madVR - high quality video renderer (GPU assisted)

[Mikey2]

Originally Posted by madshi

Well, I asked you something very specific, I didn't ask you to test all permutations. Basically, restore your v0.78 options, then set both CPU and GPU queues to 8. Leave all other settings the same. If that doesn't help then I don't know what will. Most other people seem to have no slowdown with v0.79 compared to v0.78, so I don't really know why you do. It's very weird...

I apologize for the confusion on this - I started with your specific test-case without luck and decided to go further on my testing in hopes of helping you out.

Anyway, I have great news to report, .80 solves my problems! - I cannot thank you enough!!!

Even though I have general computer engineering experience, my knowledge on a programatic level of this is somewhat limited. That said, my theory is that the main difference between my system and many others is that I have a very high CPU-speed and decent graphics processing power since my NVidia cards are in SLI, thus allowing me to use my favorite resize algorithms (Chroma:Softcubic-100/Luma:Spline-4tap.) However, SLI does not solve the fact that my 8600GT cards still only have a pathetic 256MB of video-ram. By all rights I should not be able to do this with that little video-memory! I noticed that in .79 the video-ram was pegged in GPU-Z. However, in .80, it is only (heh ) showing 226MB of used video-ram. Perhaps the following fix had something to do with it?:

* fixed: calculation of consumed GPU RAM was wrong

Anyway, I know it sounds like I am gushing, but thank you so much for your time and your effort on this wonderful piece of software. As a software engineer myself I am especially impressed with your dedication to try to solve all of our problems, no matter how ignorant we may be on the problems at-hand.

So once again, I give you my most heartfelt Thank you!

MikeY

[Mikey2]

I have further good news with version .80!

In regards to my post on RGB32 being cut-off at the bottom... (Here is a link to my post so I don't mess-up the thread with more screenshots:

RGB screen clipping problem

)

...You responded:

Originally Posted by madshi

Please try again with the next build, hopefully fixed.

I just tested that scenario, and sure enough, it works now!

Once again, thank you so much!

MikeY

[Andy o]

Thanks madshi, did not expect this so soon!

[Tanis138]

Thank you madshi!
madVR 0.80 + MPCHC (Russian) = subtitles don't disappear on Play/Pause.
Now I can fully enjoy movies w/subtitles. You are my hero!

[azaze1]

Originally Posted by gav1577

Nice V-nice indeed

+1 indeed

My wish list is getting sparse for the HTPC. MadVR in XBMC with HD audio is pretty much it. No more compromises to deal with after that's all working.

[Andy o]

Originally Posted by madshi

madVR v0.80 released
(6) Refresh rate switching does not currently take the decimation ability of the IVTC algorithm into account, so it won't switch to 24Hz mode automatically. Sorry about that. You can work around it by tagging your files with "24p" or "23p". The refresh rate changer will be improved in a future version to take IVTC into account.

One thing about this, madshi. When adding "23p" or "24p" to the file name, deinterlacing gets turned off (it says "override"), so IVTC doesn't work.

[dansrfe]

My upload and render queues randomly decide to go down 2-4 frames each and then back up resulting in dropped frames sometimes. I have no idea what is causing this.

[BeNooL]

Originally Posted by BeNooL

That could very well be it.
In the display manager 2nd display is at the right of primary so yes, tray area is quite close the FSE area.

I'll try what was suggested by noee and report back.

Moving taskbar to the left, I can properly see madVR's popup menu when clicking on its trayicon.

Strangely when moving taskbar back, popup menu can still be displayed. Then after a short time, we're back to previous behavior.

[pankov]

BeNooL,
what do you mean by "moving taskbar to the left/right"?
Isn't your taskbar at the bottom of the primary display?
Can you provide a screenshot (using Print Screen) of your desktop with madVR's popup menu visible in the configuration that's giving you trouble. (please, don't post the full resolution pic here but a thumbnail or simply resize it something sane)
You may have to configure madVR to not use Exclusive mode, but still have it fullscreen windowed mode.

[G_M_C]

Thx for the improvements and additions !

