GUIDE: Stereo to 5-Channel Surround

[kempfand]

If you want safe & quick results, follow the guide on the 1st page of this threat.

The recent pages are on experimental "work-in-progress", which you might wanna try if you really are into it, but it needs a pretty good understanding of things to allow you understand "what's happening where".

I'm sure there will be new guides sooner or later, which describe howto do things. EoH already provided a quick one on the CS II VST the page before.

For the AmbioPhonic VSTs, the posted files contain a bidule to get you started. I've gotten some superb results with this one.

Andreas

I have just uploaded a Bidule to do 6.1 output from CSII to 6.1 DTS compatable.
I.E. SC mixed into LS and RS.

ftp://daphy.mine.nu/Ambiophonics/circle2ne06.rar

I have just uploaded a bidule to do reverse engineering of 5.1 sounds.
Read the Post 5.1 to WXYZ and Back to get a better idea what this is about.

I posted this here so as subscribed users will get notified

[daphy]

I have just uploaded a bidule to do reverse engineering of 5.1 sounds.
Read the Post 5.1 to WXYZ and Back to get a better idea what this is about.

I think with this link it´s easier to find

@ all

please do not link directly to files on the FTP-Server, because if we change anything like moving files etc. this link could be dead!


@specise_8472 & kempfand

this weekend I will tryout all the bidules you and kempfand have uploaded!!! (promised)

CYA Daphy

[dannyv]

Originally posted by specise_8472
Have just uploaded to the FTP site a VST plugin to do ambiophonics.
At the moment just does the six mentioned encodings.

@Specise_8472

I can't seem to get on te FTP site to get this new ambisonic vts plug in. Can you tell me how I can get this vts I would realy like to try it out.

Thanks,
Dan

[@ndy]

Originally posted by dannyv
@Specise_8472

I can't seem to get on te FTP site to get this new ambisonic vts plug in. Can you tell me how I can get this vts I would realy like to try it out.

Thanks,
Dan

You`ll probably find it here

@ndy

[kempfand]

It's always good to have the latest updates

- Bidule v0.6502 : Bidule Site

- Swiss & York Ambisonic VST's January 13th, 2004: this is a temporary download page

Cheers,
Andreas

[daphy]

- Swiss & York Ambisonic VST's January 13th, 2004

will be uploaded to the ftp ASAP

Here the direct download link for plogue bidule 0.6502 (I see no use in uploading this to the ftp, because plogue has a much better i-net connection as we have!)

CYA Daphy


Edit:
done

[desertrat]

Hi,

I am new to this forum... been mostly reading since Novemeber.
I've done about 10 - 15 ambisonic mixes since then, about half of them in the DTS CD format and the other half in AC3 to make a larger compilation on DVD (haven't found a good easy to use DVD authoring program that will support DTS and is easy for making music compilations - if anyone has any recommendations from what they've tried... it would be appreciated). Most of these ambisonic mixes that I have done so far are on instrumental music. (Works exceptionally well with Ambient music... Brian Eno, JM Jarre, etc).

I have also tried the I, J, & K and CS II VST. The CS II VTS mix I can't say I was very impressed with the one track (bjork - joga) that I did. The Ambisonic mix actually sounded better to my ears. I am assuming that the CS II mix would need to be encoded in AC3 and not DTS (which is what I just tried) and will be trying that next to see if the results aren't better.

I was also wondering if anyone knows where there is a explanation of the differences between the I, J & K options. Having an understanding of what they do might make it easier to choose which option is the right one for a certain type of music.

Lastly I would like to thank everyone (especially Eye of Horus for his guide) who has been involved in this discussion for the knowledge that I have acquired here

Time to get back to the CS II VST since I've only got seven days with it

Cheers,
desertrat

Originally posted by desertrat
Hi,
I was also wondering if anyone knows where there is a explanation of the differences between the I, J & K options. Having an understanding of what they do might make it easier to choose which option is the right one for a certain type of music.
Cheers,
desertrat

Welcome to the fray
I suppose I had better elaborate on this:

I = The microphone array is placed at source level (L,R), below acoustic shell reflections (C), EG an outdoor amphitheater event, with audience low and behind (SL,SR) and raked upward (SC)

J = The array is more closely placed before a small ensemble at source level for direct sound and early floor and sidewall reflections (L,R), higher direct solo and ceiling reflections (C), and hall ambience from back-up (SL,SR) and back down (SC)

K = The microphone array is in an arena with sports play-action or musical instruments at microphone level (L,R), and with good high front (C) and back (SC) crowd sounds or ceiling ambience

Obviously you will not get these results perfect, but gives you a good indication of the difference between them.
The overall feedback that comes through is that J is the best. But let your ears be the judge of that.

[desertrat]

Thanks for the info specise_8472

Also now that I've done the CS II VTS mix with AC3 instead of DTS it sounds much better to my ears. Will do a bit more with the VST before I make any judgement.

