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Old 24th October 2015, 16:22   #33881  |  Link
mcn
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I have some videos that aren't in the same aspect ratio as my monitor.
When I watch them in full screen black bars are added at the top and at the bottom.
Embedded subtitles are always partially shown in the black area at the bottom.
So far so good.

But in certain cases external subtitles aren't shown in the black area.

I can't find a pattern for this.
I only know that it depends on the .srt file.

For example if I have video A which shows external subs correctly in the black area, and video B that doesn't, I can use B's subs with video A and they will not be shown correctly.
And vice-versa.

I thought this might be related to the line ending used in the file but it doesn't.

Is this a known issue or am I doing something wrong?

I'm using (32-bit) madVR 0.89.12, LAV filters 0.66, XySubFilter 3.1.0.746, MPC-HC 1.79.
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Old 24th October 2015, 16:36   #33882  |  Link
agustin9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by madshi View Post
Ah, thanks, I see what you mean!

The bottom margin option is a private subtitle renderer value which madVR doesn't know about. But the moving of the subtitles is done by madVR, so madVR doesn't use that "bottom margin" option because it doesn't even know it exists, or which value it's set to.

Are you not happy with madVR's positioning? Looking at your screenshots, I think the madVR position is by far the best one. Do you find it too high or too low?
madVr positioning is fine, but shouldn't madVr send the active area rectangle to XySubfilter and it draw according to that rectangle?
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Old 24th October 2015, 18:29   #33883  |  Link
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High GPU consumption is now under control, thanks to madshi. The problem was a sightly changed procamp contrast slider. This considerably drives GPU usage.
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Old 24th October 2015, 21:57   #33884  |  Link
Barnahadnagy
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Hi guys! I was testing HEVC and whatnot, and I encountered something I can't explain. I switched back to AVC and x264 for this test, just in case.

So a short rundown on the problem: 10bit encode makes outline of the letters in my sample more saturated, and chroma position shifts a bit. 8bit encodes do not. EVR-CP (and VLC) does not exhibit this problem.
Sample pictures upscaled x5 in GIMP with NN (BD, 8bit):

10bit, 10bit EVR


What I tried: Different scaling algo, D3D9 or D3D11 (fullscreen windowed to allow screenshots), monitor bit-depth, disabled 10bit output in LAV (output was NV12 in this case), turned AR filter and chroma superres on/off (chroma SRes creates halos tho), changed dithering. I also had a friend test it, with KCP, it produced the same results.

Settings: (On pictures) Jinc chroma upscale with anti rigging filter, D3D9 fullscreen windowed (new path), 8bit monitor, ordered dithering, no trade quality for performance, all image enhacements and artifact removal algos are disabled. Only chroma scaling is active.
Currently on MPC HC 1.7.9, using its internal LAVfilters, MadVR 89.12 (88.12 produced same results with D3D9 and Jinc).
System is: i5 2500k, GTX 970, Windows 10 x64, latest WHQL driver.
Sample is Non Non Biyori Blu-Ray, episode 1, frame 4750.

Encoding settings: For 8 bit re-encode I used latest x264 command line, with MKV input and output. For 10bit, I did the same, and I also acquired a different encode, made quite some time ago. All exhibit the same problem.
For HEVC, I used last 1.7 x265, and 1.8.65 x265, both produced indentical results, which also exhibit this problem. In the x265 pipeline, the encoder was fed a y4m file, decoded with FFMPEG.

Sample with 8bit and 10bit reencode, plus some more screenshots.

This seems to be a problem in MadVR, but for some reason, it didn't go away if LAV had to do the conversion from 10 to 8 bits, so I'm quite clueless as to what is going on here.
On a side note, chroma seems to be slightly shifted in EVR compared to MadVR, independent on encode. Which one is correct here (I guess MadVR, it looks more correct)?

EDIT: For those who have GIMP (or can open XCF files), here is one with lots of layers of different images, and some notes on what to look for. It also has HEVC tests in it, so if you are interested in that here you go.
Another note: using printscreen or MPC's ALT+I function made no difference.

