How to achieve "film look" on PAL DV source - Page 19

BlueCup · 28th April 2007, 00:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by Backwoods

www.flmpro.com/DLLreq.zip

Chanmix and GiCoCu

You didn't look hard enough.

anton_foy · 28th April 2007, 13:23

Whohoooo!

@ BlueCup

Thank you my friend, they like to hide for some reason hehe.

E-Male · 28th April 2007, 14:06

I haven't been here for some time, so I din't see the requests until today.

I currently can't access the HD with my old programming stuff.
But I'll try to get the dlls and sources as soon as I got my new PC and will upload anything I could save to some webspace.

THX a lot to anyone providing mirrors.

anton_foy · 28th April 2007, 17:36

Thats ok E-Male I got it now. Was a fool not knowing it was in the DLLreq.rar.

But cannot get ChanMix to work. The image just comes out black and white when testing.

Converttorgb24().ChanMix(10,10,10).Converttoyv12()

Is Chanmix exactly like in photoshop BTW.? In photoshop you can adjust RGB for each.

Like:

Red: red
green
blue
Constant

Green: red
green
blue
Constant

Blue: red
green
blue
Constant

And values between -200 to +200

E-Male · 29th April 2007, 14:28

It is supposed to create greyscale output.
The 3 parameters are the weight of each color channel.

Korben · 2nd May 2007, 11:41

actionman133 could you please post your curve.txt again. And beside this,the Tint function on avisynth homepage (http://avisynth.org/index.php?page=Tint) doesnt work properly.

It says:
---------------------------
VirtualDub Error
---------------------------
Avisynth open failure:
Overlay: Mask and overlay must have the same image size! (Height is not the same)
(tint.avs, line 29)
(O:\Capture\Project_107\720p.avs, line 33)

Any ideas?
BR

actionman133 · 4th May 2007, 16:35

Sorry Korben, I've long since deleted that curve file and I can't remember what values I used.

I had a look at the script but I can't see where it's going wrong... What are the dimensions and colourspace of your clip?

Korben · 5th May 2007, 09:42

Ok.. no problem, if anybody has still the curve.txt please post it.

I dont know why, but it works now. The video is just SD-Video, 720x480. Iam almost using YUY2.

anton_foy · 12th May 2007, 14:43

Recently my friend Gustaf Ullberg made another ChannelMixer plugin. It is identical to the Photoshop ChannelMixer and it supports RGB24 and RGB32 colorspaces. Hope you like it.

http://redshift.xtreem.nu/gustaf/fil...mixer_v1_0.zip

BlueCup · 12th May 2007, 22:18

Great news, thank you.

anton_foy · 18th May 2007, 15:02

When using a Photoshop curve with GiCoCu everything works fine but if I use two curves in a row like this:

GiCoCU("C:\Projekt\Curve1.amp",photoshop=true)
GiCoCU("C:\Projekt\Curve2.amp",photoshop=true)

my image gets a strong blue tint all over.
Possible bugg or Im doing something wrong?

BlueCup · 19th May 2007, 08:40

Just curious, what version of Photoshop are you using?

anton_foy · 19th May 2007, 11:44

@BlueCup

Im using 7.0...I know its old

BlueCup · 20th May 2007, 05:51

Just making sure because I think CS1/2 (don't know about 3) save curves in a different file format.

WorBry · 30th May 2007, 07:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by actionman133

Sorry Korben, I've long since deleted that curve file and I can't remember what values I used

I'd be interested in that curve file also. Does anyone still have a copy?

jkwarras · 24th July 2007, 11:38

I'm using the Backwoords script V2F on some DV PAL interlaced footage. It's great! Some thoughts:

1) Anyone has worked out a new version with new plugins, simpler, or with less color conversions?

2) I see in the output (it's a weeding video, outdoors, natural lights) some artifacts, like mosquito noise around edges. I guess it's due to some of the overlay, blur, masks stuff in the scripts.

3) Deinterlacing with leakkerneldeint (0) gives a progressive video and more film look feeling.

4) Grain is difficult, because adding addgrain(18,0,0) it's too much for me. Adding 10 is fine, but I see it too much. It's "over" the picture, not "in" the picture as in film. Adding it on the second step (FILM) brings more edges and it look worst. I've tried noisegenerator.dll and I get weird results, with colour changes.

