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Old 14th October 2017, 21:25   #46541  |  Link
rivera
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Razoola View Post
2) In the madVR custom resolution options, select the predefined 23Hz refresh rate in the list and click edit (that is your case).
3) Click 'test mode'.
4) The monitor will set the new resolution, confirm that you see it. If its fine click save.
5) Reboot PC
Negative:
1. Open madVR settings, go to "custom modes":

2. This 23Hz mode is displayed as "missing", although some 23Hz mode can be selected in Nvidia Control Panel.
3. If I open this 23Hz mode in this window and then press "Apply" in a corresponding dialog window, messagebox "The GPU rejected this mode, for unknown reasons" is displayed.
Tried with and w/o "D3D hack to use 24Hz and 60Hz" - same messagebox.
So, Nvidia Control Panel allows to select some mode with 23 Hz, but madVR does not.

One more mystery:
1. 59Hz mode is also present in Nvidia Control Panel, but is "missing" in "custom modes" window.
2. Open this mode, then press "Apply" button.
3. A message "the mode was successfully added" pops up.
4. But even after restarting the Windows this 59Hz mode is still "missing".

And there is one more mystery - 50Hz mode is always marked as "active", regardless of the actually selected mode in Nvidia Control Panel.
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Last edited by rivera; 14th October 2017 at 21:46.
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Old 14th October 2017, 23:42   #46542  |  Link
Q-the-STORM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by madshi View Post

So does the tweaked madHcCtrl.exe which I made available a couple posts ago fix the probem?
Just did some more testing with 0.92.6 and tweaked madHcCtrl.exe and it seems to work now, I'm posting my steps that got it working, so people with a nvidia card can easily replicate, though I'm doing this by memory, so I might miss something.
(So you don't have to find my original posts: I'm using gtx 1080 ti, windonw 10 pro x64, MPC-HC x64 and my original problem was since I have standard modes for 23 and 24Hz, I couldn't create a custom mode inside madVR and also couldn't edit the existing modes. With the tweaked madHcCtrl.exe, editing is possible now)


At the end some notes for madshi


- I deleted my custom resolutions, so I'm back to zero.

- Went into nvidia control panel, changed into 2160p30, full RGB and 12bit.

- Opened a 23.976fps video, went into madVRs custom modes tab and clicked on the 2160p resolution with 23Hz (listed as standard mode) and clicked on edit

- increased pixel clock by 0.01 mhz and clicked on test mode and clicked on Yes to save the custom mode.

- the 23hz mode is now listed as "custom timings"

- clicked on reset GPU

- closed MPC-HC, reopened the video.

- opened nvidia control panel and switched to my new custom mode (Note that in nvidia control panel the new custom mode is for 24Hz, not 23Hz for some reason)

- checked custom modes tab in madVR to see that the custom timings 23Hz mode is selected as active, which it is and clicked on optimize

- closed all menus and played the file for over 10min.

- in custom modes tab in madVR, I clicked on "optimize", there I selected "optimized pixel clock #1" (which was the first option that had no frame drops.) and clicked on test mode, then on Yes.

- played the file again and checked stats

- in the first 10 sec "1 frame repeat" climbs to 2 hours, in the next 30 secs it climbs to about 4-6hours and eventually stablizes at about 9.0X hours

This is again only for windowed fullscreen, with FSE I get the same output as standard 23 and 24Hz modes in FSE.

---------------

Notes for madshi: (probably all nvidia bugs)
1.
When I was switching around resolutions, trying things out I noticed that sometimes when I switch to the custom resolution and open nvidias control panel, in the "Resolution" section, it didn't show a custom resolution, but a new resolution at the bottom...

To make it more clear: there are normally 2 sections in the "Resolutions" list in the control panel, "Ultra HD, HD, SD" with a bunch of resolutions and under that "PC" with a few more resolutions, going up to 1280x1024. If you have a custom resolution there is a new section on Top "Custom", Making it 3 sections total.

*Sometimes* there is no "Custom" section, but the resolution created by madVR shows up at the top of the "PC" section with a new entry "3840x2160". When I switch to another resolution, the resolution under "PC" disappears and the "Custom" Section reappears.
Couldn't really see a pattern, also don't really want to test things here, since it works and doesn't seem to be an issue.

