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Old 4th November 2011, 14:07   #221  |  Link
THX-UltraII
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Hi SubJunk,

As you might have read in my postings I m pretty new with PC frame interpolation and unfortunately I m a little noobish too as it comes to PC. Well, I ll try to explain you what I want and maybe you can tell me if it s possible:

After doing a lot of reading and questions on the SVP forum I finally tried (the lastest) version of SVP last night. I choose the Core2Quad profile because I have a Core2Quad and changed one of the settings in SVP from 'x2' to display refresh rate (which I put on 60Hz in my case because that s the max of my digital projector). I got a CPU load of 70%. I played a movie and it runned 'fine'. With this I mean that I only had problems with frame drops reported by madVR (but that s for later; first things first). I did however noticed artifacts which bothered me a lot (especially around the contours of people who move). So I switched to 'expert' view in the SVP manager which gave me a lot of options to fine tune. Changing one of the options (don t remember what option it was) from 'normal' to 'complex' helped some but also raised my CPU a bit. After this I tried to change more of the settings in the expert view to a higher quality setting but soon the max of my CPU was reached. I now know for sure that my CPU is just not capable of handling ALL the highest settings in SVP. I m not going to invest in a new systeem (i7 970) only for SVP so what I want to try is CONVERT my movies with the help of you guide. But I already have some questions about it before I start trying this:

1.
Is your guide compatible with full Blu-Ray rips in BDMV folder structure, .m2ts Blu-Ray remuxes, .mkv 1080p content (BR rips that are decoded to save space) and .mov HD trailers?

2.
Is it possible with you guide to convert a movie with the highest possible settings that are in theory possible with SVP in real-time?
(btw. cannot imagine there s a PC out there that can handle ALL the highest settings in SVP in real-time for 1080p content)

my hardware:
Core2Quad Q9450
4gb DDR3 1333
MSI GTX460 Cyclone 1gb ddr5 OC overclocked @880mhz
1000watt power supply
JVC RS25 Dila projector 1920x1080@60Hz max.

my software:
NVIDIA 285.62
MPC-HC 1.5.3.3757
madVR v0.77 as video renderer
LAV Filters 0.38 with CUVID (hardware decoding) enabled

Last edited by THX-UltraII; 4th November 2011 at 14:10.
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Old 4th November 2011, 23:00   #222  |  Link
SubJunk
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Quote:
Originally Posted by THX-UltraII View Post
Is your guide compatible with full Blu-Ray rips in BDMV folder structure, .m2ts Blu-Ray remuxes, .mkv 1080p content (BR rips that are decoded to save space) and .mov HD trailers?
The guide is compatible with any video that plays on your computer. As long as your computer knows how to decode it (meaning you have the codecs installed and set up properly) then the method used in my guide can use them.

Quote:
Originally Posted by THX-UltraII View Post
Is it possible with you guide to convert a movie with the highest possible settings that are in theory possible with SVP in real-time?
The default settings in InterFrame are the best quality I know of. SVP does not offer any more or less quality than InterFrame, we share knowledge and files so we improve eachother's products.

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(btw. cannot imagine there s a PC out there that can handle ALL the highest settings in SVP in real-time for 1080p content)
Well the "highest" settings in SVP will often make the quality worse, because SVP does not sort its settings in order of worst to best, they are just options to choose. But yes, many PCs are capable of running the highest quality settings (the default tuning in InterFrame) on 1080p in realtime.
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Old 5th November 2011, 12:30   #223  |  Link
THX-UltraII
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Ok, thanks SubJunk.

So I started last night with your guide but I immediately have some questions already @step 1

- with the updates process of MeGUI I get a notification that 'neroaacence' is outdated and that I have to dl this from the site from Nero and unpack it to the correct path.
Is this step need for the coversion I m going to do?

- I don t know what to do exactly with the step 'Close MeGUI and extract the tools folder over the top of your MeGUI tools folder, which for most people will be C:\Program Files\MeGUI\tools\.'

EDIT:
I think I found what the pupose it of the tools folder. I just copied and pasted the 'tools' folder that was located in the folder 'Files-20111103' I just downloaded and pasted this into my folder 'C:\Program Files (x86)\MeGUI\tools' (I did overwrite the previous 'avisynth_plugin' folder).

