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Old 4th May 2016, 13:39   #37741  |  Link
Stereodude
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SweetLow View Post
1. Opposed to 1.3, of course.
2. Are you read standard to make such statement second time?
http://www.hdmi.org/manufacturer/hdm...1_4_faq.aspx#1 Where's the mention of redefining the definition of YCbCr?
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Old 4th May 2016, 15:26   #37742  |  Link
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Originally Posted by Stereodude View Post
http://www.hdmi.org/manufacturer/hdm...1_4_faq.aspx#1 Where's the mention of redefining the definition of YCbCr?
You try to learn _standard_ by FAQ for users? Good luck
"YCC Quantization Range".
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Old 4th May 2016, 16:33   #37743  |  Link
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Dear Friends

I have installed the newest version of MPC-HC 1.7.10 (x64), madVR 0.90.17 (x86), LAV Filters 0.68.0 (x86/x64) with 3D support.

I have got Intel i5-4690K with MSI GTX 970 Gaming 4G connected via HDMI to my receiver Onkyo TX-NR525 and to receiver my TV Samsung UE40H6400. I have configured MPC-HC, madVR, LAV Filters, NVIDIA Control Panel to use Stereoscopic 3D and I have played my 3D ISO 1:1 without any problems. So I have got 3D effect, but English is not my first language, so I use Polish subtitles. I think there is something wrong with subtitles shown on my screen, they are blurred/parted, so my eyes hurts, when I watch such movie. Are there any options or external filters, which I should use instead of those built in MPC-HC?

Which codec should I use in LAV Video to decode? That from NVIDIA?

I would be glad for any help and support.

Thank you in advance.

Sincerely
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Old 4th May 2016, 19:32   #37744  |  Link
Stereodude
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SweetLow View Post
You try to learn _standard_ by FAQ for users? Good luck
"YCC Quantization Range".
I'm not trying to learn anything. You're claiming it's a change in HDMI 1.4. I simply pointed out that if it exists it wasn't important enough to make their list of changes in 1.4. Regardless, none of that changes that YCbCr is 16-235 for luma. That's the standard for Rec.709 / BT.709 which is what devices are putting on HDMI.

Last edited by Stereodude; 4th May 2016 at 19:36.
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Old 4th May 2016, 20:46   #37745  |  Link
e-t172
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Originally Posted by Stereodude View Post
I'm not trying to learn anything. You're claiming it's a change in HDMI 1.4. I simply pointed out that if it exists it wasn't important enough to make their list of changes in 1.4. Regardless, none of that changes that YCbCr is 16-235 for luma. That's the standard for Rec.709 / BT.709 which is what devices are putting on HDMI.
I double-checked and I'm afraid SweetLow is technically correct. It's in section 6.6 "Video Quantization Ranges" of the HDMI 1.4 spec:

Quote:
Originally Posted by HDMI 1.4, 6.6
If the sink’s EDID declares a selectable YCC Quantization Range (QY=1), then it shall expect limited range pixel values if it receives AVI YQ=0 and it shall expect full range pixel values if it receives AVI YQ=1.
Table 6-3 goes on to explain that in the limited range case, Y is 16-235 and CbCr is 16-240, while in the full range case, Y is 0-255 and CbCr is 0-255.

Meanwhile, the HDMI 1.3a spec only states that YCbCr full range is "not allowed" (HDMI 1.3a, 6.6, table 6-3), so it's clearly new in HDMI 1.4.

Whether there are real HDMI devices out there that actually support this "selectable quantization range" feature is still an open question, though.

Last edited by e-t172; 4th May 2016 at 20:48.
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Old 4th May 2016, 21:14   #37746  |  Link
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I wonder what the next version of madVR will bring to the table ?
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Old 4th May 2016, 21:27   #37747  |  Link
James Freeman
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a food for thought
a thought to ponder
a pondering heart
a heart to dare
a daring new madVR build.

Some poetry while we wait...
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Last edited by James Freeman; 4th May 2016 at 21:37.
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Old 5th May 2016, 00:10   #37748  |  Link
Warner306
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Originally Posted by Georgel View Post
I wonder what the next version of madVR will bring to the table ?
Don't know. If we quit asking what's next, maybe madshi would release a stable version. It already does everything I would want it to.
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Old 5th May 2016, 00:29   #37749  |  Link
Nabukodonosor
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I have a problem with this great renderer. I breaks a lot. I've attached my bug report. Please help. Thanks
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File Type: txt bug report.txt (17.0 KB, 3 views)
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Old 5th May 2016, 03:42   #37750  |  Link
Georgel
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Originally Posted by Warner306 View Post
Don't know. If we quit asking what's next, maybe madshi would release a stable version. It already does everything I would want it to.
I don't believe in perfection.

