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Old 30th September 2018, 19:24   #52881  |  Link
sat4all
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Quote:
Originally Posted by madshi View Post
Are you sure this was introduced by a new madVR build? Maybe it was a driver or OS update?
Indeed, it's from nvidia 4xx.xx drivers. the weird thing is that madvr can switch my tv to hdr mode during playback but not madtpg!
About Defeating TV's internal tone mapping, i've measured my LG OLED HDR peak arround 394nits so i've set madvr target nit to 400nits for HDR Processing and while comparing it to HDR>SDR i couldn't see any loss of details while enjoying the luminance boost of HDR mode.
Hope madshi can implement his idea of outputing maxCLL based on selected target nits in the next official or test release.
Thanks for making my TV HDR mode usefull again
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Old 30th September 2018, 19:46   #52882  |  Link
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Originally Posted by SamuriHL View Post
I want to be clear, at 800 it looks fantastic. My reasoning for saying that it may be too high is that I don't know the max nit level for my specific TV. I have no way to measure it. My goal is to keep the target nit under the max nit that my TV is capable of in an effort to minimize my TV's internal tone mapping. It's very likely that it's tone mapping regardless, but, if madvr does its job at the theoretical max limit for my TV, I'm HOPING that whatever the TV does internally doesn't mess with it too much. As from my experience so far, that seems to be the case. At 800, I can see a NOTICEABLE improvement over pass-through. Hope this makes sense.
Hi, to be clear, when using MadVR tone mapping are you turning off Active HDR on your TV?
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Old 30th September 2018, 20:11   #52883  |  Link
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I've tried to insert those custom resolution values madVR calculated (first picture) into the CRU tool which you can see in picture 2.

Why is the horizontal front porch not accepted by CRU? It's red and the OK button is greyed out. It looks like madVR and the GPU driver doesn't have any problem with that front porch value. There wasn't any error message obviously.


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Old 30th September 2018, 20:57   #52884  |  Link
SamuriHL
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Originally Posted by iSeries View Post
Hi, to be clear, when using MadVR tone mapping are you turning off Active HDR on your TV?
I've not done a WHOLE lot of testing yet, but, in the testing I did yesterday I've found that I get better results with the LG dynamic HDR turned ON. I suspect that's because it's looking at each frame and madvr's output is probably close to what it would change. I don't really know and this is just a guess. But to me, it definitely looks better with the dynamic HDR turned on.
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Old 30th September 2018, 21:17   #52885  |  Link
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Yeah I've found Active HDR to be very effective so I wouldn't want to lose that in order to use MadVR's tone mapping. I'll be honest though, I've gone backwards and forwards between MadVR tone mapping at 700nits (with highlight recovery set to medium...I have no idea what this should be set to), and straight passthru, and I can't see any difference...ok MadVR tone mapping is ever so slightly darker (I guess I can increase target nits to make brighter) but aside from that almost imperceivable difference it looks the same. What are the benefits of MadVR tone mapping vs letting the TV do it (LG C7)
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Old 30th September 2018, 22:01   #52886  |  Link
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If you're going to tone map while in HDR mode, medium highlight recovery is probably not strong enough. Try the Are you nuts?! setting and see if that makes a difference for you. The tone mapping option was originally designed (I believe) with projectors in mind that don't necessarily have native HDR capability. The idea would be to tone map HDR to SDR. On OLED, we have trouble getting high enough brightness in SDR mode so we have to try to see if it works for us in HDR mode if we want to keep the brightness. If the difference in the TV's tone mapping vs madvr isn't perceptible to you there may not be a benefit in using the option. Try 800 nits and see what you think with a stronger highlight recovery. Also know that this is a work in progress and that it's being worked on by madshi between each version. So this option will get better with time. I already prefer it with my setup to pass-through as I can definitely see a difference.
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Last edited by SamuriHL; 30th September 2018 at 22:03.
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Old 30th September 2018, 22:14   #52887  |  Link
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It boggles my mind that there isn't a standard EDID format to report max nits, so that having to guess-and-check constantly wouldn't be necessary.
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Old 30th September 2018, 22:42   #52888  |  Link
huhn
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the max nits it pretty much a lie anyway. 2% 4 % 50 % max nit...
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Old 30th September 2018, 22:51   #52889  |  Link
madshi
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jerryleungwh View Post
Maybe I should try with 750 nit next time and see how does it differ from passthrough. Though, at first glance it seems to me that the resulting image in passthrough is brighter than when I set this to 1000, doesn't that mean the screen can actually go over 1000 nits? Though it might just have been the wrong tone mapping by the TV that made the whole area a bit more bright so I though it was " brighter", I can't say for sure yet
I don't know, I can't analyze such things just by reading your descriptions. In any case, the higher you set the target peak nits, when using "output video in HDR format", the more processing is done by the TV and the less by madVR. However, if you set the target peak nits too low, madVR will compress too much. So it's a balance act to find the "best" value.

