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Old 1st October 2011, 13:01   #9901  |  Link
THX-UltraII
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Hi,

Been using madVR from the start but decided a year ago to switch to a Dune player. This still does not satisfy me so I decided to switch back to HTPC.

After a clean install of my system and installing all lastest drivers, MPC-HC, ffDSHOW and madVR some first questions are here:

1.
what pixel format output do I pick at the ATI CCC settings?
yCbCr 4:4:4 Pixel Format
yCbCr 4:2:2 Pixel Format
RGB 4:4:4 Pixel Format Studio (Limited RGB)
RGB 4:4:4 Pixel Format PC Standard (Full RGB)

2.
the ATI CCC got some new function I see. There is 'Brighter Whites' which can be enabled/disabled. I can imagine this will be important to set this on or off. What to choose here?

3.
Dynamic range can be altered in the ATI CCC settings Just leave this off?

4.
PullDown detection and Smooth Video Playback in the ATI CCC. On or Off?

5.
FFdshow: only check output YV12?

6.
madVR. I see that madVR got decoding options! Check all and use ffmpeg software decoder? Or is ffdshow decoder still better to use?

7.
What are some good algorithms settings to use? Looking for some (basic) settings that can be used for all type of movies that do not cause too much artifacts.

8.
See a lot of new rendering options since the first versions of madVR. Is there a guide somewhere to find out what they do/which make quality better?

Maybe more questions will come but I think this is enough for now

Thanks!

EDIT: And of course my setup:
HTPC (w7 x64) with ATI 5450, Core2Quad Q9550 oc, 8gb DDR3 1333.
JVC RS25 projector

Last edited by THX-UltraII; 1st October 2011 at 13:07.
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Old 1st October 2011, 13:10   #9902  |  Link
nand chan
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Quote:
Originally Posted by THX-UltraII View Post
1.
what pixel format output do I pick at the ATI CCC settings?
yCbCr 4:4:4 Pixel Format
yCbCr 4:2:2 Pixel Format
RGB 4:4:4 Pixel Format Studio (Limited RGB)
RGB 4:4:4 Pixel Format PC Standard (Full RGB)
Set it to full range RGB. Chances are, madVR is better at concerting the Y'CbCr than your TV's processor is.

And if you need a limited range display, you can set the display to limited range in madVR.

Quote:
4.
PullDown detection and Smooth Video Playback in the ATI CCC. On or Off?
I'll assume off, madVR takes care of pulldown and it (+ reclock) attempt to take care of smooth video playback.

Quote:
5.
FFdshow: only check output YV12?
Yes.

Quote:
6.
madVR. I see that madVR got decoding options! Check all and use ffmpeg software decoder? Or is ffdshow decoder still better to use?
Check all and use ffmpeg. ffdshow's decoder is worse than the madVR internals. However, if you want the best, I recommend you use the LAV Filters for decoding - they are even better than the madVR internals.

Quote:
7.
What are some good algorithms settings to use? Looking for some (basic) settings that can be used for all type of movies that do not cause too much artifacts.
I use Mitchell-Netravali for chroma upscaling and Spline (4 taps) for Luma upscaling.

I have found the other algorithms (other than Lanczos and Spline) don't produce a sharp enough result for luma upscaling, but softness is fine for chroma.
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Old 1st October 2011, 13:16   #9903  |  Link
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Those "video" settings in AMD VISION Engine Control Center will have no affect on madVR. madVR behaves basically like a game.

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Old 1st October 2011, 13:20   #9904  |  Link
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My madVR is stuttering on my XPS 15 laptop.
It only stutters in D3D Fullscreen but it's fine in windowed mode.
My specs are:
i7 2630QM processor
Nvidia GT525M

Help?
You don't need to enable D3D Fullscreen in MPC-HC options to use exclusive mode in madVR, if that is what you have done.
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Old 1st October 2011, 13:31   #9905  |  Link
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Originally Posted by nand chan View Post
Set it to full range RGB. Chances are, madVR is better at concerting the Y'CbCr than your TV's processor is.