All versions have been fairly stable for me.

As long as things always improve, there is no need to release a final or a best version, but to keep improving.

New interesting things that can be added are all around the place. Even more now with more powerful GPUs coming.

EDIT ::: Maybe, at some point, have the render re-draw the image from games, or other applications instead of only MPC-HC. Adding more software it can work with would be interesting.
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Old 5th May 2016, 09:14   #37751  |  Link
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Originally Posted by Stereodude View Post
I'm not trying to learn anything.
But take responsibility to declare that someone is wrong. No more questions.
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Old 5th May 2016, 10:55   #37752  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cxrn View Post
I heard madshi planned on making a "add black bars" feature, but I'm not sure if it's still is on the table or not.

If that feature never sees the light of day, is there a smooth way to manually add black bars to a movie by encoding it? E.g., encode a movie in 2.35:1 format (1920x816) and add black borders so the result is 16:9 (1920x1080).

This would be great since subtitles are non-proportional and smaller when rendered on non-1080p content with XySubFilter.
madshi definitely stated it was coming. We just need to be patient.
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Old 5th May 2016, 11:13   #37753  |  Link
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How does madVR compare to FBI/CIA high-tech software used to magnify photos, zoom-in and clean-up images from a barely discernable state to a very clear/clean state? Or is it only in movies / TV Shows?
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Old 5th May 2016, 11:26   #37754  |  Link
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Originally Posted by XMonarchY View Post
How does madVR compare to FBI/CIA high-tech software used to magnify photos, zoom-in and clean-up images from a barely discernable state to a very clear/clean state? Or is it only in movies / TV Shows?
Offline processing where you can spend seconds or even minutes on a single image is always going to have quite different possibilities not achieveable in realtime video playback.

But most of that is TV only anyway.
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Old 5th May 2016, 14:15   #37755  |  Link
leeperry
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Offline processing where you can spend seconds or even minutes on a single image is always going to have quite different possibilities not achieveable in realtime video playback.

But most of that is TV only anyway.
It's my impression that the CSI tvshow created a myth that simply does not exist, we've all seen CCTV pictures of terrorists in the news and PQ is no better than bilinear.

But then again this looks impressive: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8lQgpHg3VKs made using https://www.motiondsp.com/ikena-forensic/

But much like vinyl declicking/denoising audio demos that are always hard to believe, either intel agencies don't share those processed pictures at all or it's all a bunch of bs.
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Old 5th May 2016, 20:38   #37756  |  Link
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I am no expert but I think even if they have some advanced image processing technique, they are probably looking for different thing like pattern or letter recognition, not to look good for the eyes.
And there is no magic out there, as you are always limited by pixels and TV often shown they can make thing out of nothing.

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Old 5th May 2016, 21:14   #37757  |  Link
leeperry
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The big theory is called Super-Resolution as I understand it and it uses informations from previous frames in order to increase details but I have yet to see it used IRL and especially disclosed by intel agencies so again either it's all a big theoretical myth or they refuse to share the results possibly due to NDA's. Not something that will happen in real-time using mVR anyway so case closed I guess, NNEDI3 is as good as it's gonna get for our GPU's.
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Old 5th May 2016, 21:46   #37758  |  Link
Stereodude
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But take responsibility to declare that someone is wrong. No more questions.
Yes, yes... I was wrong. They added support for a non standardized YCbCr format in HDMI 1.4.

Now we can all be friends again.

Last edited by Stereodude; 5th May 2016 at 21:50.
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Old 5th May 2016, 22:37   #37759  |  Link
70MM
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In the middle of a film the other day an update came up on my screen, I just said yes to it thinking it was for JRiver...
Two days later felt my image was looking softer, I opened up madvr to discover the version was different and many of my settings had changed.
When I went to the sharpness tabs I see that there are extra settings in there Ive never seen, ringing plus others I forget.
Was there a resent update a week ago?
Can these updates arrive while playing a movie?
What are these new settings I see and is there an explanation for them somewhere?

Many thanks...
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Old 5th May 2016, 22:46   #37760  |  Link
Uoppi
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The latest madVR build (v0.90.17) is from March 25.

Last edited by Uoppi; 5th May 2016 at 22:49.
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