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Originally Posted by jerryleungwh View Post
@madshi may I also ask does "measure each frame's peak luminance" works kinda like sending dynamic data to the TV, if it's just about how the result looks? Like the tone mapping could be tuned according to what is needed for each frame?
I don't really understand what you're saying. The measurement functionality doesn't report anything to the TV, if that's what you're asking. It just changes madVR's tone mapping curves.

Quote:
Originally Posted by sat4all View Post
Indeed, it's from nvidia 4xx.xx drivers. the weird thing is that madvr can switch my tv to hdr mode during playback but not madtpg!
Maybe you're using madVR in FSE mode, and madTPG in windowed mode?

Quote:
Originally Posted by waldnebel View Post
I've tried to insert those custom resolution values madVR calculated (first picture) into the CRU tool which you can see in picture 2.

Why is the horizontal front porch not accepted by CRU? It's red and the OK button is greyed out. It looks like madVR and the GPU driver doesn't have any problem with that front porch value. There wasn't any error message obviously.
Why are you asking this question here? Shouldn't you ask the CRU developers about it? I don't kow the answer. Maybe CRU requires the front porch to be divisible by a certain factor (like 16 or 8 or something)?

Quote:
Originally Posted by iSeries View Post
I'll be honest though, I've gone backwards and forwards between MadVR tone mapping at 700nits (with highlight recovery set to medium...I have no idea what this should be set to), and straight passthru, and I can't see any difference...ok MadVR tone mapping is ever so slightly darker (I guess I can increase target nits to make brighter) but aside from that almost imperceivable difference it looks the same. What are the benefits of MadVR tone mapping vs letting the TV do it (LG C7)
The higher you set the target peak nits, the more processing is done by the TV. The difference may not be visible in all/many scenes. You may need to know what you're looking for. There could be differences in hue accuracy (color shift or not), in highlight detail, and other things. If you check out the AVSForum thread where we've been discussing all this for months, you'll find some movie scenes and HDR demos we like to use for comparing different tone mapping algorithms.

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Originally Posted by SamuriHL View Post
The tone mapping option was originally designed (I believe) with projectors in mind that don't necessarily have native HDR capability.
Not true.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SamuriHL View Post
On OLED, we have trouble getting high enough brightness in SDR mode
SDR is supposed to have peak white at around 100-200nits. Which is easy for OLED.
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Old 1st October 2018, 01:11   #52890  |  Link
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Well, AMD may be a piece junk for you but in my set up I have perfect 4K and 3D playback with RX-460 on Windows 10.I am using 18.5.1 driver and have not updated to new drivers as I am not having any issues. May I ask what issues you are having or had with AMD? If you are having issues, then I am 100% sure it's your own setup related, and AMD has got nothing to do with it. I am a proud user of AMD for years and it definitely isn't a piece of junk.
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AMD no issue? This is really bull-shit. AMD is a piece of junk.

Last edited by alps006; 1st October 2018 at 01:40.
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Old 1st October 2018, 01:33   #52891  |  Link
SamuriHL
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Originally Posted by madshi View Post
Not true.
Well....that's why I said (I believe). LOL

Quote:
Originally Posted by madshi View Post
SDR is supposed to have peak white at around 100-200nits. Which is easy for OLED.
Ok, fair enough. That is definitely true for SDR.
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Old 1st October 2018, 01:45   #52892  |  Link
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Madshi, that OS API could be buggy or poorly optimized, have you inquired with MS about it? I wonder if 1809 has improved it.

