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Old 10th September 2019, 14:53   #1321  |  Link
vidschlub
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I have a collection of about 8-15 8mm reels here my ma left me after she passed away.

Having seen the examples at the start of this thread, it feels like it would be an injustice to just hand the reels to any schmo for $10 a reel and having them convert them.

I did some reading this evening on a product called a Wolverine Pro, however it sounds like it rips at 20fps, not the original 16 or 18fps.
So I guess my question is, what's the best format to rip these films, so ensure I can clean them up in some capacity? Is 1080p enough (Wolverine Pro) - should I rip at some kind of 'literal' frame rate (actually 16 / 18 fps, or even 60fps somehow?)

I'd hate to have half blurry frames or something that can't be cleaned up.
Also, it sounds like some scanning tools 'zoom in' the film frame too close, losing some of the details in the image. I see several purists mentioning ripping the films twice, once zoomed in for the actual action and once zoomed right out allowing you to even see the film holes on the side.


What are peoples thoughts and to the op, thanks for the excellent scripts, I'm not in a position to use them yet but the results you seem to have achieved are well well impressive.
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Old 11th September 2019, 16:09   #1322  |  Link
videoFred
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vidschlub View Post
I did some reading this evening on a product called a Wolverine Pro,
It's a cheap device, not bad for that price. But it will never give the quality you want.

Quote:
Is 1080p enough (Wolverine Pro)
More than enough for 8mm film. Also, aspect ratio from 8mm film is 4:3. That gives 1440x1080.
I capture at 1392x1032 with my machine vision camera.
But the quality from the digital transfer is much more important than the size.

Quote:
- should I rip at some kind of 'literal' frame rate (actually 16 / 18 fps, or even 60fps somehow?)
What we need is one film frame = one digital frame. No duplicate frames.
Then play speed does not matter and can be easily changed afterwards.

Fred.
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About 8mm film:
http://www.super-8.be
Film Transfer Tutorial and example clips:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W4QBsWXKuV8
More Example clips:
http://www.vimeo.com/user678523/videos/sort:newest

Last edited by videoFred; 11th September 2019 at 16:12.
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Old 11th September 2019, 17:14   #1323  |  Link
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To add and clarify to two important things VideoFred said:

1. The device must be "frame accurate" which means you get exactly one frame of film on each frame of video, without blends of adjacent frames (like you get if you just point a video camera at a movie screen), and without any flickering from a projector shutter being closed. I quickly skimmed the Woverine literature, and it does look like it is frame accurate.

2. As Fred said, you can set the speed of the playback after the capture. This is like speeding up or slowing down a movie projector: the same exact frames are shown, but they are just projected at a faster or slower speed. However, there are target speeds that should give you a result which gives you motion that is the same speed as the real-life event that was filmed. Super 8 film is always 18 fps. Sound 16mm is always 24 fps. Really old film can be any frame rate because the camera was either hand-cranked, or it used a wind-up mechanism that was often not very accurate. Having said that, most 16mm and 8mm silent film was shot at a speed around 16 fps, so that is always a good starting point.

You will find that some amateur movie cameras had a "film saver" speed which would slow down the film to 10 fps or slower. You just have to look at the result and decide whether you need to speed it up or slow it down.

BTW, your Wolverine apparently stores the captured movie in h.264 MP4 format. This is OK if you are just going to capture and view, but if you plan to edit the film, this "delivery format" is most definitely not the ideal. It usually doesn't play as smoothly on your NLE timeline as a "capture format," and it also will tend to introduce additional digital artifacts by the time you are finished with your project. This isn't a huge deal, because the artifacts will probably be fairly small (depending on how much compression the Wolverine uses), but it is most definitely not professional and not ideal.

I also agree with VideoFred that you don't need to capture or edit in full HD for 8mm film, and probably not Super 8 either. Even 16mm film can be captured at less than full HD with very little degradation. I had a chance to test this when some 1934 16mm film I had transferred was licensed to the Smithsonian Channel. They wanted to have the transfer re-done by a "Hollywood" transfer house, using a professional Spirit transfer system. I had the transfer house send the transfer to me before I sent it to the Smithsonian Channel. As I expected, their transfer, which was delivered in 1920x1080 ProRes, did a little better job on shadows than my projector/camcorder system (it was very contrasty German film stock), but the sharpness and increase in detail, while most definitely evident, was not strikingly better. It was a matter of 10-20% better (I'm trying to put my evaluation into numbers), not twice as good, or four times as good, which is how much more resolution 1920x1080 is compared to my 720x480 (non-square pixel) transfers.

Last edited by johnmeyer; 11th September 2019 at 17:18. Reason: typos
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Old 26th October 2019, 00:29   #1324  |  Link
bruce356
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Hi, I have VirtualDub2_43803 and AviSynth v2.6 Official installed.

I am attempting to apply Video Fred's Script (01_A_Film_Restoring_Frame_Interpolation) and save the result.

I am new to this process of using VD & AviSth and to apply a scripts.

Not sure how to go about saving only the output frame as "Save Video" in VirtualDub saves both the original and result1.

I have read a large portion of this forum and only found one reference to saving by Patrick "Quote - Where is the modified clip stored?" but the reply by Video Fred is not detailed except partly to say "you must save the output somewhere" and am not sure if Patrick had the problem of it saving both windows.

Example image attached.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/xznvu9oyyu...image.jpg?dl=0
Hoping you can help, or point me to an explanation of how to.