After this I went on with your guide in the hope I don t need the nero thing to download.

Ok, everything went well untill step 7 where I have some question about:

- I own a Q9450 with 4 threads so I filled in 2,7 at SetMTMode correct?

- I own a fairly good video card, the MSI GTX460 GDDR5 oc edition overclocked@900Mhz. I read that I can increase the speed of the conversion by adding a line to the script. But I see that it will take slight picture quality so when I want the highest possible quality I just don t fill in this line even though a have a good video card correct? (never thought that a videocard could help with a conversion process btw)

step 8:
the checkbox 'prefer DSS2 over DirectShowSource' is greyed out and not selectable.


And if I already own LAV filters and all my video content runs good with this atm, can I skip the codec package download?


Enough questions for now I think . I ll wait for further instructions before I move on now.

Last edited by THX-UltraII; 5th November 2011 at 12:55.
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Old 5th November 2011, 21:11   #224  |  Link
SubJunk
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Hi THX-UltraII, I don't think this is the right place to discuss this so please ask further questions about the guide by commenting on the guide. I'll answer this lot of questions here for convenience, though

Quote:
Originally Posted by THX-UltraII View Post
I own a Q9450 with 4 threads so I filled in 2,7 at SetMTMode correct?
Yes

Quote:
Originally Posted by THX-UltraII View Post
when I want the highest possible quality I just don t fill in this line even though a have a good video card correct?
The quality loss is almost unnoticeable, in fact I don't think anyone could see it in moving video, only by studying screenshots. So up to you.

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Originally Posted by THX-UltraII View Post
the checkbox 'prefer DSS2 over DirectShowSource' is greyed out and not selectable.
That's answered in the FAQ section of the guide.

Quote:
Originally Posted by THX-UltraII View Post
And if I already own LAV filters and all my video content runs good with this atm, can I skip the codec package download?
Sure, you can always install codecs at a later stage if you run into problems too
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Old 6th November 2011, 08:02   #225  |  Link
magnetite
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Hey SubJunk, I asked about GPU encoding before, however, I have some new questions. Now my GPU vs CPU seems to be 180 FPS vs 210 FPS or so. My GTX 570 has 480 CUDA cores, each running at 1.4 GHz. I'm not good at math, but I've also heard that CUDA is much faster than regular CPU encoding because you've got 480 slower cores versus 8 high speed CPU cores. Not sure if your script uses just the graphics card, or whether it actually uses the CUDA cores.

Here's a video to show you what I'm talking about

Okay this guy isn't doing video encoding, but he basically bought a bunch of GPUs and is crunching some serious numbers with it. Same could be applied here, although I've never tested it out before.

Long story short, would it be better to upgrade one of my old computers with another i7 2600K? Or do what this guy is doing. Wouldn't need to upgrade the whole computer, just the CPU, motherboard, and RAM.

Another thing I wanted to add was when the GPU=true, my GTX 570's load is only around 10%. Is there a way to utilize the whole card?

Last edited by magnetite; 6th November 2011 at 09:14.
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Old 6th November 2011, 21:12   #226  |  Link
widezu69
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@magnetite Hey, I'm new here but I've been working on this with Sub for years before he moved here. GPU=true does not completely turn everything to the GPU. It just spreads the work across. Your CPU will still be pegged full. You cannot compare this to CUDA computing. I use InterFrame with realtime playback. Cuda and GPU computing is way faster than CPU but only when the app is properly written to address everything the GPU has to offer. I don't under stand why your GPU rendering speed is slower though try and get that sorted. Are you using SetMTMode?

Personally I'd love to see a completely separate GPU, CPU utilisation. Eg the CPU does the interpolation and the GPU does the rendering or vice versa. Don't see it happening soon though

Last edited by widezu69; 6th November 2011 at 21:15.
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Old 6th November 2011, 23:00   #227  |  Link
magnetite
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I don't under stand why your GPU rendering speed is slower though try and get that sorted. Are you using SetMTMode?
Actually to clarify, I'm getting 180 FPS with the CPU alone (4C/8T i7 2600K @ 4.5 GHz), then when I add "GPU=true" it jumps up to 210-220 FPS or so. MTMode is set to (2, 14), since SubJunk said you should put your threads * 1.8.

