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Old 24th July 2015, 10:54   #32101  |  Link
nevcairiel
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All kind people hello!
Version 0.88.16 during pause 0% GPU (MPC-HC 1.7.9.54);
Version 0.88.20 when paused consumes 40% of the GPU. - Перемудрил Мад;
(Win x64, Pentium E6600, nVidia GTX750 (DR 350.12).
Thats expected, madVR now keeps drawing the frame while paused.
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Old 24th July 2015, 12:54   #32102  |  Link
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But 40%? Shouldn't only presenting be done while pausing (+maybe OSD changes), no scaling/filtering?
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Old 24th July 2015, 12:56   #32103  |  Link
nevcairiel
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But 40%? Shouldn't only presenting be done while pausing (+maybe OSD changes), no scaling/filtering?
40% is a relative value, so without knowing the power state of the card, its not that meaningful.
It may have clocked down and show a high utilization.

But ultimately madshi will have to comment on what it really does in pause mode.
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Last edited by nevcairiel; 24th July 2015 at 12:59.
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Old 24th July 2015, 13:13   #32104  |  Link
avinab
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I'll assume NNEDI3 has never worked for you on (this installation of) Windows 10.
You are probably missing OpenCL, so I'd recommend installing drivers directly from nvidia's website.
The newest I could find is a hotfix: https://forums.geforce.com/default/t...eased-7-8-15-/

The nvidia site has 353.30 version as latest build.I was on that version.Same problem was happening.But yesterday i got a new display driver update from windows update.now the version is 353.50.But same problem still exists.
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Old 24th July 2015, 13:17   #32105  |  Link
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Just out of curiosity, what is everyone currently using for debanding strength and dithering mode?

Last edited by SecurityBunny; 24th July 2015 at 13:23.
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Old 24th July 2015, 14:25   #32106  |  Link
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@SecurityBunny

No debanding.

Error Diffusion 1 opt1+2 for 1080p ;
Ordered Dithering opt2 for other sources.
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Old 24th July 2015, 15:20   #32107  |  Link
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Again, I'm not sure what you're getting at. We are trying to achieve scaling that is closest to the image we have designated as groundtruth. The grountruth is what the image should look like after upscaling. We need to scale down the groundtruth in this case to produce an image that we will scale back up to approach the groundtruth unless you have a source that is identical except for size differences. If I'm wrong in assuming what you're saying, please feel free to help clarify.
my point is when watching a movie which needs to be upscaled it will not be downscaled first then. only upscaled. so the upscaled picture should be compared to the source image to clarify which algorythm comes closest to the source at this resolution. because thats simply the resolution this movie will be watched and not at the same resolution as the source image.

my point is that I am questioning this method of sclaling into the other direction first and then getting back to the original size of the image, because we dont know in how far the result of the first scaling process might influence the result of the 2nd one, the one we want to look at. you wouldnt have this problem when directly applying the scaling process you want and compare from there.
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Old 24th July 2015, 15:38   #32108  |  Link
aufkrawall
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There's surely truth in this, but usually downscaling doesn't introduce many artifacts and C-R is neither blurry nor overly sharp.
Dunno if I'd call it "groundtruth" though.
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Old 24th July 2015, 15:41   #32109  |  Link
Ver Greeneyes
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my point is when watching a movie which needs to be upscaled it will not be downscaled first then. only upscaled. so the upscaled picture should be compared to the source image to clarify which algorythm comes closest to the source at this resolution.
How do you define 'the source at this resolution'? Do you downscale the upscaled image - if so, using which algorithm? Do you compare the upscale to the 'ideal' upscale using a more expensive algorithm like waifu2x? Do you compare it to the nearest neighbor upscale from a distance where you can no longer see the individual pixels? At some point you're going to have to make a judgment call. With madshi's way of downscaling first, at least you know what the source looks like. The only question is what impact the downscaling algorithm makes, and how it compares to how other sources are downscaled.