2.
When I was trying optimized pixel clocks, or other standard timings like "CVT Reduced Blanking v1" etc. I was always getting a black screen when I was in 8bit. I tried about 10 different modes, none worked. Then I went to nvidia control panel, switched to 12bit, then the timings suddenly worked. (this could obviously be caused by my TV or my AVR simply allowing more custom modes in 10/12bit)

Interesting thing is though, when I'm in my custom mode, nvidias control panel doesn't have an output color depth selected

https://i.snag.gy/7w9TKV.jpg

the field is empty and only 8bpc is available to choose

This is standard behaviour if you switch to a mode that doesn't have 10/12bit available, like when you switch from 30Hz 12bit to 60Hz, the field will be empty and only 8bit will be available to choose. The difference is, when I'm switching to 60Hz, I'm actually switching to 8bit, but when I switch from 30Hz 12bit to my custom resolution, I stay in 12bit, even though it's not available to choose afterwards. Confirmed visually with the 16bit gradient png with no dithering + the app for my AVR shows "RGB Full / 36bit" which is the 12bit mode, 8bit mode would show 24bit.
If I'm in my custom resolution and try to change bitdepth from "empty" to 8 bit, I get a black screen again. So I'm definitely in 12bit here (right?)

3.
Can you make it possible to change the "nvidia color settings" (output color depth, output color format and output dynamic range) inside madVRs custom modes tab? That way all settings are available from inside madVR. With all the bugs nvidia brings, I kind of trust madVR more than I do nvidia's control panel.


-----------------

After all this writing I actually don't remember if there were any other things I wanted to point out, so it's those 3 things for now. Like I mentioned, probably just nvidia bugs, but those might be interesting to know, if you didn't know them already. Since I got 12bit and 9 hours without drops, I'm done with testing for now, unless you have something specific for me to test.

Last edited by Q-the-STORM; 14th October 2017 at 23:50.
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Old 15th October 2017, 01:26   #46543  |  Link
famasfilms
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I just installed Fall Creators Update and now HDR is acting differently.

I have HDR off on Windows and madvr on HDR passthrough.

Before the update madvr would turn on HDR mode and turn it off after playback.

Following the update it seems that windows HDR mode is also being activated, this can lead to a washed out effect. After playback then windows HDR stays on

I haven't played around with it too much as it's late
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Old 15th October 2017, 01:57   #46544  |  Link
austinminton
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Quote:
Originally Posted by madshi View Post
madVR saying P010, 10bit, 4:2:0 is what the decoder delivers to madVR, it has no consequence of what is sent to the GPU.

HDMI 2.0 can't do 4Kp60 RGB with more than 8bit. So even if you tell the GPU *and* madVR to output 10bit RGB at 4Kp60, it won't happen. Someone somewhere will have to drop it down to 8bit. Probably it will be the GPU driver, and I'm not sure they'll apply proper dithering. So it's better if you take care of this yourself, e.g. by using profiles.

My recommendation is to always output RGB. 10bit is nice if your TV fully supports it (and benefits from it), otherwise 8bit is just fine, too, even for HDR content, thanks to madVR's high quality dither.
Thanks madshi. I have read through your initial posts here for RGB and YCbCr and I understand why RGB is important. Has anything changed at all over the years with more focus of windows on hdr and wide color gamut? Still no apis to work with YCbCr data and avoid the conversion to RGB?

I have finally figured out how to see the final output of the gpu, and its 4k@60, RGB 8-bit. Definitely its the GPU converting it to 8-bit. If I get your suggestion correctly, I should create a new profile for 4k@60 videos to set the panel bit-depth at 8-bit instead? That should take away the GPUs 10bit to 8bit conversion and let madvr do it instead. I definitely prefer madvr handling any conversions over the gpu.

On a side note I use the 12bit trick mentioned earlier here and manage to get 12bit RGB for all other resolutions, including 4k@23 UHD. I am hoping in this case the gpu is just padding data to 12 bits.

Yes my TV is a native 10-bit panel.

Last edited by austinminton; 15th October 2017 at 02:18.
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Old 15th October 2017, 06:21   #46545  |  Link
Mark Regalo
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madVR has a black screen within MPC-HC when playback is restarted from pause after hibernation wakeup. Audio works and timebar progresses but the video remains black even after resizing.
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Old 15th October 2017, 08:34   #46546  |  Link
j82k
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Quote:
Originally Posted by famasfilms View Post
I just installed Fall Creators Update and now HDR is acting differently.

I have HDR off on Windows and madvr on HDR passthrough.

