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11th October 2011, 02:20 | #10061 | Link | ||
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6500K is 0.3127788761948111 / 0.32918349849804096 D65 is 0.31272661468101209 / 0.32902313032606195 I believe, but don't quote me on this as I have not run the calculations myself and therefore have no guarantee of its accuracy. So that's a difference of 0.00006481931216352. I guess we will have to make do for now then. Quote:
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Forget about my old .3dlut stuff, just use mpv if you want accurate color management Last edited by nand chan; 11th October 2011 at 02:26. |
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11th October 2011, 02:25 | #10062 | Link | |
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They are all 0.313 / 0.329 in my book.
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and only ~10 at 100% seems low as well. Maybe just low total luminance. Last edited by Asmodian; 11th October 2011 at 02:38. |
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11th October 2011, 03:06 | #10063 | Link | ||
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Colorfacts can measure with a small field, rather than a full screen (like the HCFR inbuilt stuff). A field suits a CRT projector better. Subjectively it's as bright as most HT dedicated digital projectors. As for the 20% being low, again that's a CRT thing. Some people put a bump in their gamma curve to address this, but I found that causes streaking (another CRT thing) on mine. I can raise the brightness, which will lift 20%, but then black won't be BLACK. I've never seen a digital where black is completely black, always grey. I can choose to crush a bit of the low end, and have BLACK blacks, or slightly lit blacks (like a digital) and better shadow detail. At least I have a choice |
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11th October 2011, 04:12 | #10064 | Link |
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It's actually not what you want, because in this case your display is already profiled. I have not written any updated guides for handling a properly profiled/pre-calibrated monitor.
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11th October 2011, 07:09 | #10065 | Link | ||||
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This may make it difficult to measure projectors with lower-end meters though, as they should be taken at a distance of 3 screen heights, and the cheaper meters tend to have a fairly wide angle of acceptance. To be honest though, with projectors I tend to just measure facing the projector itself using a screen offset, as you get much better readings, especially with lower-end meters or spectrophotmeters in general. If you have a completely neutral screen (such as Carada's Brilliant White material—assuming they have not made any changes) the offset may not even be necessary. Here are the required patterns. (10% steps) http://www.mediafire.com/?9zcr8fvf57glgfz Quote:
If that is the case, you probably have brightness set too low. CRTs cannot do true black when operating correctly, there is still the need for bias voltage to keep the gun at the proper operating level. Grade 1 reference monitors had a contrast of approximately 10,000:1 when set up for correct operation—worse than the second generation of Kuros, in fact. I fully appreciate the appeal of true blacks, however. I was completely dissatisfied with the Kuro Monitors' black level for example. Back when I was a CRT owner—sadly, due to several displays dying on me in the space of a year, the complete lack of a second-hand market for them here, and an impending move, I now have a local-dimmed LCD—I would set my display up for jet black, and then use a VideoEQ to get a flat 2.40 gamma with perfect greyscale. This required a hand-crafted LUT though, with the device only operating in 8-bit there was considerable banding and discolouration introduced near black with their software. In theory it could do 10-bit, but it required a 10-bit input to get 10-bit out and madVR is still sending 8-bit to my TV. I don't know how well madVR's 3D LUTs would work for this task, you would have to try it. I suspect it would need, at the very least, some tweaking of the input values to help shape the LUT, if not a completely hand-crafted LUT—most LUT generation tools seem to be tailored around digital displays and don't work too well with CRT. If I recall correctly, I actually found that my CRTs were fairly linear in their response, and it was best to set 20%, 90% and 100% values in the LUT, letting everything else be interpolated. It is critical that the LUT does not end up tapering down from 20% to 0,0,0 however. It should simply continue the slope from 90–20% right down to 1% grey and then 0 should be set at 0,0,0 otherwise there will be significant discolouration. I actually think that a hand-crafted LUT is probably best in all instances, as you are sometimes better off with minor greyscale/gamma irregularities for the sake of avoiding banding/discolouration near black, or to ensure that all levels remain distinct. Unfortunately, I've still not figured out how to create a hand-crafted LUT for use with madVR yet. (I want to set the output RGB values being sent to the display for specific points, not give it an input and have it calculate what it thinks is best) I've only recently started using the 3DLUT functionality, but it seems to make a good improvement on my LCD, I just have to stay above 20% to avoid banding problems. I suspect with a hand-crafted LUT this could be better, but I'm able to use my display's controls to fix those issues. (I shift the errors up to the higher end of the greyscale where there aren't any problems making changes) Quote:
The $5000 CP-5000 from Sencore was worse than the $500 Chroma-5 from Spectracal. (a newer OEM version from the same product family) The $7000 OTC1000/X-Rite Hubble's only saving grace is that it is a good non-contact meter. Other than the narrow angle of acceptance and laser targeting, it is not a particularly great performer—it's only specced down to 0.034 cd/m˛! Colorfacts is extremely overpriced software—I can't speak for the latest version (if it's even still around) but I'd actually say you're probably better off with HCFR compared to it. Hell, HCFR still has some features in there that are only offered in one other package that I'm aware of. (RGBCMY saturation & luminance measurements, which were only just introduced in Chromapure earlier this year) Do you have any evidence of this? |
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11th October 2011, 08:41 | #10066 | Link |
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Thanks for the patterns 6233638. They are exactly what is needed.