Last edited by Barnahadnagy; 24th October 2015 at 22:15.
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Old 24th October 2015, 22:24   #33885  |  Link
nijiko
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I finally found why snap image failed.
Conditions: An interlaced video, MPC-HC using "minimized" mode view (removed MPC-HC's title and border), madVR using DXVA method rendering.
Then, if you snap image in playing, you will failed.

Last edited by nijiko; 24th October 2015 at 22:27. Reason: fix
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Old 24th October 2015, 23:05   #33886  |  Link
madshi
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ajp_anton View Post
Easiest sample ever: create a 1280x718 blank video with Avisynth and encode =).
http://s.ajpanton.se/sample.mkv
LAV decoder, hardware or software doesn't matter. MPC-HC. Windows 10. Everything 64-bit.
Ah, thanks. Looks like a purely cosmetical OSD display problem, I'll fix that for the next build.

Quote:
Originally Posted by AngelGraves13 View Post
Really liking the "crop black bars" option. It's useful for films and TV shows, especially older ones that don't fill the screen entirely. I don't zoom as I don't like losing any content at all.

For example, The Sopranos on blu-ray. The first 2 seasons have inconsistent black borders on the left side of some episodes, and the setting crops it out and scales the image. Great!

Also great for watching old 4:3 DVD episodes of Batman: The Animated Series. Some episodes have black borders and having them cropped out is great. Difference of a few pixels, and it's upscaling to 1440p anyway.

The best use of the feature so far has been to correct a mastering error for Hell on Wheels Season 2. Some episodes had very strange framing. I though my purchase was defective, but it seems they all have it.
Glad you like it! Was *a lot* of work to implement...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dogway View Post
Thanks for runtime. Unless I got it wrong, it's not working for me.
Ok, will double check. The MPC-HC version doesn't matter.

Quote:
Originally Posted by JarrettH View Post
Do I have to watch a video as a test pattern or can it be a still (paused film)? I remember the ytp patterns being in motion or swirling or something like that.
Banding artifacts are easier to see in motion, so using a moving video can have advantages.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sunset1982 View Post
OK, found the solution to my D3D11 crashes...

reinstalled nvidia drivers -> worked

setup stereoscopic 3D in the nv control panel -> crashes till I newly installed nvidia drivers and keep stereoscopic 3D disabled.

So the problem is mpc-hc/madvr/lav/d3d11 keeps crashing when stereoscopic 3D was setup before.Can anyone reproduce this?
Yes, has been reported by several users. I doubt madVR is at fault, but I don't know for sure.

Quote:
Originally Posted by aufkrawall View Post
Thanks.

Quote:
Originally Posted by markanini View Post
Any chance of ivtc functionality being extrended to include something like TDecimate(hybrid=1)?
I don't know TDecimate. What does hybrid=1 do?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ruya View Post
According to the changelog, after v0.88.1 D3D11 is not used if DWM is disabled. (Hence why I chose this version to revert to)

D3D11 isn't working in windowed mode, which is to be expected with DWM disabled, but full-screen exclusive mode is working perfectly.

It would be nice if this could somehow be changed so that I can have D3D9 when windowed and still use D3D11 in fullscreen, but I don't use windowed mode very often so for the time being I'm fine with editing the settings whenever I need windowed mode.

I haven't yet run into any major complications with v0.88.1
Ah ok, that makes sense. But sorry to say, supporting D3D9 windowed in combination to D3D11 fullscreen is not planned. Too much complication for too little benefit.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jmonier View Post
Please verify that the reply you're talking about is the ACK (06) reply and not the "Response Command" (40).
Yes. For every command I'm sending (either reading or setting something) I first require a 06 reply. When reading stuff, afterwards I require an additional 40 response. When setting/changing stuff, there's always a 06 reply, but no 40. When changing lens memories on my X35, the 06 reply comes exactly at the moment when the lens memory activation has been completed.

