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12th February 2014, 11:36 | #22981 | Link | ||
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Last edited by cyberbeing; 12th February 2014 at 11:38. |
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12th February 2014, 12:45 | #22982 | Link | ||||||
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There's a price to pay for silence as it would appear "the XFX R9 290 DD Editions power temperature goal is the 95 degrees that AMD has set as the default". They are actually targeting the TJ max as default OOTB in order to keep the board as silent as technically possible, they should have forced a 5/10° undershoot IMO. Quote:
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Last edited by leeperry; 12th February 2014 at 13:09. |
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12th February 2014, 13:33 | #22983 | Link | |
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Differences in chroma upsampling are rather difficult to spot and evaluate - so I generally use this chart at first: https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B9JsGIAbr0VAaV91VEpCME5wYVE/edit?usp=sharing I know this is everything but a real case video example, so I checked the rendering times using Blu-ray content. The chroma chart shows the exact same outcome with ANY of the NNEDI's (16 through 256 neurons) as Jinc3. That's why I speculate that it might fallback to Jinc3 for some reason. The rendering times are also exactly the same for NNEDI 16-256 as Jinc3. Thanks! Last edited by TheLion; 12th February 2014 at 13:44. |
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12th February 2014, 13:47 | #22984 | Link |
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Might make more sense to check with image doubling instead of chroma upsampling. The difference in image quality will be much bigger, so it will be easier to see whether NNEDI3 is active or not. If it's working for image doubling then I see no reason why it wouldn't work for chroma upscaling. I've not done real image quality tests yet to check whether NNEDI3 brings a noticeable quality improvement over Jinc for chroma upscaling.
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12th February 2014, 13:51 | #22985 | Link | |
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I noticed that with 10-bit encodes, my card just cannot do ED + SM without drops, turning SM off and all is well with ED. For example (1080p24 -> 1080): ED + SM = GPU 93% with drops ED only = 50% SM only = 30% With 8bit rips/encodes: ED + SM = GPU 90% with *no* drops Is this expected? Again, low end HD6570 with GDDR3.
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12th February 2014, 13:57 | #22986 | Link | |
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12th February 2014, 13:59 | #22987 | Link |
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FWIW I still find the pop-effect of N3 to be much higher than with that fixed N2 but that's on a REC709 calibrated 3.5K:1 LCD, things might change on CRT/SXRD/OLED...hopefully these can the final low/mid noise candidates
Last edited by leeperry; 13th February 2014 at 13:50. |
12th February 2014, 14:03 | #22988 | Link | |
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https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B9JsGIAbr0VAaV91VEpCME5wYVE/edit?usp=sharing to check the chroma upsampling behavior of NNEDI versus Jinc3 - it might be that they simply (and coincidentally) give the very same result in that "artifical test" I will try to find some "stoneage SD content" to check the image doubling in the meantime Thanks alot! Last edited by TheLion; 12th February 2014 at 14:05. |
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12th February 2014, 14:03 | #22989 | Link | |
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Distortion went way down, which appears to have increased sharpness and accuracy around fine detail by an order of magnitude. Smoothness improved from n2 build. Quality still seems superior overall to ED7. Periodic repetitions appear resolved. It eliminated the noise on black with my 3DLUT. Performance difference is rather insignificant on my GTX 770 (+0.35ms render , <1% GPU load difference). All of which is actually rather impressive, especially when I see it actually improved lossless PNG compression. |
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12th February 2014, 14:12 | #22990 | Link |
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Hi
Can anyone tell me if Chroma upsampling option affect downscaling?? I say this because when i use NNEDI 32 neurons in a 1080p video downscaled to 1360x768 and NNEDi is selected in chroma upsampling i get a party of dropped frames, but if i select bicubic the dropped frames stop. same with 16 neurons. Nothing selected in image doubling and downscaling method is lanczo 4 AR. something interesting is when use ctrl J to see the dropped frames with NNEDI selected the render and present queues doesnt rise, stay at 0-2 and 0-3, with bicubic it goes to 15-16 in both. I have hd7770 1GB and phenom x4 965 Everything is fine with 720p videos upscaled to 1360x768 with NNEDI 32 neurons and lanczo 4 AR. Problems appear only with 1080p videos downscaled to 1360x768 with NNEDI selected in chroma upsampling which is weird i think, because i never knew madvr used chroma option when downscale a video... TIA |
12th February 2014, 14:25 | #22991 | Link |
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It seems like the pop effect is helped by adding some noise? But that should probably be separate from the actual dithering, which just aims to accurately reproduce fractional colors. Just wondering if we're not starting to conflate two different things here (like conflating debanding with deblocking)
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12th February 2014, 14:36 | #22992 | Link | |
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madshi said that he would consider providing one low and one mid noise level algorithms and then possibly only ED7.......maybe that fixed N2 & original N3 would be the perfect candidates as cyberbeing seems to be using a CRT that comes with a very high native but low ANSI contrast and there are some ppl who like noise-free video and some who are willing to accept more noise if it looks more "popping" If the original N3 isn't chosen for whatever reason, a debug registry key to force it would be most appreciated so I won't be stuck with an old beta forever |
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12th February 2014, 14:49 | #22993 | Link | |
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12th February 2014, 15:03 | #22994 | Link | |||
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Don't know, maybe.