Before the update madvr would turn on HDR mode and turn it off after playback.

Following the update it seems that windows HDR mode is also being activated, this can lead to a washed out effect. After playback then windows HDR stays on

I haven't played around with it too much as it's late
Are you sure it's the Fall Creators Update doing this? Because the latest nvidia driver 387.92 is causing exactly what you just described, even without the Fall Creators Update.

Last edited by j82k; 15th October 2017 at 08:46.
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Old 15th October 2017, 08:46   #46547  |  Link
j82k
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As for 8-bit vs 10-bit vs 12-bit.
I have a LG 55C6V TV which is supposed to have a 10-bit panel and I tried this 10-bit test pattern to compare:
https://yadi.sk/d/RPrX2C7l3HEjPq/03....2010bit%20test

I'm actually getting the best gradient using full RGB 8-bit output. Not sure why this is. Either my TV is crap or nvidia isn't outputting 10 and 12 bit correctly.

Last edited by j82k; 15th October 2017 at 08:52.
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Old 15th October 2017, 09:02   #46548  |  Link
oldpainlesskodi
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Quote:
Originally Posted by famasfilms View Post
I just installed Fall Creators Update and now HDR is acting differently.

I have HDR off on Windows and madvr on HDR passthrough.

Before the update madvr would turn on HDR mode and turn it off after playback.

Following the update it seems that windows HDR mode is also being activated, this can lead to a washed out effect. After playback then windows HDR stays on

I haven't played around with it too much as it's late
If you are using an Nvidia card, try driver 385.41 (works here with the fall update, although FSE seems to be broken - I think Madshi mentioned a while ago that MS or Nvidia were dropping FSE),

K

Last edited by oldpainlesskodi; 15th October 2017 at 09:08.
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Old 15th October 2017, 10:39   #46549  |  Link
madshi
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Quote:
Originally Posted by omw2h View Post
my bad, sorry.

original (no scaling or refinement)
https://postimg.org/image/l5iw5ujtr/
no upscaling refinement
https://postimg.org/image/ksrhzcolr/
only thined edges
https://postimg.org/image/y9ogi8ecv/
previous AS +te
https://postimg.org/image/ix04at5cf/
new AS +te
https://postimg.org/image/3oa6x1r3j/
I've just looked into this. Unfortunately your images are useless because of JPEG compression artifacts. Sorry to be harsh, but there's nothing else I can say about your images. The JPEG compression artifacts are much bigger than any difference between the old and new AS version. Please *ALWAYS* use PNG for screenshots.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ashlar42 View Post
I simply needed to reboot instead of resetting GPU. Maybe it might be worth it to point out in the guide that resetting, in some cases, simply doesn't do anything.
Resetting the GPU worked well in my tests with AMD/Intel. Unfortunately my Nvidia GPU driver refuses to accept any custom modes ever. So I can't really fully test Nvidia atm.

I'll add a note that resetting the GPU might not be sufficient in some cases and a reboot might be necessary instead.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Razoola View Post
I know this was brought up years ago (I think it was leeperry who did) but have you any plans to add customisable enhancements to madVR in relation to 'near black' processing?
Maybe at some point in the future, but not soon. Too many other things to do.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ashlar42 View Post
And now I get the "GPU driver rejected mode for unknown reasons" for 59Hz too...
GPU driver bug.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mzso View Post
I don't know. You asked for a debug log here. And I provided it here.

But I've been getting hang with madVR for ages and complained a few times here. Also did to the PP dev and the progDVB dev.
Looking at your first log, I can see that playback starts with "Oldboy", and seems to be running ok for about 2 seconds. Then playback switches to "John Wick", but before playback can even start properly, it switches back to "Oldboy", and then to "Cube". After it switched to "Cube", the decoder doesn't send any more video frames to madVR, for some reason.

Log 2 tries to play "John Wick", but the decoder never even sends a single frame.

A couple of questions:

1) Is the media player frozen, or is the media player GUI still responsive?
2) Does the madVR OSD (Ctrl+J) still work? If so, I suppose the decoder queue is empty in these situations, right?
3) Do you have the option "delay playback start until render queue is full" activated? If so, does deactivating that option help?

Quote:
Originally Posted by MuriKha View Post
i was wondering what is the optimal setting for my configuration.