Still not sure why there are situations in which my IP control test tool doesn't work while yours works. I can't find anything in either the PDF I've been using or in the X500 user manual that would indicate that I'm doing anything less than perfectly.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jmonier View Post
It doesn't make sense if I've changed the memory back after the video stops playing (since menus, etc. need a 16:9 screen). Then it thinks that the zoom is still at 2.35 and won't change it for the next 2.35 video.
Can you give me some more details about your specific use scenario? It seems you let the media player process running, and then you manually switch the lens memory to display something with a different application. And then you want to continue video playback and you want madVR in that moment to activate the lens memory again? Which applications are you using and which kind of menu are you talking about etc? I suppose that's a legit use case, although probably not very typical.

The key problem for me is that JVC doesn't support reading the current lens memory number (Sony projectors do!!). So I don't know if you've manually changed the lens memory or not. Of course I could simply issue the lens memory activation again, but doing so does blend in the lens memory focus test pattern for a short moment (on my X35 at least), even if the lens memory I'm requesting is already active, so it's not something I'd like to do if I don't have to.

So what's a good check for me to do to find out whether I should reactivate the lens memory or not? E.g. I guess I could do that every time a new video is loaded? Would that solve the problem for you?

Anyway, considering the logic I explained, does that solve the mystery of why lens activation sometimes worked as you expected and sometimes not? So it's not a logic bug, but "as intended"? Of course "as intended" doesn't automatically have to mean that it's good.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mcn View Post
I have some videos that aren't in the same aspect ratio as my monitor.
When I watch them in full screen black bars are added at the top and at the bottom.
Embedded subtitles are always partially shown in the black area at the bottom.
So far so good.

But in certain cases external subtitles aren't shown in the black area.

I can't find a pattern for this.
I only know that it depends on the .srt file.

For example if I have video A which shows external subs correctly in the black area, and video B that doesn't, I can use B's subs with video A and they will not be shown correctly.
And vice-versa.

I thought this might be related to the line ending used in the file but it doesn't.

Is this a known issue or am I doing something wrong?
Do you have black bar detection activated in the madVR settings? Are you sure that XySubFilter is used for *all* those subtitles? Maybe sometimes one sub renderer is used, and sometimes another one? E.g. maybe one renderer or external subs and a different one for internal subs? Just a thought, though.

Quote:
Originally Posted by agustin9 View Post
madVr positioning is fine, but shouldn't madVr send the active area rectangle to XySubfilter and it draw according to that rectangle?
That would be ideal, but XySubFilter doesn't support that in its current form, and the XySubFilter developer is MIA. So I implemented subtitle moving in madVR instead.

Quote:
Originally Posted by CiNcH View Post
High GPU consumption is now under control, thanks to madshi. The problem was a sightly changed procamp contrast slider. This considerably drives GPU usage.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Barnahadnagy View Post
Hi guys! I was testing HEVC and whatnot, and I encountered something I can't explain. I switched back to AVC and x264 for this test, just in case.

So a short rundown on the problem: 10bit encode makes outline of the letters in my sample more saturated, and chroma position shifts a bit. 8bit encodes do not.
Can't seem to be able to reproduce that here. Here's what I'm getting with Jinc AR chroma upscaling with your 8bit and 10bit sample:

http://madshi.net/Barnahadnagy8bit.png
http://madshi.net/Barnahadnagy10bit.png

Every so slightly different, but the difference is much lower than in your screenshots. Do you have any unusual filters in your playback chain? Any profiles in madVR? Try LAV Video Decoder and madVR with default settings for both, and with no funny filters in between (like ffdshow raw or stuff).

Quote:
Originally Posted by nijiko View Post
I finally found why snap image failed.
Conditions: An interlaced video, MPC-HC using "minimized" mode view (removed MPC-HC's title and border), madVR using DXVA method rendering.
Then, if you snap image in playing, you will failed.
Interesting. It happens only in minimized mode view?
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Old 24th October 2015, 23:16   #33887  |  Link
nijiko
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Quote:
Originally Posted by madshi View Post
Interesting. It happens only in minimized mode view?
Not test with other conditions. This is one of conditions to trigger.
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Old 25th October 2015, 00:42   #33888  |  Link
markanini
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Quote:
Originally Posted by madshi View Post
I don't know TDecimate. What does hybrid=1 do?
It a way to deal with 29.97 sources which contain mostly 24p material.
From the manual: "Blend decimation of 30p sections into 24p and leave 24p untouched"
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Old 25th October 2015, 01:35   #33889  |  Link
Barnahadnagy
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Quote:
Originally Posted by madshi View Post
Can't seem to be able to reproduce that here. Here's what I'm getting with Jinc AR chroma upscaling with your 8bit and 10bit sample:

