I brought it up in here because I asked if ivtc would be considered in the future and Zachs says he'd like to add a deinterlacer but needed examples (of code?). If he didn't want to mess with ivtc may as well aim for a deinterlacing method that is nearly as good which WMC is. Dxva deinterlacing by itself is not very good on telecined material.
I don't see a difference between madVR doing 30i 60 fields -> 60 fps and WMC deinterlacing using windows 7 with a r9 270. they are both not smooth when using deinterlacing.

what type of windows and GPU are you using?
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Old 2nd November 2014, 23:31   #2  |  Link
turbojet
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Nvidia 250, 650 and intel SBC (3000?).

I had deinterlacing set to auto in potplayer which led to undesired results. After disabling it evr and madvr 59i is comparable to WMC. WMP is still an issue and looks terrible.

I don't know how I had missed this, potplayer had been problematic for me in the past. Recently had some issues with potplayer that a reset fix. Now I can watch these videos that madvr ivtc doesn't handle well with madvr without encoding.
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Last edited by turbojet; 2nd November 2014 at 23:37.
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Old 3rd November 2014, 13:42   #3  |  Link
huhn
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so potplayer is deinterlacing with half frame rate?
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Old 3rd November 2014, 23:49   #4  |  Link
turbojet
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It was set to bob which would indicate full frame rate and played 59i that are really 59 fps fine. It caused noticeable frame jumps regularly and on occasion the video would slow mo. The same things happen in WMP currently for me.
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Old 4th November 2014, 00:08   #5  |  Link
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maybe a filter in your chain like ffdshow is set to deinterlacing?
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Old 4th November 2014, 05:34   #6  |  Link
turbojet
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Nope, ffdshow not installed.
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Old 6th November 2014, 08:05   #7  |  Link
turbojet
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The sort of effect I'm seeing in WMP can be reproduce by encoding the file to 59.97 fps and playing it. Why is dxva deinterlacing nice and smooth while after encoding the dupe frames are noticeable and there's slow parts?
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Old 6th November 2014, 11:48   #8  |  Link
huhn
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you can not simply encode 29i to 59p you need a deinterlacer for this. so it all falls with the deinterlacer you choice it is possible to use the "dxva deinterlacer by using directshowsource with cuvid. but I can't recommend directshowsource at all.

so what deinteralcer did you use to encode the file and what type of file was the source telecine 3:2, 2:2, true interlaced or something else?
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Old 6th November 2014, 23:58   #9  |  Link
turbojet
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Yadif, nnedi3 and bob all output bad movement with dgnv feeding a 3:2 29i source, same as with source I posted earlier. dgnv bob deinterlacing shows bad movement. DSS using lavfilters hardware and yadif deinterlacing also show bad movement.

I'm out of ideas. It would seem reproducing dxva deinterlacing would be simple while encoding but it seems elusive if not impossible.
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Old 7th November 2014, 15:24   #10  |  Link
huhn
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are you sure you used a deinterlacer mode that will return 59p not 29p?

and on top of this is shouldn't be smooth to deinterlacer 3:2 cadence material to 59p you should ivtc them to 23p
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Old 8th November 2014, 00:26   #11  |  Link
turbojet
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Yes 59p output, it's smooth with dxva deinterlacing expect it to be with deinterlacing filters as well?

Some tv shows are time compressed and are intentionally missing frames which looks fine when watching on tv or with dxva deinterlacing at 59p but not when encoding to any framerate.
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