@ IVTC: I was under the impression that my AMD card does IVTC through DXVA when you switch 'pulldowndetection' on ? Then is does recognize 3:2 etc. and video runs smooth. Or is this something completely different ?

@I gather auto reso-switching works as intended now ?
PS on this: I use my secondary output for viewing movies. It does 23/24/50/60p. My primary PC monitor only does 60Hz. When i open a 23p movie file in MPC-HT, it starts on my primary. When i switch to full screen on my secondary, does the resoswitching work there ?

----------------------

@ kasper93
I see your decoder doesn't output NV12, a conversion from H.264 4:2:0 -> NV12 4:2:0 takes place. You can maybe try to set your decoder to output NV12 directly, so no conversion is needed anymore?

[madshi]

Originally Posted by kasper93

Grab top border of the MPC-HC window and slide down, it should crash. http://dl.dropbox.com/u/16282309/MPC-HC/crash.png

Oh! That's too easy...

Originally Posted by gav1577

Nice V-nice indeed

Well, don't get your hopes up too high and too fast. We'll have to see how it plays out. It depends mostly on tiben20 and his willingness to work on this with me. I've done my part (though there still may bugs in it), now it's tiben20's turn to try to make this work in XBMC. He's got a weird crash in madVR and didn't reply to me since then. So I don't know if this will work out or not.

Originally Posted by TheShadowRunner

I experience some weirdness with the "adjust queue sizes to GPU RAM size" setting.
With the SAME file (a 1080p mov trailer), I experience the following behavior:
If "adjust queue sizes to GPU RAM size" is enabled (automatic), then madVR uses 20/12/12/3. In this case rendering is reported as 20ms and I get crazy presentation glitches.
If "adjust queue sizes to GPU RAM size" is disabled and I set both CPU queue size/GPU queue size to 8 (8/8/8/3) (=madVR 0.77 defaults), then rendering is reported as 12ms and I get 0 presentation glitches.
In other words, the automatic setting/higher queue sizes have a detrimental effect on performance. Is this normal/expected?

No, it's not. Which GPU RAM size does madVR detect (see Ctrl+J)? Can you please try 20/8/8/3 and 12/12/12/3 to find out whether the CPU or GPU queue size is the problem?

Originally Posted by YouArePro

Yes my 13" inch 2010 model macbook pro's gpu is integrated into the cpu with shared memory. However, it used to work fine with windows XP professional 32 bit on my bootcamp before changing to windows 7 ultimate 32bit now.

Well, probably the GPU drivers behave different in win7, or maybe the OS itself. As I said, I will try to get a hold of my sister's laptop, but I can't promise anything.

Originally Posted by kasper93

Now it is even worse. Consumption of GPU RAM reported in madVR is too low. I don't have any problem related with it, but if someone have low mem GPU than I believe madVR will set too high queue size and it will glitch.

madVR only lists the memory it uses itself. Is it possible that some other application or the OS itself is consuming all the memory on your OS? What happens if you close the media player? How much RAM usage do you get reported then? Also please double check with GPU-Z or another tool, just to make sure that the process explorer got things right. Thx.

FWIW, madVR now doesn't look at how many RAM it consumes, anymore, in order to decide on the queue sizes. It only look at the detected RAM size and has fixed queue sizes for specific RAM sizes. So the information about how much RAM madVR uses has only informational character right now.

Originally Posted by cyberbeing

It now seems to correctly show GPU RAM usage of madVR only, while ignoring global GPU RAM usage. Not a major problem as long as users are aware that madVR may run out of memory when the OSD shows GPU RAM at ~90-95% (or less if other programs using GPU RAM are open) usage rather than 100%. Either way, I'd rather have it like this, compared to the previous behavior which was wildly inaccurate.

Well, of course I could just make the OSD clearer and indicate that it only shows the RAM madVR itself uses, and not the global RAM consumption. But since it's only an information in the debug OSD and nothing more, I don't consider it a big problem at the moment.