Specs:
i7 4770k @4.2Ghz
Zotac GTX 1070 amp extreme SLI
16gb ram

I am using potplayer with lav filters.
I specifically want to know about how much important the artifact removal, image enhancements settings are and when i should use them?
If there were a clear cut answer, madVR would auto select all those settings for you. But there is not. Artifact removal is useful/important if the video file you're playing has artifacts in them. Otherwise it's not important. Image enhancements are useful if the video file you're playing is overly soft. Some users like to have debanding enabled at all times at a low strength, it usually doesn't harm too much, but often helps a bit. Some users like things extremely sharp, so they may have image enhancements enabled at all times. But since these things also depend on the video you're playing, and on your taste, there's not a simple recommendation I can make for you.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Neo-XP View Post
Sure, I did a test here some time ago : https://forum.doom9.org/showthread.p...53#post1789253

I will try to find more.
Thanks, that's helpful.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Razoola View Post
As far as nvidia is concerned I think the only change needed now to custom resolutions is for madVR to check the current refresh rate at the point the user presses the 'test mode' button (on either first adding or on optimise). If the display is already using the refresh rate to be altered madVR should either;

1) Automatically first change the current refresh rate to something other than the refresh rate setting to be tested.

2) Tell the user that madVR first needs to change the current display refresh rate which then happens after the user presses ok.

3) Stop with an error telling the user to first change the current refresh rate to something else.
I had thought about this, but testing actually still works, so should I really reject testing already in this situation?

Quote:
Originally Posted by valdeski View Post
I did some testing, all madvr settings to default but D3D11 fullscreen windowed on a second monitor. I deleted the settings.bin and reset the settings every time just in case.
v0.92.02
DXVA2(Copy-Back) No issues.
D3D11 Automatic (Native) sometimes freezes for 2 or 3 seconds but no actual crashes and playback resumes like usual.
D3D11 cb direct(Hardware Device selected) No issues.

v0.92.03
DXVA2(Copy-Back) No issues.
D3D11 Automatic (Native) Crashes, no error messages, MPC-HC freezes and CPU usage goes crazy.
D3D11 cb direct(Hardware Device selected) No issues.

v0.92.06
DXVA2(Copy-Back) No issues.
D3D11 Automatic (Native) Crashes, no error messages, MPC-HC freezes and CPU usage goes crazy, sometimes behaves similar to v0.92.02 with 2-3 second freezes and playback continues.
D3D11 cb direct(Hardware Device selected) No issues.

All of the above happens when launching a game or when closing the game or going from in-game fullscreen to windowed and vise versa, if you manage to get in-game without MPC-HC crashing then you're not very likely to encounter issues unless you do try to go into windowed mode or encounter a loading screen.
Some files seem to be more susceptible to crashing but it's not an issue of only happening with "x" specific file or "x" specific game.
GPU is Nvidia GTX 970, driver 385.69. Game was Battlefield 4 Fullscreen exclusive(it happens in other games too).
Ok, thanks. I do have on my to do list to revisit D3D11 native decoder handling. I don't think I can find a quick fix for this right now, I'll have to modify the whole logic, unfortunately, which costs some time...

Quote:
Originally Posted by PurpleMan View Post
I'm not whether or not this has been previously reported or nobody noticed, but I see 2 very annoying issue with the "move subtitles to the bottom of the screen" feature (which as you know is extremely useful for 2.35:1 movies).

(I can't comment on whether it was okay in previous versions as I only now started using madVR with XYsubfilter).

Issue 1 - It seems that every subtitle is displayed in a slightly different horizontal position (more than a few pixels up or down).

Issue 2 - Unrelated to issue 1, which happens regardless, I think you're treating the subtitle as an image and just move it down not accounting for actual text or characters. A little complicated to explain, but I'll try -

Consider the following different subpictures:

SUB 1 - aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa

SUB 2 - aaaaaaaaaaapaaaaaaaaaaq

Because the lowest pixel in SUB1 is at the bottom part of the 'a' character, it will align the entire text in a certain horizontal position.

On SUB2, the lowest point is at the bottom of the 'q' and 'p' characters, and it will align the entire text based on that, so that the rest of the characters ('a' characters) are in a different position on SUB2 than they were in SUB1.

I know this example makes it seem as if it's a rare case, but in some languages, and even in English - this is EXTREMELY noticeable and as subtitles changing fast it make it seem that the entire sub picture stream is just moving up and down between subs.