And yes, streaking is phosphor trailing. The NEC with a push-pull neckboard is more prone to it, particularly with a low end gamma bump. Earlier single amp neckboards are basically immune. And a Sony 1292 is completely riddled with streaking, there is a fix for it now, but a 1292 is too old and noisy even for me. I'm pretty happy with my black level. The G2 is set correctly (by me, no trivial task on a NEC), after that it is just a matter of picking your compromises. And one thing, in my experience, CRT monitors can be pretty linear. But CRT projectors are not, particularly NECs. Blue hump, for instance. Still, the image is very nice, and while I would now swap it for a digital, I wouldn't have until very recently (even then only a LCOS/SXRD....if only the affordable ones would do BLACK a bit better!) Mark |
11th October 2011, 09:46 | #10067 | Link | ||
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It's a shame that CRT is dead. It didn't stand a chance considering the bulk and power inefficiency (although it's only since we've had LED screens that flat panels improve on them, as most people buy a larger set) and what's out there is gradually disappearing, but there's nothing yet that comes close to a good CRT for wonderfully smooth gradation, variable scan rates, inky-deep black levels. There's a certain richness to the image on a good CRT that I've yet to find with a flat panel or other display. |
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11th October 2011, 13:15 | #10069 | Link | ||
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11th October 2011, 16:22 | #10070 | Link | |
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12th October 2011, 04:46 | #10071 | Link | |
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EDIT: The exact message that comes up is "copying back buffer failed (exclusive mode)" tested just about everything. is not my card tried 2 other both of different brands and cores. the problem is running D3D11 off on the secondary card when another monitor is considered the main monitor. I tested this by making the second monitor th main one and everything ran perfectly. nor weird flashing box either even with disable desktop composition enabled. Tested just on my single card. I think the problem lies in D3D11 because with the standard (i believe DX9) I can go fullscreen/exclusive and sill use the second monitor to complete work while watching something. If I enable D3D11 and click onto my fist monitor to do something while watching something in fullscreen/exclusive the video stops rendering but the audio keeps playing. For an example I have a video playing in D3D11 on my secondary monitor plugged into my main card it working great now since switching to fullscreen my firefox window has become black. If I click on it to use it the video stops rendering until i exit exclusive mode and re-enter it. Is this because of how windows handles DX11? Would this be causing the madVR error that i would be getting if i tried the same thing but using the secondary card? Last edited by TheProfosist; 12th October 2011 at 05:58. |
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12th October 2011, 12:51 | #10073 | Link | |
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I use madVR with ease on a Nvidia 9500 GT, AMD Athlon II x2 and 4 gigs of 800 MHz RAM, you'll be more than fine. |
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12th October 2011, 19:06 | #10076 | Link | |||
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Can you maybe tell me the specific questions I will need to ask the person who ISF calibrated my JVC RS25? |
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12th October 2011, 19:13 | #10077 | Link | |
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BUT, the thing that JVC really need to work on is the motion handling. Ok, it got better during my model upgradings but it s still not good enough for me. I saw the Sony VW90 with the 240Hz panels a howly cow, that s smooth as butter, wat better than my JVC. The JVC tops the Sony as for absolute black level and the 3D on the VW90 sucks. Saw a preview of the VW95 and that seems like a winner but it will cost 6-7k street price at launch next month. |
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12th October 2011, 20:33 | #10078 | Link | ||||
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1. Which set of exact primaries is it calibrated to? (I assume the white point is D65) 2. Which exact gamma curve is it calibrated to? 3. Is an ICC profile available for the exact calibration result, or is it perfect enough for this to be negligible?
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Forget about my old .3dlut stuff, just use mpv if you want accurate color management Last edited by nand chan; 12th October 2011 at 20:37. |
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12th October 2011, 21:01 | #10079 | Link |
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I ll post the calibration results tomorrow I think. Already got an answer from my calibration guy:
1. D6500 REC709 2. Gamma 2.3 3. No ICC profile is made, because it's calibrated as a "normal" Home Theater projector, not as a computer display. It's highly irregular that with an ISF calibration an ICC profile is created, this is normally done with computer displays, or when the projector is setup as computer display. Is this good enough info nand chan |
12th October 2011, 22:06 | #10080 | Link | |
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Depending on your setup, this can either be a good thing or a bad thing: 1. If your ambient light conditions are perfectly normalized to an ICC reference encoding room setup, it's bad - in this case, you want a perfectly source-linear light level. 2. If your ambient light conditions are average or dimly lit, it's probably the perfect setting. Do you know if he measured your ambient light level during viewing? 3. If your ambient light conditions are very dark to pitch black, it's too low - in this setting you want a curve somewhere around 2.45 to 2.5. Ideally, you want to perfectly recreate the Trimaster's reference CRT curve, but that's not as easily doable. It depends on your viewing conditions. If in doubt, you can leave his “imperfect” 2.2 -> 2.3 transition (which is actually better in this case, due to, again, overencoding of movies). His lack of providing an ICC profile baffles me a bit though - they're just as important for video displays as they are for computer displays, since you're using a HTPC to drive your projector which technically makes it a computer display - and an ICC-calculated .3dlut is the only way to get the most out of your viewing experience, especially since it allows you to match gamuts such as xvYCC etc. as well if the need ever arises, without having to pay for an expensive re-calibration. Ps. How often is he going to update the values? A calibration should be updated at least once a month.
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Forget about my old .3dlut stuff, just use mpv if you want accurate color management |
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direct compute, dithering, error diffusion, madvr, ngu, nnedi3, quality, renderer, scaling, uhd upscaling, upsampling |
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