And if you need a limited range display, you can set the display to limited range in madVR.



I'll assume off, madVR takes care of pulldown and it (+ reclock) attempt to take care of smooth video playback.



Yes.



Check all and use ffmpeg. ffdshow's decoder is worse than the madVR internals. However, if you want the best, I recommend you use the LAV Filters for decoding - they are even better than the madVR internals.



I use Mitchell-Netravali for chroma upscaling and Spline (4 taps) for Luma upscaling.

I have found the other algorithms (other than Lanczos and Spline) don't produce a sharp enough result for luma upscaling, but softness is fine for chroma.
thxz!
How do I set madVR to Limited range and why exactly should I do that?

Are those LAV filters new? Never heard from them. Where can I get them and is there a guide somewhere how to use them?
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Old 1st October 2011, 13:37   #9906  |  Link
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Originally Posted by THX-UltraII View Post
thxz!
How do I set madVR to Limited range and why exactly should I do that?
If your TV is limited range instead of full range (PC monitors are full range), you can set it as such in madVR's settings -> devices -> <your TV> -> properties.

Quote:
Are those LAV filters new? Never heard from them. Where can I get them and is there a guide somewhere how to use them?
https://forum.doom9.org/showthread.p...56191&page=289

Just run the installer, it *should* take care of everything.
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Old 1st October 2011, 15:12   #9907  |  Link
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Are those LAV filters new? Never heard from them.
It's the new reference decoder for quite all popular codec (my opinion).
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Old 1st October 2011, 15:24   #9908  |  Link
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Originally Posted by nand chan View Post
If your TV is limited range instead of full range (PC monitors are full range), you can set it as such in madVR's settings -> devices -> <your TV> -> properties.



https://forum.doom9.org/showthread.p...56191&page=289

Just run the installer, it *should* take care of everything.
you mean set it to TV levels? With this settings the colours are grey and washed out.

What about the LAV Output Formats setting? Check only RGB? Athe RGB Output Levls? Is it best to set it on 'untouched' (as input)?
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Old 1st October 2011, 15:35   #9909  |  Link
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Originally Posted by THX-UltraII View Post
you mean set it to TV levels? With this settings the colours are grey and washed out.
Well then you have a full range monitor.....

Quote:
What about the LAV Output Formats setting? Check only RGB? Athe RGB Output Levls? Is it best to set it on 'untouched' (as input)?
Good heavens no, check all formats. You should *always* output a format similar to the source. If your source is a YV12 frame, you should output YV12 as well.

As for the RGB output, just use full range.
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Old 1st October 2011, 15:36   #9910  |  Link
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Slightly off topic here but, what is the thing that made madvr decoder and lav decoder to be better than ffdshow? I used ffdshow for ages and the only crashing I get are the avisynth related one.
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Old 1st October 2011, 15:43   #9911  |  Link
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Originally Posted by naoan View Post
Slightly off topic here but, what is the thing that made madvr decoder and lav decoder to be better than ffdshow? I used ffdshow for ages and the only crashing I get are the avisynth related one.
The LAV Decoder has a lot better performance than the madVR decoder, and the madVR decoder has a lot better performance than the ffdshow decoder.

In addition, both LAV and madVR support 10-bit properly, while ffdshow doesn't - it only supports 8 bit formats, so the decoder dithers the input down when playing a Hi10P file. Normally, this wouldn't be a problem, but it doesn't dither correctly either, so you'll get image artifacts.