Issue 3 - Some sub pictures are 1 line while others are 2 lines. When rendering subtitles, there's a fixed virtual position for each line (row 1 and row 2), so if you have just 1 line it's displayed on row 2 (the lower row) and if you have 2 of them they're displayed on both rows. What I'm seeing is that if there's a single line, it's actually displayed in a third location seemingly in between row 1 and row 2.

I couldn't find a better way to describe this, so let me know if you want me to include some screenshots to clarify. What I can tell you is that if you turn off the 'move subtitles to bottom' feature in madVR, while the subtitles are then rendered on the video itself instead of the black bars area, the positioning is perfect and you don't have any of the above issues, thus eliminating xysubfilter as the cause for this.

Thanks for all your hard work, much appreciated!
First of all, are we talking about bitmap type subtitles (VOBSUB, SUP, Blu-Ray m2ts included subs etc)? Or are we talking about text type subtitles (SRT, ASS, etc)? Can you please also test "the other type" to see if those are also affected?

Finally, a small video sample which shows all these problems you mentioned would be helpful. Or if it's hard to find one sample which reproduces all these problems, then I'm also fine with multiple smaller video samples, one for each problem.

Quote:
Originally Posted by rivera View Post
Negative:
1. Open madVR settings, go to "custom modes":

2. This 23Hz mode is displayed as "missing", although some 23Hz mode can be selected in Nvidia Control Panel.
3. If I open this 23Hz mode in this window and then press "Apply" in a corresponding dialog window, messagebox "The GPU rejected this mode, for unknown reasons" is displayed.
Attachments don't work in this forum, unfortunately.

The "The GPU rejected this mode" is unfortunately a GPU driver bug, not much I can do about it. I've already reported it to Nvidia, a fix might be coming at some point in the future, but probably not very soon.

Quote:
Originally Posted by rivera View Post
One more mystery:
1. 59Hz mode is also present in Nvidia Control Panel, but is "missing" in "custom modes" window.
2. Open this mode, then press "Apply" button.
3. A message "the mode was successfully added" pops up.
4. But even after restarting the Windows this 59Hz mode is still "missing".

And there is one more mystery - 50Hz mode is always marked as "active", regardless of the actually selected mode in Nvidia Control Panel.
50Hz mode being always marked as "active" seems *very* strange, no other user has reported this before. What happens if you change refresh rates through the OS display control panel instead of using the Nvidia control panel?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Q-the-STORM View Post
1.
When I was switching around resolutions, trying things out I noticed that sometimes when I switch to the custom resolution and open nvidias control panel, in the "Resolution" section, it didn't show a custom resolution, but a new resolution at the bottom...

To make it more clear: there are normally 2 sections in the "Resolutions" list in the control panel, "Ultra HD, HD, SD" with a bunch of resolutions and under that "PC" with a few more resolutions, going up to 1280x1024. If you have a custom resolution there is a new section on Top "Custom", Making it 3 sections total.

*Sometimes* there is no "Custom" section, but the resolution created by madVR shows up at the top of the "PC" section with a new entry "3840x2160". When I switch to another resolution, the resolution under "PC" disappears and the "Custom" Section reappears.
Couldn't really see a pattern, also don't really want to test things here, since it works and doesn't seem to be an issue.

2.
When I was trying optimized pixel clocks, or other standard timings like "CVT Reduced Blanking v1" etc. I was always getting a black screen when I was in 8bit. I tried about 10 different modes, none worked. Then I went to nvidia control panel, switched to 12bit, then the timings suddenly worked. (this could obviously be caused by my TV or my AVR simply allowing more custom modes in 10/12bit)

Interesting thing is though, when I'm in my custom mode, nvidias control panel doesn't have an output color depth selected

https://i.snag.gy/7w9TKV.jpg

the field is empty and only 8bpc is available to choose

This is standard behaviour if you switch to a mode that doesn't have 10/12bit available, like when you switch from 30Hz 12bit to 60Hz, the field will be empty and only 8bit will be available to choose. The difference is, when I'm switching to 60Hz, I'm actually switching to 8bit, but when I switch from 30Hz 12bit to my custom resolution, I stay in 12bit, even though it's not available to choose afterwards. Confirmed visually with the 16bit gradient png with no dithering + the app for my AVR shows "RGB Full / 36bit" which is the 12bit mode, 8bit mode would show 24bit.
If I'm in my custom resolution and try to change bitdepth from "empty" to 8 bit, I get a black screen again. So I'm definitely in 12bit here (right?)
Interesting. Don't know what to say about it. Seems like the Nvidia GPU driver has a lot of annoying bugs in this area.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Q-the-STORM View Post
3.
Can you make it possible to change the "nvidia color settings" (output color depth, output color format and output dynamic range) inside madVRs custom modes tab? That way all settings are available from inside madVR. With all the bugs nvidia brings, I kind of trust madVR more than I do nvidia's control panel.
Many things are possible, but I'm not going to replicate all of Nvidia's GPU control panel into madVR just because Nvidia's driver is buggy. I don't have the time for that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by austinminton View Post
Has anything changed
No.