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Now we still have 3 possible variations left: (1) Floyd-Steinberg vs. Filter Lite. (2) Weight sum 1.0 vs. weight sum 0.97. (3) Old random generator vs. new random generator. Every of these small differences will change the output. The old 4 noisy builds were all possible combinations of (1) and (2), using the new random generator. Should I create 8 builts now to cover all variances, so we can make a final decision? Or how can we decide which of the 8 possible variations is the best overall solution? Yes. Chroma is always upscaled first. Then the image is converted to RGB. Then it's upscaled or downscaled to the final output resolution. Using NNEDI3 for chroma upscaling is a bit overkill if you don't have a monster GPU. I'd recommend using NNEDI3 only for luma doubling. |
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12th February 2014, 15:27 | #22995 | Link | ||
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An error diffusion build with amount of noise on the same level as 'random dither' would probably look quite nice on some noise-less content. Though overall, I think madVR gaining some kind of non-temporal luma-adaptive "add grain" control would suit this need better. N3 wasn't a fixed ED7, it was only ED7 with different random method. The original hope was it would resolve the repetition, but it didn't. This latest noisyLimited is the first we've had with actual bug-fixes: Last edited by cyberbeing; 12th February 2014 at 15:58. |
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12th February 2014, 15:39 | #22996 | Link |
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I don't see how PQ could improve over N3 from a purely subjective point of view, but you've grown that habit of always forcing us to expect the unexpected so please bring the pain in the hope of finally getting it over with
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12th February 2014, 15:57 | #22997 | Link | |
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Using the notation, 'x' for the original value, 'error' for the (gamma corrected) error that is being diffused to that pixel, 'f' for the gamma correction and 'finv' for the inverse gamma correction. The method I used was something like the following: Code:
temp = finv(f(x) + error) if (f(x) + error) < 0.5*(f(floor(temp)) + f(ceil(temp))) { result:= floor(temp);} else { result:= ceil(temp);} newerror = (f(x) + error) - f(result); Code:
if (f(x) + error) < 0.5*(f(floor(x)) + f(ceil(x))) { result:= floor(x);} else { result:= ceil(x);} newerror = (f(x) + error) - f(result); Last edited by Shiandow; 12th February 2014 at 17:52. |
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12th February 2014, 16:27 | #22998 | Link | ||
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Anyway, does the change improve image quality in your tests, too? Quote:
http://madshi.net/madVRnl.rar I'd really like to finish the medium-noise error diffusion finding process now. So I hope you'll like one of these, and hopefully more than any of the older builds. |
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12th February 2014, 16:59 | #22999 | Link | |
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Can we predict 3 levels (low, medium, high) of ED?
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12th February 2014, 17:27 | #23000 | Link |
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high noise is random dithering.
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LAV Filters - open source ffmpeg based media splitter and decoders |
Tags |
direct compute, dithering, error diffusion, madvr, ngu, nnedi3, quality, renderer, scaling, uhd upscaling, upsampling |
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