Last edited by Ver Greeneyes; 24th July 2015 at 15:45.
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Old 24th July 2015, 19:09   #32110  |  Link
Thunderbolt8
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the source at its native resolution I meant

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The only question is what impact the downscaling algorithm makes, and how it compares to how other sources are downscaled.
this point should definately be clarified before continuing with these comparisons
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Old 24th July 2015, 19:56   #32111  |  Link
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A no-brainer solution is to take the same screenshot from original DVD and BD sources of some initially analog video. E.g. one from Mononoke would be pretty good since this anime is known to be pure analog in production. So all dissimilarities between 2 reference screenshots would be almost completely due to a difference in scanning resolution from an analog film. Moreover, an upscale from SD to FHD would be much closer to a real-life scenario.
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Old 24th July 2015, 20:03   #32112  |  Link
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A no-brainer solution is to take the same screenshot from original DVD and BD sources of some initially analog video. E.g. one from Mononoke would be pretty good since this anime is known to be pure analog in production. So all dissimilarities between 2 reference screenshots would be almost completely due to a difference in scanning resolution from an analog film. Moreover, an upscale from SD to FHD would be much closer to a real-life scenario.
Were the DVD and Blu-Ray released at the same time? If not, we run into the issue of studios "touching up" the originals for Blu-Ray release as was the case of Tropic Thunder if I'm not mistaken. The studio applied bad sharpening and noise reduction that actually lowered detail compared to the DVD release.
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Old 24th July 2015, 20:46   #32113  |  Link
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if possible, Im in favour of using upscale comparisons of 720p to 1080p and 1080p to 4k. that probably already is (720p to 1080p) and definately will be the most used cases of upscaling in the future and imho it makes sense to focus on these resolution when doing comparisons and not compare mini pictures.
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Old 24th July 2015, 21:09   #32114  |  Link
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The difficulty with 720p to 1080p is that it's not straight-up doubling, so not all algorithms can be applied directly. You either have to double the image using something like SuperXBR or NNEDI3, then downscale using another algorithm, or upscale using a scale-agnostic algorithm like Jinc.

However, if a movie is filmed in UltraHD, and they release UltraHD and FullHD versions, we'd be able to compare scaling algorithms on the downscaling algorithm that studios are using. The algorithm might still differ from studio to studio though, so it's not like there's One True Solution to this.
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Old 24th July 2015, 22:09   #32115  |  Link
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However, if a movie is filmed in UltraHD, and they release UltraHD and FullHD versions, we'd be able to compare scaling algorithms on the downscaling algorithm that studios are using. The algorithm might still differ from studio to studio though, so it's not like there's One True Solution to this.
In the end, it's basically what we are doing now. I doubt the studios scan the masters twice for DVD and Blu-Ray releases but it's anyone's guess on what they do.
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Old 24th July 2015, 22:34   #32116  |  Link
aufkrawall
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Just out of curiosity, what is everyone currently using for debanding strength and dithering mode?
High deband & quality trade-off checkboxes unchecked, I really hate banding.
I find Error Diffusion totally useless with my 8 bit QX2710 bypass display, thus just ordered dithering.

Banding can be real-hardcore in real world content:
http://www18.zippyshare.com/v/0Jil84gy/file.html
madshi's deband filter is doing an excellent job.
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Old 24th July 2015, 23:09   #32117  |  Link
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I doubt the studios scan the masters twice for DVD and Blu-Ray releases but it's anyone's guess on what they do.
They do if BD is released long after the initial DVD release, as with Mononoke. Of course, the original source must be of high quality, as heavily remastered/retouched ones obviously should be avoided in such comparisons.
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Old 25th July 2015, 02:02   #32118  |  Link
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In the end, it's basically what we are doing now. I doubt the studios scan the masters twice for DVD and Blu-Ray releases but it's anyone's guess on what they do.
Well, it's certainly not Anime, but they did for Star Trek (and did it really well, at that), but there it was advertised. Unfortunately, I don't remember enough to say that it was prominently advertised, but I believe it was.

Edit: Well, Telion mentioned the core information already some hours ago. I should go to bed now.
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Old 25th July 2015, 02:03   #32119  |  Link
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Well, it's certainly not Anime, but they did for Star Trek (and did it really well, at that), but there it was advertised. Unfortunately, I don't remember enough to say that it was prominently advertised, but I believe it was.
Are we talking about the new Star Treks or the older movies?
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Old 25th July 2015, 02:09   #32120  |  Link
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Are we talking about the new Star Treks or the older movies?
I'm talking about the series here... as far as I know, the movies I-X were rescanned only. I've got Star Trek TOS and TNG here, and I've heard that the animates series is also (going to be?) available on BD. Anyway, even TOS' "original effects" video has been remastered in so far as that the footage has been cleaned up after being re-scanned, so it's unsuitable for comparison, I'd guess.
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