Thanks and regards - Bruce

Last edited by bruce356; 26th October 2019 at 00:35.
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Old 26th October 2019, 10:29   #1325  |  Link
kedautinh12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by StainlessS View Post
These are the avs specific dll's that I copy to system32/SysWOW64
Code:
AvsRecursion.dll
fftw3.dll              # same as below file, name edited only
libfftw3f-3.dll
libsndfile-1.dll
please share me link download AvsRecursion.dll and libsndfile-1.dll, can't fint 64 bit ver
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Old 26th October 2019, 11:17   #1326  |  Link
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Originally Posted by kedautinh12 View Post
please share me link download AvsRecursion.dll and libsndfile-1.dll, can't fint 64 bit ver
There is no 64 bit AvsRecursion.dll.
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Old 26th October 2019, 11:54   #1327  |  Link
StainlessS
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There dont seem to be an x64 libsndfile-1.dll either.
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Old 26th October 2019, 13:07   #1328  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bruce356 View Post
...I am attempting to apply Video Fred's Script (01_A_Film_Restoring_Frame_Interpolation) and save the result.

Not sure how to go about saving only the output frame as "Save Video" in VirtualDub saves both the original and result1.
The 01_A_Film_Restoring_Frame_Interpolation.avs is a script to compare different effects. You can select the effect to compare at the beginning of the script, by default:

Quote:
#PARAMETERS
#------------------
result="resultS1" # specify the wanted output here
At the end of the script there are some options:
Quote:
#COMPARISONS: ORIGINAL VS RESULTS
#......................................................................................................................................................................
resultS1= stackhorizontal(subtitle(source4,"original",size=28,align=2),subtitle(result1,"result1: autolevels, autowhite",size=28,align=2))
resultS2= stackhorizontal(subtitle(source4,"original",size=28,align=2),subtitle(result2,"result2: autowhite, manual levels correction",size=28,align=2))
resultS3= stackhorizontal(subtitle(source4,"original",size=28,align=2),subtitle(result3,"result3: autolevels, manual color correction",size=28,align=2))
...
Like you see resultS1 is the output you obtain in your image:
Both the original and result1

If you want only the result1 (autolevels, autowhite) you must change at the begining:


Quote:
#PARAMETERS
#------------------
result="result1" # specify the wanted output here
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Old 26th October 2019, 14:26   #1329  |  Link
StvG
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Quote:
Originally Posted by StainlessS View Post
There dont seem to be an x64 libsndfile-1.dll either.
Here if someone wants it.
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Old 26th October 2019, 15:00   #1330  |  Link
StainlessS
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Thanks StvG
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Old 27th October 2019, 01:26   #1331  |  Link
bruce356
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tebasuna51 View Post
The 01_A_Film_Restoring_Frame_Interpolation.avs is a script to compare different effects. You can select the effect to compare at the beginning of the script, by default:



At the end of the script there are some options:


Like you see resultS1 is the output you obtain in your image:
Both the original and result1

If you want only the result1 (autolevels, autowhite) you must change at the begining:
Thanks very much for the reply, I did read the help files but for some reason could not figure out how to save output screen only. With your help, information and pointing me in the right direction, am able to save only the output.
Regards - Bruce
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Old 29th October 2019, 10:55   #1332  |  Link
kedautinh12
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Originally Posted by StvG View Post
Here if someone wants it.
are you have AvsRecursion.dll x64?? i have src of AvsRecursion but can't compiler become 64 bit?? can anyone can do it?? thanks
http://web.archive.org/web/200710171.../AvsRecursion/
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Old 29th October 2019, 11:39   #1333  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kedautinh12 View Post
are you have AvsRecursion.dll x64?? i have src of AvsRecursion but can't compiler become 64 bit?? can anyone can do it?? thanks
http://web.archive.org/web/200710171.../AvsRecursion/
I don't know which plugin in this context even needs AvsRecursion. I know of RemoveGrain and RemoveDirt but both have been "modernised" by Tp7/pinterf and don't depend on this ancient contraption.
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Old 29th October 2019, 14:50   #1334  |  Link
StainlessS
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No idea if these still have AvsRecursion requirement, but Google search "AvsRecursion site:avisynth.nl" :- https://www.google.com/search?source...4dUDCAc&uact=5

brings up AnimeIVTC and DeFlicker as well as RemoveGrain.

EDIT: I think Kassandro dll's that require AvsRecusion will send an "AvsRecusion.dll Not found" type message to DebugView window(Google),
but still work ok (but slower) without it.
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Last edited by StainlessS; 29th October 2019 at 14:55.
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Old 31st October 2019, 12:00   #1335  |  Link
StvG
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kedautinh12 View Post
are you have AvsRecursion.dll x64?? i have src of AvsRecursion but can't compiler become 64 bit?? can anyone can do it?? thanks
http://web.archive.org/web/200710171.../AvsRecursion/
Here compiled from the source you gave.
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Old 2nd November 2019, 06:27   #1336  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by StvG View Post
Here compiled from the source you gave.
wow, thanks
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Old 6th December 2019, 11:32   #1337  |  Link
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DIY frame by frame scanner

Hello,

Not exactly the subject of this thread on the excellent videofred scripts that I use for a long time but I think that may interest those who are asking the question of building a DIY frame by frame scanner.

You can find many projects on this subject with very different solutions and all sorts of interesting ideas. I would like to introduce mine using a PI camera and a modified projector controlled by a Raspberry PI.

I specifically studied the following aspects:
- Use and calibration of the PI camera with a non-stock lens
- Comparison of PI cameras V1 and V2
- Adaptation of the projector and lighting
- Python programming of a client-server application for controlling a stepper motor and the camera.
- Improving the dynamics of the image with an HDR technique

Code and documentation (In french, Google translate is your best friend):
https://github.com/dgalland/yart

Dominique
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