http://madshi.net/Barnahadnagy8bit.png
http://madshi.net/Barnahadnagy10bit.png

Every so slightly different, but the difference is much lower than in your screenshots. Do you have any unusual filters in your playback chain? Any profiles in madVR? Try LAV Video Decoder and madVR with default settings for both, and with no funny filters in between (like ffdshow raw or stuff).
I feel stupid now. This turned out to be two issues. I started with HEVC, but apparently that has a similar artifact here. So troubleshooting that I installed a clean version of MPC HC nightly. Which makes LAV use DXVA native by default, and fall back to software with 10bit. We all know what happens with DXVA native don't we...
So in order to troubleshoot my HEVC issues, I unknowingly created a completely different one, which looked similar enough to the original that I didn't notice. Well there goes my hard work with providing beautiful samples.

Also, I wouldn't have expected the DXVA native issue to be this serious. If I remember correctly a slight blur was mentioned, but this doesn't seem to be so slight. Not to mention misaligned chroma...
All is well in the end, at least I learned something today. Sorry for creating more work for you But at least we know now that EVR (and VLC) suffers from this DXVA native quality loss too...

Last edited by Barnahadnagy; 25th October 2015 at 01:38.
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Old 25th October 2015, 03:01   #33890  |  Link
agustin9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by madshi View Post
That would be ideal, but XySubFilter doesn't support that in its current form, and the XySubFilter developer is MIA. So I implemented subtitle moving in madVR instead.
That makes sense. Thanks for all your hard work, hope someday it get's done the right way. Thank you very much!
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Old 25th October 2015, 09:04   #33891  |  Link
Sunset1982
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Quote:
Originally Posted by madshi

Yes, has been reported by several users. I doubt madVR is at fault, but I don't know for sure.
ah ok. Have you done some furhter investigations? Is there anything I could do to help you find out what is causing this error? Let me know if so.
In the meantime I will try to open a thread in the nvidia forums. Maybe they have an idea.
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Old 25th October 2015, 14:24   #33892  |  Link
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Is the error reporting working? I get the error message "Sorry sending the bug report didn't work"
Had madVR crash MPC-BE when I changed from fullscreen to windowed mode.

http://pastebin.com/fh0P5Y79
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Old 25th October 2015, 14:43   #33893  |  Link
Dlget
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Something causing memory leak.
Here is error log.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/12ef5azfz2...g.txt.bz2?dl=0

EDIT:
Probably XYSubfilter
This occur even with EVR Custom but not with EVR.
EDIT2:
Disabled Xysubfilter & no memory leak.
Can anyone report it to XY Subfilter(XySubFilter_3.1.0.746_x64_BETA3)
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Last edited by Dlget; 25th October 2015 at 15:06.
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Old 25th October 2015, 15:14   #33894  |  Link
mcn
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Quote:
Originally Posted by madshi View Post
Do you have black bar detection activated in the madVR settings? Are you sure that XySubFilter is used for *all* those subtitles? Maybe sometimes one sub renderer is used, and sometimes another one? E.g. maybe one renderer or external subs and a different one for internal subs? Just a thought, though.
I'm not too knowledgeable but I'm pretty sure XySubFilter is used in all the cases.
I can switch between subtitles while the video is playing while using XySubFilter context menu while in MPC-HC.
And I can see how embedded subtitles are correctly shown at the bottom of the screen while (some) external ones aren't.

Regarding madVR settings, under the zoom control tab, the only checked item is move subtitles: and the corresponding drop down is set to ... to bottom of the screen/window.
I also tried checking automatically detect hard coded black bars but it didn't help.
Indeed, since the videos don't have black bars in themselves it shouldn't do anything, right?