5) Does someone knows if it'll be better (and quicker/simpler) to apply curves like the Panasonic DVX100 or HVX200 does? Another think is to get them and how to apply them to video.

scharfis_brain · 24th July 2007, 12:02

3) use a more sophisticated deinterlacer like yadif, or mcbob/mvbob.

jkwarras · 24th July 2007, 17:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by scharfis_brain

3) use a more sophisticated deinterlacer like yadif, or mcbob/mvbob.

Nice, I'll try one of these. Thanks.

Mug Funky · 25th July 2007, 03:22

Quote:

4) Grain is difficult, because adding addgrain(18,0,0) it's too much for me. Adding 10 is fine, but I see it too much. It's "over" the picture, not "in" the picture as in film. Adding it on the second step (FILM) brings more edges and it look worst. I've tried noisegenerator.dll and I get weird results, with colour changes.

5) Does someone knows if it'll be better (and quicker/simpler) to apply curves like the Panasonic DVX100 or HVX200 does? Another think is to get them and how to apply them to video.

film grain is tricky. negative film has much more grain in the darks than the highlights. however, most "film look" people experience is telecined film on TV. telecine machines on neg film will add their own noise to the highlights, but it's a different sort of noise. a simple luma mask could sort this out though.

applying curves to get a film look is also tricky - 1D LUTs aren't enough to reproduce some of the effects of exposed film. it doesn't take crosstalk into account (channel mixing). a 3D LUT can handle this very well though, and in fact there's a lot going on in the DI world that involves getting good 3d LUTs to simulate certain effects (bleach bypass, certain specific stocks, etc). these tend to be proprietary though, and usually made via direct measurements.

i'd love to see a 3d LUT plugin for avisynth, but it'd only be really useful in 10 bits or more (preferably float).

IanB · 25th July 2007, 04:50

3d LUT, well it ain't gonna be fast, 256x256x256=16,777,216 table entries. At 3 bytes per entry give a 48Mb table. Certainly do-able with current machines, but oh what it will do to the L1 and L2 caches.

Full 10 bit is even worse, 1024x1024x1024=1,073,741,824 tables entries. At 3 words per entry gives a 6Gb table, sure you could spec an x64 machine to cope.

Compromise 10bit might just fit, 1024x256x256=67,108,864 table entries. At 1 word plus 2 bytes per entry gives a 256Mb table.

By understanding a particular table some clever tricks may be possible to drastically reduce the load, but then it's not general LUT anymore.

2nd May 2007, 11:41	#366 \| Link
Korben Registered User Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 11	actionman133 could you please post your curve.txt again. And beside this,the Tint function on avisynth homepage (http://avisynth.org/index.php?page=Tint) doesnt work properly. It says: --------------------------- VirtualDub Error --------------------------- Avisynth open failure: Overlay: Mask and overlay must have the same image size! (Height is not the same) (tint.avs, line 29) (O:\Capture\Project_107\720p.avs, line 33) Any ideas? BR Last edited by Korben; 2nd May 2007 at 11:52.

4th May 2007, 16:35	#367 \| Link
actionman133 Movie buff & shine Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Logan, the only hole above ground. Posts: 257	Sorry Korben, I've long since deleted that curve file and I can't remember what values I used. I had a look at the script but I can't see where it's going wrong... What are the dimensions and colourspace of your clip? __________________ I'm a boxer who can Bob () & Weave (). I like to Overlay () punches and Blur () his vision to ShowFiveVersions (). My KO punch will always Pulldown ().TimeStretch () and all he will hear is Tone ().

12th May 2007, 14:43	#369 \| Link
anton_foy Registered User Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Sweden Posts: 703	Another ChannelMixer Recently my friend Gustaf Ullberg made another ChannelMixer plugin. It is identical to the Photoshop ChannelMixer and it supports RGB24 and RGB32 colorspaces. Hope you like it. http://redshift.xtreem.nu/gustaf/fil...mixer_v1_0.zip

18th May 2007, 15:02	#371 \| Link
anton_foy Registered User Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Sweden Posts: 703	Gicocu bugg? When using a Photoshop curve with GiCoCu everything works fine but if I use two curves in a row like this: GiCoCU("C:\Projekt\Curve1.amp",photoshop=true) GiCoCU("C:\Projekt\Curve2.amp",photoshop=true) my image gets a strong blue tint all over. Possible bugg or Im doing something wrong?