It's mainly a quality and performance issue, not an issue of crashing.
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Old 1st October 2011, 16:24   #9912  |  Link
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I see, I never have problem with performance and there's hacked ffdshow 10 bit build available so I don't have that problem as well, thanks for clarifying.
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Old 1st October 2011, 16:42   #9913  |  Link
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I see, I never have problem with performance and there's hacked ffdshow 10 bit build available so I don't have that problem as well, thanks for clarifying.
That's the build I was referring to. It doesn't actually support 10 bit textures.
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Old 1st October 2011, 18:34   #9914  |  Link
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The one on CCCP? well, that suck. It's the only way to use advanced debanding like flash3kyuu_deband on the fly afaik.
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Old 1st October 2011, 18:57   #9915  |  Link
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The one on CCCP? well, that suck. It's the only way to use advanced debanding like flash3kyuu_deband on the fly afaik.
I know. Then again, flash3kyuu_deband doesn't even support 10-bit either way so there's no point. Btw, what you want to do is:

1. Use LAV Video decoder to decode and dither down to 8-bit (it does this properly unlike ffdshow)
2. Use the ffdshow *raw* video filter to host avisynth scripts

That way you can use flash3kyuu in realtime. You won't have 10-bit textures but the difference will be very minimal. Just make sure you dither back down to 8-bit using proper levels in avisynth (don't let ffdshow take care of *any* dithering).

Set the ffdshow video decoder to “block” and the raw video decoder (aka raw filter) as “prefer”.
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Old 1st October 2011, 19:40   #9916  |  Link
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I know. Then again, flash3kyuu_deband doesn't even support 10-bit either way so there's no point. Btw, what you want to do is:

1. Use LAV Video decoder to decode and dither down to 8-bit (it does this properly unlike ffdshow)
2. Use the ffdshow *raw* video filter to host avisynth scripts

That way you can use flash3kyuu in realtime. You won't have 10-bit textures but the difference will be very minimal. Just make sure you dither back down to 8-bit using proper levels in avisynth (don't let ffdshow take care of *any* dithering).

Set the ffdshow video decoder to “block” and the raw video decoder (aka raw filter) as “prefer”.
This is out of league
Can I use MPC-HC, madVR and LAV filters for the best PQ?
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Old 1st October 2011, 19:45   #9917  |  Link
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This is out of league
Can I use MPC-HC, madVR and LAV filters for the best PQ?
Yeah, it'll be good enough. Avisynth scripts are just needed for the absolute control freaks.

You'll need a very strong CPU to do color space conversions, gamut mapping, debanding, dithering etc. in realtime, but if you can handle it then by all means skip madVR and just output RGB32 from your avisynth chain.
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Old 1st October 2011, 19:46   #9918  |  Link
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As for the RGB output, just use full range.
I don t have that option listed in LAV. I can only choose TV, PC or Untouched
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Old 1st October 2011, 19:50   #9919  |  Link
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Originally Posted by nand chan View Post
I know. Then again, flash3kyuu_deband doesn't even support 10-bit either way so there's no point. Btw, what you want to do is:

1. Use LAV Video decoder to decode and dither down to 8-bit (it does this properly unlike ffdshow)
2. Use the ffdshow *raw* video filter to host avisynth scripts

That way you can use flash3kyuu in realtime. You won't have 10-bit textures but the difference will be very minimal. Just make sure you dither back down to 8-bit using proper levels in avisynth (don't let ffdshow take care of *any* dithering).

Set the ffdshow video decoder to “block” and the raw video decoder (aka raw filter) as “prefer”.
I actually usually do this before for 8 bit video, but used coreavc to take care of the decoding since it is faster than ffdshow. But thanks for the info about the wrong dithering on ffdshow, I'd be oblivious otherwise.

Now if madvr has avisynth support my dream media setup is complete, but that's asking a bit too much I guess.
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Old 1st October 2011, 19:53   #9920  |  Link
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I use Mitchell-Netravali for chroma upscaling and Spline (4 taps) for Luma upscaling.

I have found the other algorithms (other than Lanczos and Spline) don't produce a sharp enough result for luma upscaling, but softness is fine for chroma.
And what do you use for Luma DOWNscaling?
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