While I was at it I also enabled full screen exclusive mode, which I usually don't use, but it doesn't help either.
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Old 25th October 2015, 19:12   #33895  |  Link
VHT
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Noob Question. What are the benefits of using D3D11 path instead of D3D9 if I only have 8bit display and find that using ordered dithering is good enough?
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Old 25th October 2015, 23:24   #33896  |  Link
Patrik G
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Question and a Problem
Why is madvr Locked to SRGB gamut when using a 3D LUT for calibration?

i have created a 3D LUT for a wider colorspace close to DCI P3 that my tv can deliver.
still selecting the P3 3D LUT in the DCI P3 section in madvr it only gets to SRGB gamut.

without the 3D LUT i get the full DCI gamut.
or is it a bug with argyll cms?

it almost seems that madvr doesnt read all the info from the 3D LUT files.
the P3 3d lut and the rec709 3d LUT are alot different and should not get the same gamut.

Edit: i know its a bug with argyll CMS but i want to try to ask here also so i can rule out madvr and have it on paper to show the stubborn argyll CMS creator lol

Last edited by Patrik G; 25th October 2015 at 23:31.
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Old 25th October 2015, 23:31   #33897  |  Link
markanini
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Patrik G View Post
Question and a Problem
Why is madvr Locked to SRGB gamut when using a 3D LUT for calibration?

i have created a 3D LUT for a wider colorspace close to DCI P3 that my tv can deliver.
still selecting the P3 3D LUT in the DCI P3 section in madvr it only gets to SRGB gamut.

without the 3D LUT i get the full DCI gamut.
or is it a bug with argyll cms?

it almost seems that madvr doesnt read all the info from the 3D LUT files.
the P3 3d lut and the rec709 3d LUT are alot different and should not get the same gamut.

Edit: i know its a bug with argyll CMS but i want to try to ask here also so i can rule out madvr and have it on paper to show the stubborn argyll CMS creator lol
Have you seen http://www.avsforum.com/forum/139-di...argyllcms.html ?
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Old 25th October 2015, 23:33   #33898  |  Link
jmonier
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Quote:
Originally Posted by madshi View Post
Yes. For every command I'm sending (either reading or setting something) I first require a 06 reply. When reading stuff, afterwards I require an additional 40 response. When setting/changing stuff, there's always a 06 reply, but no 40. When changing lens memories on my X35, the 06 reply comes exactly at the moment when the lens memory activation has been completed.
With my RS-4910 the 06 reply comes back within 2 ms of any operation command and it definitely does NOT wait for the completion of the Load Lens Memory operation. This is certainly different than your X35 and possibly different than your friend's X500 (since it seems to work fine with madVR).

This, of course, means that the Pause is minimal and barely noticeable.

Quote:
Still not sure why there are situations in which my IP control test tool doesn't work while yours works. I can't find anything in either the PDF I've been using or in the X500 user manual that would indicate that I'm doing anything less than perfectly.
I'm not sure, either, and it needs further investigation. From what I've seen in some further tests, madVR (and to a lesser extent your test tool) are flaky on my system even when my TCPIP control is totally disabled.

This is the first time I've really looked at the logs of my TCPIP control when used with the RS4910 and it's not really working perfectly. The only reason I haven't noticed this before is because it usually gets it right on the second retry so it seems like it's ok when it really isn't.

Since it worked fine on my RS50, I have to investigate how the differences in the RS4910 are interacting with my code. I'll report back on what I find.

EDIT: I looked at it carefully last night and everything was working fine then so I don't know what to think.

Here's a couple of things in my code that may help you: 1) I found that I needed to have a 100 ms delay after the completion of the initial handshaking (PJ_OK, PJREQ, PLACK) before I sent the actual command/request, 2) if you need to send 2 commands/requests in sequence, you can send the second 100ms after the first without repeating the initial handshaking.

One thing you might change in your test tool is to have it send the PW inquiry prior to the INML command since I believe that's the way madVR does it.

