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Old 24th August 2008, 20:05   #4001  |  Link
pitch.fr
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from what I understood, as long as your CPU supports SSE ICL10 compiled builds will be faster.

I wish I found this out a while ago, actually

I guess they make generic builds for old ass CPU's...
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Old 24th August 2008, 20:38   #4002  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pitch.fr View Post
I wish I found this out a while ago, actually

I guess they make generic builds for old ass CPU's...
Read the FAQ...
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Old 24th August 2008, 20:40   #4003  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pitch.fr View Post
from what I understood, as long as your CPU supports SSE ICL10 compiled builds will be faster.

I wish I found this out a while ago, actually

I guess they make generic builds for old ass CPU's...
its just after marc=pentium2 theres not that much gain
like 0.2% and thats within the range of error....
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interlacing and telecining should have been but a memory long ago.. unfortunately still just another bizarre weapon in the industries war on image quality.
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Old 24th August 2008, 21:09   #4004  |  Link
pitch.fr
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Read the FAQ...
I did, actually

but I always thought that this FAQ was outdated, and that all the available builds were ICL10 already..

on a 3.3Ghz Q6600 with extensive audio/video post-processing(96HQ resampling, spline resize, sharpening, rgb32 conversion, MT avisynth) on HD content, the difference is VERY MUCH noticeable

I guess noone knows how to get nice and clean deinterlacing on 29.97 DVD content ?

Last edited by pitch.fr; 24th August 2008 at 21:13.
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Old 24th August 2008, 21:16   #4005  |  Link
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libavcodec is always compiled with GCC so the decoding speed is pretty much identical for all our builds. ICL is only beneficial for some of the a/v postprocessing filters. Most people don't use those, so for them there is no noticable difference between builds.
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Old 24th August 2008, 21:16   #4006  |  Link
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Maybe I can post my question here. What's being used for decoding mp3 if disabled in FFD?
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Old 24th August 2008, 21:53   #4007  |  Link
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Maybe I can post my question here. What's being used for decoding mp3 if disabled in FFD?
Either your media player's- or OS-integrated MP3 decoder.
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Old 24th August 2008, 22:06   #4008  |  Link
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Hmm considering general crappiness of XP, I guess FFD will be better choice
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Old 24th August 2008, 22:08   #4009  |  Link
pitch.fr
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try Gabest's MP3 decoder.
huge soundstage, very clear audio, IEEEE float output.

it doesn't get any better than that, I think it's by far the best mp3 decoder(I tried Shibatch, MAD, Franhofer, foobar, etc..)

there's some MPC HC versions with standalone .ax filters

Last edited by pitch.fr; 24th August 2008 at 22:15.
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Old 25th August 2008, 00:49   #4010  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Octo-puss View Post
Hmm considering general crappiness of XP, I guess FFD will be better choice
Yeah, maybe that's safer. But there are more than one mp3 decoders in ffdshow itself, and I'd say you might want to use something other than libmad. libmad has not been maintained anymore, more than 4 years or so now, and known as seriously-buggy-but-no-one-fixed-it for some years, with several reports, at least on mplayer (-ac mad). The problems are not about quality, mostly AV-sync related, especially in VBR.
https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+s...er/+bug/244722

It may be ok in ffdshow (so far no obvious problems have been found in ffdshow-libmad), but the bug is in libmad itself, outdated and not maintained, so it should be safer to use another decoder. Besides, basically you don't get anything by selecting libmad unless your CPU only supports integer math, and not floating.

IIRC libmad is the default mp3 decoder in ffdshow (I don't know why. WHY?), and so you might want to change that option manually.
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Old 25th August 2008, 00:55   #4011  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pitch.fr View Post
try Gabest's MP3 decoder.
huge soundstage, very clear audio, IEEEE float output.
If you mean the one in MPC, that's libmad too. So it may be actually ok, and even excellent, but I can't help but feel it's not safe...
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Old 25th August 2008, 04:58   #4012  |  Link
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As many people already know about new AAC decoder http://multimedia.cx/eggs/aac-decoder-is-in/
There is no information about stability but are there some plans to include it to ffdshow in future?
It has better performance than faad.
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Old 25th August 2008, 05:43   #4013  |  Link
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Originally Posted by Liisachan View Post
Yeah, maybe that's safer. But there are more than one mp3 decoders in ffdshow itself, and I'd say you might want to use something other than libmad. libmad has not been maintained anymore, more than 4 years or so now, and known as seriously-buggy-but-no-one-fixed-it for some years, with several reports, at least on mplayer (-ac mad). The problems are not about quality, mostly AV-sync related, especially in VBR.
https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+s...er/+bug/244722

It may be ok in ffdshow (so far no obvious problems have been found in ffdshow-libmad), but the bug is in libmad itself, outdated and not maintained, so it should be safer to use another decoder. Besides, basically you don't get anything by selecting libmad unless your CPU only supports integer math, and not floating.