Quote:
Originally Posted by austinminton View Post
I have finally figured out how to see the final output of the gpu, and its 4k@60, RGB 8-bit. Definitely its the GPU converting it to 8-bit. If I get your suggestion correctly, I should create a new profile for 4k@60 videos to set the panel bit-depth at 8-bit instead? That should take away the GPUs 10bit to 8bit conversion and let madvr do it instead. I definitely prefer madvr handling any conversions over the gpu.

On a side note I use the 12bit trick mentioned earlier here and manage to get 12bit RGB for all other resolutions, including 4k@23 UHD. I am hoping in this case the gpu is just padding data to 12 bits.

Yes my TV is a native 10-bit panel.
It's still worth checking if 10bit output actually looks better than 8bit output at all. See j82k's post.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark Regalo View Post
madVR has a black screen within MPC-HC when playback is restarted from pause after hibernation wakeup. Audio works and timebar progresses but the video remains black even after resizing.
Hmmm... Could be a bug in madVR, but it doesn't seem very important to me right now, so it's very low priority.

Quote:
Originally Posted by j82k View Post
As for 8-bit vs 10-bit vs 12-bit.
I have a LG 55C6V TV which is supposed to have a 10-bit panel and I tried this 10-bit test pattern to compare:
https://yadi.sk/d/RPrX2C7l3HEjPq/03....2010bit%20test

I'm actually getting the best gradient using full RGB 8-bit output. Not sure why this is. Either my TV is crap or nvidia isn't outputting 10 and 12 bit correctly.
It's not all that surprising. Many TVs internally dither 10/12bit down to 8bit (or even 6bit) and madVR's dithering quality is probably better than what those displays are doing. So if you get best quality by using madVR's 8bit output, then use that, and don't worry too much about it.
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Old 15th October 2017, 11:23   #46550  |  Link
ashlar42
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Anyway, I'm up to "no drops/repeats" for 23.976, 50 and 59.94Hz. I have perfect timings for 50 out of the box, I had 1 drop every 2 days before in CRU, through madVR I optimized it perfectly, I optimized 59.94 in madVR too. Then I removed everything and I inserted the calculated values in CRU. Which worked with 59.94.

I'd say I'm 99% there.

As a side note... I've been an Nvidia HTPC user for more than 10 years. The mess that they had back then and the mess that they still have today concerning custom resolutions is beyond belief.

For the life of me I can't understand how a multi-billion company can neglect a portion of its control panel for so long.

Last edited by ashlar42; 15th October 2017 at 11:27.
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Old 15th October 2017, 12:00   #46551  |  Link
austinminton
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Quote:
Originally Posted by j82k View Post
I'm actually getting the best gradient using full RGB 8-bit output. Not sure why this is. Either my TV is crap or nvidia isn't outputting 10 and 12 bit correctly.
Thanks for the reply. Just to confirm your test setup. You keep madvr at 10-bit or higher, and set nvidia bit depth for 8 bit and 12 bit (keeping rgb full). You play one of the 10 bit, but <60hz files. And the best gradient you see is in 8 bit rgb full.

I prefer the gradient when I set 12 bit on nvidia in the above testing scenario. The file I have tested on is 4k@23. I am keeping RGB full.