Cheers,
desertrat

[trooper11]

Im new to the forum, bu tive bene reading article here for a few months. I have been experimenting with this guide to get tracks for dd 5.1 files. what i want to do is rip tracks forma cd, convert each track to dd 5.1 and play those on my pc, since i have surround speakers. I got the output of the 6 wav files, but which program is best to convert that to a dd 5.1 type of file and i wasnt sure if i could play that in any player, or if only some players will do that. Thanks.

[Shayne]

@Trooper11

Quote

"03. GOAL OF THE GUIDE

To make 5 mono Wav files from a stereo source with Ambisonics, that can be feed into a surround encoder like Surcode CD or Soft Encode."

I think you need to read and search a bit hard. Type sonic or surcode in google. Try them and let us know.

Peace

[xxx666yyy777]

Quick question to the Guide itself:

You (EoH?) mention to rotate the sound field by 36 degrees counterclockwise using the bfprocedit VST. Why is that? I did not encounter any reference in any of the descriptions/papers about Ambisonics/Ambiphonics I could find. Is it "just" based on listening experience?

Thanks!

[kempfand]

The guide describes B-format-decoding to Pentagon.

If you check the picture in Emigrator for the Pentagon-decode, you'll see that it has L-R-speakers "in front", and SL-SC-SR-speakers "in the back" (all with reference to the WXY-soundimage).

Since most of the listener's living-room configuration is such that L-C-F-speakers are "in front", and SL-SR-speakers are "in the back", you have to correct for this, i.e. rotate the sound-image as described.

If you don't, you'll hear it.

Cheers,
Ândreas

[xxx666yyy777]

Originally posted by kempfand
The guide describes B-format-decoding to Pentagon.

If you check the picture in Emigrator for the Pentagon-decode, you'll see that it has L-R-speakers "in front", and SL-SC-SR-speakers "in the back" (all with reference to the WXY-soundimage).

Since most of the listener's living-room configuration is such that L-C-F-speakers are "in front", and SL-SR-speakers are "in the back", you have to correct for this, i.e. rotate the sound-image as described.

If you don't, you'll hear it.

Cheers,
Ândreas

Thanks to the answer...makes sense! One more question however:
Isn't is possible (and maybe more exact) to mirror the soundfield at the X and then at the Y axis and then assigning speaker 3 (based on the Enigmator picture) as the center, skeaker 2 ad FR, speaker 4 as FL, and so on...? Just asking out of curiosity...not trying to be a pain in the behind...I just think that mirroring on the X and Y axis should be faster and more precise than doing some rotation around a "non-standard" (i.e. not pi, or pi/2, ...) angle...

[kempfand]

Isn't is possible (and maybe more exact) to mirror the soundfield at the X and then at the Y axis and then assigning speaker 3 (based on the Enigmator picture) as the center, skeaker 2 ad FR, speaker 4 as FL, and so on...?

Interesting idea I think (but correct me if I'm wrong) that mirroring the X-axis would already do it. Speaker 3 would be C, speaker 2 ad FL, speaker 4 ad FR etc.

I just think that mirroring on the X and Y axis should be faster and more precise than doing some rotation around a "non-standard" (i.e. not pi, or pi/2, ...) angle...

It's a very long time since I had my math courses on quantum mechanics. I think in theory you are right. In practice, it really depends on how things with the VST's are implemented. Also, today's power of the PC is so good that I think it doesn't really matter (but as I said above, I like your idea).

There is a B-Plane Mirror First Order Ambisonic B-format Mirror Control VST, which you might want to try or play around with.

Regards,
Andreas

[Mug Funky]

http://www.planetquake.com/filterfactory/3daudio.html

has anybody seen this? it this exact guide with a different layout (it links to it as well, so i suppose it's not complete plagiarism).

i was looking for help on emigrator and found it. i suppose in a way it's allright because it gives more people awareness of ambisonics, and as the guide is lifted from here it's not spreading mis-information about it, but there's nothing there to say that Eye of Horus came up with the guide this guy is taking credit for.

[edit]

i just posted in this guy's thread on the quake 3 forums...

[daphy]

nice idea - shurely makes a big boom on the bass (if correct wired - LFE should be channel 4 in the emigrator, please compare your settings ->

1 > 3 = C
2 > 1 = FL
3 > 5 = SL
4 > 6 = SR -> your HNM-Filter boosts here
5 > 2 = FR
6 > 4 = LFE)

Please share your bidule on our FTP-Server

CYA Daphy

PS: EOH doesn´t mean 'Eye Of Horas'

[kempfand]

Daphy: The channel-mapping is correct in that "copied guide",
as that guide goes for ac3 using ac3enc.dll.

-ac3enc/-6chogg
Channel 1->"FL"
Channel 2->"C"
Channel 3->"FR"
Channel 4->"SL"
Channel 5->"SR"
Channel 6->"LFE"

Regards,
Andreas