FYI: I believe that one of the commercial calibration tools (Calman, I think) had a lot of trouble integrating their tool via TCPIP to the RS49/X500 series. The last I heard, they had actually given up on it. I might have missed something since then, however.

Quote:
Can you give me some more details about your specific use scenario? It seems you let the media player process running, and then you manually switch the lens memory to display something with a different application. And then you want to continue video playback and you want madVR in that moment to activate the lens memory again? Which applications are you using and which kind of menu are you talking about etc? I suppose that's a legit use case, although probably not very typical.
It's only one application - Zoomplayer. ZP has a Media Library display that allows me to select the video that I'm going to play next. Via my TCPIP control of Zoomplayer, at the end of a video I can cause the Media Library display to appear so I can select the next video. At the same time I command the JVC to load the lens memory for a full 1920x1080 screen. This seems like a very typical way to do it.

If I depend on madVR to do everything, the Media Library will be partly off screen after a 2.35 video (since madVR apparently doesn't do anything at the end of a video). If I manually set the Lens Memory back to 16:9, madVR still thinks the JVC is at 2.35 and won't change it for the next 2.35 video. (Things are further confused by the fact that madVR control of the JVC is flaky in my case.)

Quote:
The key problem for me is that JVC doesn't support reading the current lens memory number (Sony projectors do!!). So I don't know if you've manually changed the lens memory or not. Of course I could simply issue the lens memory activation again, but doing so does blend in the lens memory for a short moment (on my X35 at least), even if the lens memory I'm requesting is already active, so it's not something I'd like to do if I don't have to.
I understand your problem. The RS4910 does not show the focus test pattern in this case so I would be OK but we want this to be good for all users.

Quote:
So what's a good check for me to do to find out whether I should reactivate the lens memory or not? E.g. I guess I could do that every time a new video is loaded? Would that solve the problem for you?
Activating the lens memory for 16:9 when a video stops would do it for me (assuming that madVR works OK otherwise). This wouldn't necessarily work for other users, though.

Quote:
Anyway, considering the logic I explained, does that solve the mystery of why lens activation sometimes worked as you expected and sometimes not? So it's not a logic bug, but "as intended"? Of course "as intended" doesn't automatically have to mean that it's good.
It does solve a good part of the mystery but there's still the flaky operation.

At this point what I (as a member of the very small group of users that have done their own control programming) would like is an additional optional TCPIP interface for this part of madVR. It would work like this:

1. I would enter a TCPIP address and port number to mad VR
2. Each time madVR detected that the lens memory should be at a particular setting for the video being played it would output just the lens memory number to this port.
3. If necessary, I would send that number back as an acknowledgement

I would handle everything else in my logic (including setting it back to 16:9 at the end of a video).

I think that this would be the simplest solution for you and me to implement but, of course, it would be applicable for only a small subset of users.

EDIT: After looking at it some more, I think that I could make my JVC simulator code work just fine as an interface. The one thing that I would need from you is an option to ALWAYS send a Load Lens Memory command even when you think that it's already there. You may need to have this anyway because of the problems in determining where you are.

Last edited by jmonier; 26th October 2015 at 18:03.
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Old 25th October 2015, 23:34   #33899  |  Link
Patrik G
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Originally Posted by markanini View Post
thanks but i know all about it already.
the problem is that different 3D LUTs based on different colorspaces still gets the same rec709 colorspace when i select them in madvr.
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Old 26th October 2015, 00:06   #33900  |  Link
baii
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Originally Posted by Patrik G View Post
thanks but i know all about it already.
the problem is that different 3D LUTs based on different colorspaces still gets the same rec709 colorspace when i select them in madvr.
Because madvr is doing it correctly? The content ask(or madvr guess) for rec709, so it does srgb transformation. If you have wide gamut content, it will use the appropriate color space.

The 3dlut is not here so the user can "choose" the color space.

And the "rec 709 3dlut" actually have the information needed for wide gamut transformation.
Sent from my 306SH

Last edited by baii; 26th October 2015 at 00:08.
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direct compute, dithering, error diffusion, madvr, ngu, nnedi3, quality, renderer, scaling, uhd upscaling, upsampling

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