I also compared madvr 8-bit over nvidia for 4k@60. I honestly can't really tell the difference.
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Old 15th October 2017, 12:16   #46552  |  Link
omw2h
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Quote:
Originally Posted by madshi View Post
I've just looked into this. Unfortunately your images are useless because of JPEG compression artifacts. Sorry to be harsh, but there's nothing else I can say about your images. The JPEG compression artifacts are much bigger than any difference between the old and new AS version. Please *ALWAYS* use PNG for screenshots.
i'll do that from now on. Here's the comparison i should have posted. The grain and a bit of aliased edges are standing out for me. If that's tweaked i'm all aboard the new AS.

no processing
https://postimg.org/image/j79imzhv3/
upscale + olsAS
https://postimg.org/image/5dl5xz7a7/
upscale + newAS
https://postimg.org/image/rcrkl7b9r/
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Old 15th October 2017, 12:23   #46553  |  Link
mzso
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Quote:
Originally Posted by madshi View Post
Looking at your first log, I can see that playback starts with "Oldboy", and seems to be running ok for about 2 seconds. Then playback switches to "John Wick", but before playback can even start properly, it switches back to "Oldboy", and then to "Cube". After it switched to "Cube", the decoder doesn't send any more video frames to madVR, for some reason.

Log 2 tries to play "John Wick", but the decoder never even sends a single frame.

A couple of questions:

1) Is the media player frozen, or is the media player GUI still responsive?
2) Does the madVR OSD (Ctrl+J) still work? If so, I suppose the decoder queue is empty in these situations, right?
3) Do you have the optionactivated? If so, does deactivating that option help?
The GUI is totally frozen. I see some info updating on the madVR OSD: display frequency, max stats.
All the cues are empty. Also the line that shows the video file's resolutions is weird. It has an arrow in it like the scale line and doesn't start with "movie".

I have "delay playback start until render queue is full" disabled because it increases seek or playback start times which I didn't like.



Normal GUI/OSD appearance:

Last edited by mzso; 15th October 2017 at 12:48.
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Old 15th October 2017, 12:35   #46554  |  Link
Razoola
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Q-the-STORM View Post
Interesting thing is though, when I'm in my custom mode, nvidias control panel doesn't have an output color depth selected

https://i.snag.gy/7w9TKV.jpg

the field is empty and only 8bpc is available to choose

This is standard behaviour if you switch to a mode that doesn't have 10/12bit available, like when you switch from 30Hz 12bit to 60Hz, the field will be empty and only 8bit will be available to choose. The difference is, when I'm switching to 60Hz, I'm actually switching to 8bit, but when I switch from 30Hz 12bit to my custom resolution, I stay in 12bit, even though it's not available to choose afterwards. Confirmed visually with the 16bit gradient png with no dithering + the app for my AVR shows "RGB Full / 36bit" which is the 12bit mode, 8bit mode would show 24bit.
If I'm in my custom resolution and try to change bitdepth from "empty" to 8 bit, I get a black screen again. So I'm definitely in 12bit here (right?)
I see the samw here but I think this is a nvidia control panel bug, my avr also shows 12bit while its blanked out in control panel.
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Old 15th October 2017, 12:38   #46555  |  Link
Razoola
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Originally Posted by j82k View Post
Are you sure it's the Fall Creators Update doing this? Because the latest nvidia driver 387.92 is causing exactly what you just described, even without the Fall Creators Update.
I second this. I was gonna bring it up later in this forum as I had a situation also yesturday for the first time that HDR did not switch off after video playback, It only happened after I installed the latest drivers.

I think its nvidia driver related and not madVR or windows..
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Old 15th October 2017, 12:46   #46556  |  Link
madshi
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ashlar42 View Post
Anyway, I'm up to "no drops/repeats" for 23.976, 50 and 59.94Hz. I have perfect timings for 50 out of the box, I had 1 drop every 2 days before in CRU, through madVR I optimized it perfectly, I optimized 59.94 in madVR too. Then I removed everything and I inserted the calculated values in CRU. Which worked with 59.94.

I'd say I'm 99% there.

As a side note... I've been an Nvidia HTPC user for more than 10 years. The mess that they had back then and the mess that they still have today concerning custom resolutions is beyond belief.

For the life of me I can't understand how a multi-billion company can neglect a portion of its control panel for so long.
Yeah, it's disappointing, but I hope to be able to get them to fix the most obvious bugs at some point in the future.

Quote:
Originally Posted by austinminton View Post
Thanks for the reply. Just to confirm your test setup. You keep madvr at 10-bit or higher
No, I believe he set everything to 8bit everywhere. If you set madVR to 10bit, then madVR will not dither down to 8bit, which is necessary if your TV doesn't handle 10bit well.