24th July 2007, 11:38	#376 \| Link
jkwarras Registered User Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Zaragoza Posts: 405	I'm using the Backwoords script V2F on some DV PAL interlaced footage. It's great! Some thoughts: 1) Anyone has worked out a new version with new plugins, simpler, or with less color conversions? 2) I see in the output (it's a weeding video, outdoors, natural lights) some artifacts, like mosquito noise around edges. I guess it's due to some of the overlay, blur, masks stuff in the scripts. 3) Deinterlacing with leakkerneldeint (0) gives a progressive video and more film look feeling. 4) Grain is difficult, because adding addgrain(18,0,0) it's too much for me. Adding 10 is fine, but I see it too much. It's "over" the picture, not "in" the picture as in film. Adding it on the second step (FILM) brings more edges and it look worst. I've tried noisegenerator.dll and I get weird results, with colour changes. 5) Does someone knows if it'll be better (and quicker/simpler) to apply curves like the Panasonic DVX100 or HVX200 does? Another think is to get them and how to apply them to video. __________________ Iván Blog: http://ivancastell.org \| Myspace: http://myspace.com/ivancastell \| Last.fm: http://lastfm.es/user/jkwarras/

28th April 2007, 13:23	#362 \| Link
anton_foy Registered User Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Sweden Posts: 703	Whohoooo! @ BlueCup Thank you my friend, they like to hide for some reason hehe.

28th April 2007, 14:06	#363 \| Link
E-Male mad computer-scientist Join Date: Mar 2002 Posts: 1,375	I haven't been here for some time, so I din't see the requests until today. I currently can't access the HD with my old programming stuff. But I'll try to get the dlls and sources as soon as I got my new PC and will upload anything I could save to some webspace. THX a lot to anyone providing mirrors.

28th April 2007, 17:36	#364 \| Link
anton_foy Registered User Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Sweden Posts: 703	Thats ok E-Male I got it now. Was a fool not knowing it was in the DLLreq.rar. But cannot get ChanMix to work. The image just comes out black and white when testing. Converttorgb24().ChanMix(10,10,10).Converttoyv12() Is Chanmix exactly like in photoshop BTW.? In photoshop you can adjust RGB for each. Like: Red: red green blue Constant Green: red green blue Constant Blue: red green blue Constant And values between -200 to +200

29th April 2007, 14:28	#365 \| Link
E-Male mad computer-scientist Join Date: Mar 2002 Posts: 1,375	It is supposed to create greyscale output. The 3 parameters are the weight of each color channel.

5th May 2007, 09:42	#368 \| Link
Korben Registered User Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 11	Ok.. no problem, if anybody has still the curve.txt please post it. I dont know why, but it works now. The video is just SD-Video, 720x480. Iam almost using YUY2.

12th May 2007, 22:18	#370 \| Link
BlueCup Registered User Join Date: Jan 2003 Posts: 66	Great news, thank you.

19th May 2007, 08:40	#372 \| Link
BlueCup Registered User Join Date: Jan 2003 Posts: 66	Just curious, what version of Photoshop are you using?

19th May 2007, 11:44	#373 \| Link
anton_foy Registered User Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Sweden Posts: 703	@BlueCup Im using 7.0...I know its old

20th May 2007, 05:51	#374 \| Link
BlueCup Registered User Join Date: Jan 2003 Posts: 66	Just making sure because I think CS1/2 (don't know about 3) save curves in a different file format.

24th July 2007, 12:02	#377 \| Link
scharfis_brain brainless Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Germany Posts: 3,653	3) use a more sophisticated deinterlacer like yadif, or mcbob/mvbob. __________________ Don't forget the 'c'! Don't PM me for technical support, please.

25th July 2007, 04:50	#380 \| Link
IanB Avisynth Developer Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Melbourne, Australia Posts: 3,167	3d LUT, well it ain't gonna be fast, 256x256x256=16,777,216 table entries. At 3 bytes per entry give a 48Mb table. Certainly do-able with current machines, but oh what it will do to the L1 and L2 caches. Full 10 bit is even worse, 1024x1024x1024=1,073,741,824 tables entries. At 3 words per entry gives a 6Gb table, sure you could spec an x64 machine to cope. Compromise 10bit might just fit, 1024x256x256=67,108,864 table entries. At 1 word plus 2 bytes per entry gives a 256Mb table. By understanding a particular table some clever tricks may be possible to drastically reduce the load, but then it's not general LUT anymore.