Originally Posted by robpdotcom

I think you get 720p60, or something between that and 720p48. If I set the monitor to 50Hz, I get dropped frames (visible, and through the OSD) - at 59Hz, it looked fine and reported no dropped frames.

Yeah, makes sense. I'll probably add extra support for 60p content sooner or later, so that 60p can be properly decimated to 24p, but it won't come too soon.

Originally Posted by ryrynz

Madshi, can you tell me please, what are the determining factors in keeping the present queue full?
It always drops right down after the initial queue up and it never recovers, dropping down to 0-2 or so.
I went through all the options in previous versions, 0.80 hasn't changed anything in this area for me, thanks.

Are all other queues always full? You're talking about fullscreen exclusive mode, I guess? Which GPU? Which OS? Have you changed the flush settings?

Originally Posted by andybkma

Window 7 SP1, Zoom Player 8 Max, mVR .80

New problem with Zoom Player 8 and mVR .80 : Coming out of Fullscreen Exclusive Mode into windowed mode causes Zoom Player to act very funny. It freezes, then stutters, the borders of ZP change shape oddly, then finally plays normally again. This is a new problem I have only seen with mVR .80 and only exists with Exclusive Fullscreen mode on. No problems like this with earlier versions of mVR. Going into Exclusive Fullscreen Mode is ok, it's just coming out of it. Thanks

I can reproduce at least some of this, will have a look at that.

Originally Posted by Mikey2

Anyway, I have great news to report, .80 solves my problems!

Good to hear!

Originally Posted by Andy o

Thanks madshi, did not expect this so soon!

Soon? I've been working on this for 3-4 weeks. Implementing IVTC was more difficult than I had expected...

Originally Posted by Andy o

One thing about this, madshi. When adding "23p" or "24p" to the file name, deinterlacing gets turned off (it says "override"), so IVTC doesn't work.

Oooops. I think can use "47i" or "48i" instead. But then you have to disable the madVR option to not deinterlace 48i content. Argh, I think I need to rethink the logic a bit.

Originally Posted by dansrfe

My upload and render queues randomly decide to go down 2-4 frames each and then back up resulting in dropped frames sometimes. I have no idea what is causing this.

Maybe some software/service that is installed on your PC and is burning CPU power sometimes?

Originally Posted by G_M_C

@ IVTC: I was under the impression that my AMD card does IVTC through DXVA when you switch 'pulldowndetection' on ? Then is does recognize 3:2 etc. and video runs smooth. Or is this something completely different ?

DXVA1/2 does not support decimating. So although both ATI and NVidia (probably also Intel) do proper IVTC, they do that without decimating, so you end up with 60p or 30p, but not with 24p. In other words: When using DXVA2 deinterlacing, you can't get rid of the 3:2 judder. madVR's IVTC algorithm properly decimates, so you get true 24p output. Besides, I think there's a good chance that madVR's IVTC algorithm is superior to those used by ATI/NVidia/Intel, but I'll have to double check that before really claiming it.

Originally Posted by G_M_C

@I gather auto reso-switching works as intended now ?

It should have for a while already.

Originally Posted by G_M_C

When i open a 23p movie file in MPC-HT, it starts on my primary. When i switch to full screen on my secondary, does the resoswitching work there ?

Yes.

[shimaflarex]

MPC-HC opened, without playing anything(Aero disabled):
GPU-Z reports 41MB of used GPU memory.
ProcessExplorer reports 26.9MB(dedicated memory) and 26.3MB(system memory)

Playing a 1080p video using madVR:
madVR reports usage of 115MB.
GPU-Z reports usage of 413MB.
Process Explorer reports usage of 400MB(dedicated memory) and 153MB(system memory).

Something does seems odd...
Nvidia Geforce 8500GT, if that matters.

Edit: Not using any hardware decoding.