IIRC libmad is the default mp3 decoder in ffdshow (I don't know why. WHY?), and so you might want to change that option manually.
Well, there is this mp3lib which I've been using and didn't encounter any problems.
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Old 25th August 2008, 09:57   #4014  |  Link
pitch.fr
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Liisachan View Post
Yeah, maybe that's safer. But there are more than one mp3 decoders in ffdshow itself, and I'd say you might want to use something other than libmad. libmad has not been maintained anymore, more than 4 years or so now, and known as seriously-buggy-but-no-one-fixed-it for some years, with several reports, at least on mplayer (-ac mad). The problems are not about quality, mostly AV-sync related, especially in VBR.
https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+s...er/+bug/244722

It may be ok in ffdshow (so far no obvious problems have been found in ffdshow-libmad), but the bug is in libmad itself, outdated and not maintained, so it should be safer to use another decoder. Besides, basically you don't get anything by selecting libmad unless your CPU only supports integer math, and not floating.
thanks for the bug report.
I mostly use Gabest MPC's MP3 decoder for music(so A/V sync is irrelevant), and I might have watched a few AVI's with VBR MP3.....they seemed fine to me ?!

I use Reclock and HR, so my movies are under tight supervision

I'd guess that Gabest would have seen and fixed such an A/V bug, considering he really knows what he's doing

so this bug might either be only MPLAYER-related, Gabest would have fixed it in his DSHOW filter or I didn't encounter the bug yet ?!

I'll run more tests, and compare with ffdshow's built-in MP3 decoders.

Last edited by pitch.fr; 25th August 2008 at 10:22.
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Old 25th August 2008, 23:21   #4015  |  Link
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mp3lib is faster. not that it makes a difference...
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Old 26th August 2008, 00:29   #4016  |  Link
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@Octo-puss
@Mangix
Yup, my choice now is mp3lib too. That's mplayer's standard default too. I have no real reason to like it, but I do have a reason to dislike libmad, so relatively...

@pitch.fr
No, this bug is probably in libmad, not in mplayer. If you select another decoder (-ac3 mp3 or -ac3 ffmp3), mplayer is happy with MP3 including VBR. Besides, I was told that madplay (the reference implementation of libmad) has bugs too.

Maybe things are ok on Windows, which uses it's own sync system, just letting libmad decode, not asking it what time it is now. It's just that I really can't trust libmad anymore, now that I know how it's broken on mplayer. I wouldn't make it ffdshow's default mp3 decoder. Many years ago, when I found that ffdshow's default Vorbis decoder was really bad, milan told me that he would still like to keep Tremor in Low Quality Mode for slower CPUs. Maybe libmad is there for the same reason. But I tend to think it shouldn't be the default.

libmad might behave differently than other DirectShow mp3 decoders on Windows if the first mp3 frame is a VBR tag frame ("LAME", "Xing", "Info"), especially a LAME tag frame. libmad is fully VBR-tag-aware. But the difference is like 24 ms, so hard to detect. And actually this part may be related to the bug.

When my friends and I found that mplayer -ac mad didn't like VBR MP3, we first assumed that it just didn't like the hack to put VBR audio in AVI. Some also suggested that packed bvops were bad too. However, like that bug report says, we then noticed libmad didn't like VBR MP3 in (x264+VBR MP3).mp4 .mkv etc. either. So the problem is more fundamental: libmad itself is broken, and you can't blame Nandub's hack or DivX's hack here.

I am under impression that mpalyer's libmad goes crazy especially when you put VBR MP3 *without* the VBR tag (lame -t), but it's not really stable *with* the tag either. LAME tag might be a cool hack for audio-only files, but depending on it is a bad idea for movies, since it exists only as the first mp3 frame and you might edit your movie removing the first part, or dividing it into 2 or more. Or you might concatenate 2 movies, and if each of them has this tag, you end up having the hack padding in the middle of your movie.
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Old 26th August 2008, 13:30   #4017  |  Link
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I have never noticed any VBR related problems with libmad and I am not aware of any ffdshow users that are. So you are probably right that the bug doesn't manifest itself with DirectShow, or at least not in a noticeable way.
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Old 26th August 2008, 13:37   #4018  |  Link
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With libmad being the default MP3 decoder in ffdshow and MPC, any problem would have been noticed and reported straight away. The user base is way too large and picky to let this go unnoticed
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Old 26th August 2008, 14:04   #4019  |  Link
pitch.fr
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With libmad being the default MP3 decoder in ffdshow and MPC, any problem would have been noticed and reported straight away. The user base is way too large and picky to let this go unnoticed
well, EVR/VMR are nowhere near as smooth as HR jitter-wise.
yet noone complains, mostly coz they watch movies in 60Hz on crappy flat screens.

so this user base is not too picky when it comes to A/V sync and dropped frames
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Old 26th August 2008, 14:41   #4020  |  Link
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@pitch.fr: You haven't look at MPC-HC thread, have you?
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