Quote:
Originally Posted by omw2h View Post
i'll do that from now on. Here's the comparison i should have posted. The grain and a bit of aliased edges are standing out for me. If that's tweaked i'm all aboard the new AS.

no processing
https://postimg.org/image/j79imzhv3/
upscale + olsAS
https://postimg.org/image/5dl5xz7a7/
upscale + newAS
https://postimg.org/image/rcrkl7b9r/
Ok, igv updated AdaptiveSharpen again yesterday. His latest version doesn't sharpen grain as much, anymore, but still more than the original AS version. If you don't like the grain, why don't you use "reduce random noise" in madVR? Also, your original image is quite visibly distorted by compression artifacts. Seems not all of them originated from JPEG, but some were already in your original video. The new "reduce compression artifacts" option works pretty well for this kind of problem. Here's how your image looks like with the following settings, using igv's latest AdaptiveSharpen version:

reduce compression artifacts: 5
reduce random noise: 1

http://madVR.com/doom9/stuff/asRnnRca.png

Maybe I've gone a bit overboard with the "reduce compression artifacts" strength, but with Anime content high values often barely harm.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mzso View Post
The GUI is totally frozen. I see some info updating on the madVR OSD: display frequency, max stats.
All the cues are empty. Also the line that shows the video file's resolutions is weird. It has an arrow in it like the scale line and doesn't start with "movie".

I have "delay playback start until render queue is full" disabled because it increases seek or playback start times which I didn't like.
As you can see in the image, the decoder queue is empty. It's hard for me to say why. There appears to be a deadlock somewhere. It could be madVR's fault, but it could also be a complex deadlock problem where all madVR, media player and LAV are somehow involved.

Have you tried other media players like e.g. MPC-HC/BE? Does the problem occur with those, too? I'm not asking to make you switch, just trying to collect information.
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Old 15th October 2017, 12:52   #46557  |  Link
mzso
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Quote:
Originally Posted by madshi View Post
As you can see in the image, the decoder queue is empty. It's hard for me to say why. There appears to be a deadlock somewhere. It could be madVR's fault, but it could also be a complex deadlock problem where all madVR, media player and LAV are somehow involved.

Have you tried other media players like e.g. MPC-HC/BE? Does the problem occur with those, too? I'm not asking to make you switch, just trying to collect information.
Not really. I'll try to reproduce a hang in one of them.
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Old 15th October 2017, 13:05   #46558  |  Link
Razoola
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Originally Posted by madshi View Post
I had thought about this, but testing actually still works, so should I really reject testing already in this situation?
Its a hard one because I have had situation with 095.6.1 where it would not allow to test when trying to optimise because the display was already at the custom resolution. another time it allows the test but rejected the save. Only when the starting refresh rate was different before the initial testing process did the all seem to complete without error.

Personally from the experiances I have had so far I think you should confirm the resolution and refresh rate is different than the resolution and refresh rate to be tested at the point the 'test mode' is pressesd. This might only apply to nvidia gfx cards. Wether you switch resolutions first silently, give a message and then switch resolutions or full error telling user to change resolution manually is up to you.

I guess what makes the situation worse here is the fact there is a high probability the resolution/refresh rate will be the same already during a user trying to setup a custom resolution or optimise. This is because they are probably going to the madVR custom resolution options right from a paused movie which is playing at the refresh rate they want to play with (because madVR set the closest resolution when playback started).

Last edited by Razoola; 15th October 2017 at 13:11.
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Old 15th October 2017, 13:09   #46559  |  Link
mzso
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Update:
So I could reproduce a hang, but only one with mpc-hc (internal LAV):



I can't reproduce a hang using internal codecs with Potplayer.
(Sadly using the internal codecs is not really an option, because it also enables the craptastic built-in video processing filter...)

Last edited by mzso; 15th October 2017 at 13:12.
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Old 15th October 2017, 13:14   #46560  |  Link
madshi
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mzso View Post
Update:
So I could reproduce a hang, but only one with mpc-hc (internal LAV):

https://abload.de/img/mpc-hang8dakf.png
Good. Now in order to get to the bottom of this, what we need is at least one freeze report, ideally several, but with the "debug symbols" (*.PDB files) in the right folder for both MPC-BE and LAV. This way the freeze report will not only tell us what madVR is doing at the time of the freeze, but also what MPC-BE and LAV are doing. This *may* (or may not) help figuring out what's going on.

PDB debug symbols for LAV are available in the first post of the LAV thread, IIRC, but the debug symbols MUST match the LAV version installed *exactly* otherwise they're doing more harm than good. PDB debug symbols for MPC should be available somewhere, too, not sure where, though.
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