[fairchild]

Madshi, new version is working A-OK aside from one minor difference which I tweaked. Basically I was also noticing frame drops and low queues with the auto settings which are determined by my GPU's ram total. I have re-attained smooth playback by setting the queues to CPU:12, GPU:8 and disabling use a separate thread for presentation to stop MPC-HC from hanging when skipping through files. Everything else is at defaults for me aside from also disabling decoding and changing scaling to: softcubic 70 - chroma, bicubic 75 luma up/down

[Andy o]

Originally Posted by madshi

Soon? I've been working on this for 3-4 weeks. Implementing IVTC was more difficult than I had expected...

Somehow I had in mind that IVTC was one of those "foreseeable future" options without very high priority

Oooops. I think can use "47i" or "48i" instead. But then you have to disable the madVR option to not deinterlace 48i content. Argh, I think I need to rethink the logic a bit.

This enables deinterlacing, but switches to 59p though. BTW, the option to not deinterlace 48i content seems to be "overridden" by the 47/48i tag in the file name, so it always deinterlaces.

[dansrfe]

Auto queues set:
Decoder: 19-20/20
Upload: 11-12/12
Render: 11-12/12
Present: 10-12/12

The upload and render queues go to 9-12/12 every 5 seconds on two completely different machines with two completely different gpus. This is definitely not related to my GPU or CPU. Also note that I'm using different resizing algorithms on both machines.

[kasper93]

Originally Posted by madshi

Is it possible that some other application or the OS itself is consuming all the memory on your OS?.

I was talking hypothetically, actual only thing that is wrong is that ram counter, but as you say it is not important…

Originally Posted by madshi

madVR only lists the memory it uses itself. Is it possible that some other application or the OS itself is consuming all the memory on your OS? What happens if you close the media player? How much RAM usage do you get reported then? Also please double check with GPU-Z or another tool, just to make sure that the process explorer got things right. Thx.

GPU-Z, MSI Afterburner and process explorer reports same amount of used memory.
Could you look at this screenshots:
idle, without playback
1080p, deinterlacing off, bluray
1080p, deinterlacing on, bluray
480p, big buck bunny
If a picture says more than 1000 words, you should understand what the problem is But if that counter is only informative and didn't affect any madVR function than it is not so important to fix

EDIT: Of course 1080i ;p

Originally Posted by madshi

It only look at the detected RAM size and has fixed queue sizes for specific RAM sizes.

What if someone have other application that consumes GPU RAM heavily? I think queue sizes should be set dynamically depending on global free GPU RAM. For example when we run few instance of mpc-hc we can reach ram limit, I think madVR should lower queue to prevent such thing. But you are developer and you know what is best for madVR

[TheShadowRunner]

Originally Posted by madshi

No, it's not. Which GPU RAM size does madVR detect (see Ctrl+J)? Can you please try 20/8/8/3 and 12/12/12/3 to find out whether the CPU or GPU queue size is the problem?

madVR reports 512MB for my card, which is correct.

With "adjust queue sizes to GPU RAM size" enabled (auto):
20/12/12/3, ram: 182/512, rendering: 21ms

With "adjust queue sizes to GPU RAM size" disabled:
- 8/8/8/3, ram: 134/512, rendering: 12.80ms
- 20/8/8/3, ram: 134/512, rendering 12.90ms
- 12/12/12/3, ram: 182/512, rendering: 21ms

Looks like GPU queue size is the problem..

[Weirdo]

Thanks a lot for the updates! Recommended update method? Unregister old files -possibly deleting them- then register new ones, or just copy/replace?

[Razoola]

I'm getting alot of dropped frames with 080 compared to 079 with no settings changed. It seems with 080 getting batches of 5 presentation glitches every 15 to 20 seconds that cause the stutters on my 2nd gpu.

Confirmed its not happening with 079 (presentation glitches do not increment at all) on the same gpu.

I also noticed that with 080 an aero message shows in the stats (2nd line) that is not there in 079 when using identical settings. Is that normal?

[update]

Just to add manually setting the queues like fairchild suggests does not fix the stutters for me.

[kirakami]

Originally Posted by kirakami

tried madVR 0.79
i get this error when i use madVR on Ge-Force 4 MX440
& MPC-HC crashes only audio plays
MPC-HC- > Playback > Output > madVR

@madshi: why does madVR always crashes for me