Is there any proper test content one could use to roughly determine optimal peak nits for tone mapping?

Last edited by ryrynz; 1st October 2018 at 04:25.
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Old 1st October 2018, 04:29   #52893  |  Link
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Originally Posted by alps006 View Post
Well, AMD may be a piece junk for you but in my set up I have perfect 4K and 3D playback with RX-460 on Windows 10.I am using 18.5.1 driver and have not updated to new drivers as I am not having any issues. May I ask what issues you are having or had with AMD? If you are having issues, then I am 100% sure it's your own setup related, and AMD has got nothing to do with it. I am a proud user of AMD for years and it definitely isn't a piece of junk.
Same here
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Old 1st October 2018, 04:39   #52894  |  Link
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Please don't quote entire posts for two word replies. We know most AMD users are satisfied with their setups.
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Old 1st October 2018, 05:27   #52895  |  Link
mkohman
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Hi Guys,

Please forgive me if this has already been covered in a previous post but I need advice in some of MadVR features involving those who have a 2.39:1 scope screen with a projector.

I have recently changed my 16.9 setup to a 2.39:1 setup and built a new screen. Most of my movies (99%) that I watch on this setup are wide screen format and I use my JVC projector to zoom the top and bottom black bars away and fill the screen with the movie.

I notice that madVR has functions that may assistance with this setup under screen config and zoom control... Can someone with a similar setup who are using these features or someone who knows about these features and believe this may be helpful please assist me and give me some tips...

Also there is apparently a way to overcome the multi format movies (ie Nolan movies) what is the setting for that please?

Thanks I advance for all your help..

Sent from my moto g(6) using Tapatalk
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Old 1st October 2018, 08:02   #52896  |  Link
sat4all
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Maybe you're using madVR in FSE mode, and madTPG in windowed mode?
i'm using windowed mode with both. Another strange thing with nvidia 4xx.xx drivers, HDR passthrough work fine with mpc-be but not with kodi dsplayer and yet both in windowed mode.
Anyway back to 39x.xx and everything is working as it should.
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Old 1st October 2018, 08:36   #52897  |  Link
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I don't really understand what you're saying. The measurement functionality doesn't report anything to the TV, if that's what you're asking. It just changes madVR's tone mapping curves.
Oh sorry for not being very clear about it. I was just wondering, because the mapping curves are changed each frame accordingly, would it work like some HDR formats with dynamic metadata like Dolby Vision or HDR+?

Also, I just tested with passthrough and tone mapping with target peak nit at 800 in HDR mode and I noticed some of the bright lines could result in haloing while in passthrough, while tone mapping doesn't and seems to produce a more detailed image, but is also slightly dimmer than passthrough. I personally prefer tone mapping but I'll read more comments here to see what everyone else thinks before I settle down on the settings.

Correct me if I'm wrong but highlight recovery seems to be quite GPU intensive and more so on higher levels? I want to try the "are you nuts" setting because some other users here suggest it might work well in HDR tone mapping mode but with NGU sharp chroma upscaling and tone mapping together it's a bit too much for my gtx 1060 even when overclocked at +170 MHz core clock and +179 MHz memory clock
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Old 1st October 2018, 09:28   #52898  |  Link
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Sacrifice the chroma, it doesn't make that big a difference most times anyway, go to medium or low, doubt you'll notice the difference.. Personally I'd go NGU AA over sharp for chroma but your choice.
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Old 1st October 2018, 10:06   #52899  |  Link
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If you are having issues, ...
Hi, out of interest, have you moved to 1803 yet, i've been putting this off for fear of problems, there has been much said about AMD card and 1803 on here with MADVR.
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Old 1st October 2018, 11:24   #52900  |  Link
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Do we have any update on which Nvidia driver works best for custom resolution in Windows 10?
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