I know it only takes about 20 minutes to do an episode, but I'm actually doing my whole library like this so I'll take all the speed boosts I can get.

Last edited by magnetite; 6th November 2011 at 23:02.
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Old 7th November 2011, 00:25   #228  |  Link
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Welcome to the thread, widezu

magnetite, like widezu said, the GPU is only partly used right now so 10% usage is normal. It would take significant code changes to utilise the GPU more. Maybe one day, but not soon.
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Old 7th November 2011, 01:06   #229  |  Link
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Actually, try (2,15) I find that slightly better. Ok so your GPU mode has increased speed. There was some confusion there good to see that you have a nice machine and are using it well.

@Sub, how much difference to the quality does dct add? I'm realtiming your second highest settings and was wondering how much of a noticeable difference it actually adds. BTW I'm playing everything @120fps -> 24x5
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Old 7th November 2011, 02:16   #230  |  Link
SubJunk
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dct=5 seems to make big improvements with sudden luma changes like flashing lights, it's better at keeping objects still if they're meant to be still instead of moving them because of luma changes.
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Old 7th November 2011, 04:21   #231  |  Link
magnetite
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Welcome to the thread, widezu

magnetite, like widezu said, the GPU is only partly used right now so 10% usage is normal. It would take significant code changes to utilise the GPU more. Maybe one day, but not soon.
That's cool. Parallel processing is still sort of new. I mean a lot of programs still use two cores. Not too many make use of four or more, with the exception of video encoding and such.

I guess I was just throwing it out as an idea of what could be accomplished with this someday.
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Old 16th November 2011, 02:18   #232  |  Link
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Hi SubJunk, first of all I want to make the compliments for the script, I'm using it very often and I hope there will be more improvements regarding moving scenes.
I just need some advice about the encoding process: usually I use 2pass at 3000kbps for 720p source at 24fps so how much you suggest to set the bitrate for the same "interframed" source?
Someone says that would be enough a 20% more of the usual bitrate (in this case 3500/4000kbps) or do you think that will be neccessary to doubling the bitrate too?
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Old 16th November 2011, 03:27   #233  |  Link
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Originally Posted by cattolicboy View Post
Hi SubJunk, first of all I want to make the compliments for the script, I'm using it very often and I hope there will be more improvements regarding moving scenes.
I just need some advice about the encoding process: usually I use 2pass at 3000kbps for 720p source at 24fps so how much you suggest to set the bitrate for the same "interframed" source?
Someone says that would be enough a 20% more of the usual bitrate (in this case 3500/4000kbps) or do you think that will be neccessary to doubling the bitrate too?
Hi cattolicboy, thanks for the feedback
If you use x264 I recommend using CRF instead of setting a bitrate. It will adjust the bitrate for you based on the CRF value and it takes into account framerate in recent x264 versions. Personally I use CRF 14 for near-lossless quality, but release groups are using values around 20.
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Old 16th November 2011, 03:38   #234  |  Link
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Thanks for the quick reply.
Most of the times I use crf, but for some projects where I want to have total control of the final size I need 2pass encoding.
That's why I asked that. Any idea?
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Old 16th November 2011, 04:23   #235  |  Link
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I'm not sure, but you can do an easy test to find out yourself:
1) Encode a video using CRF at its original framerate
2) Encode the same video using the same CRF value but using InterFrame
3) Calculate the difference between the two filesizes
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Old 17th November 2011, 10:25   #236  |  Link
travolter
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Quote:
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Actually to clarify, I'm getting 180 FPS with the CPU alone (4C/8T i7 2600K @ 4.5 GHz), then when I add "GPU=true" it jumps up to 210-220 FPS

How do you measure this? Programs?

When I do framedoubling realtime I can only measure that video skips frames at 60fps or not (reading output framerate of my videoplayer).. but I wonder if I have more headroom to increase script settings

Last edited by travolter; 17th November 2011 at 10:28.
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Old 17th November 2011, 11:24   #237  |  Link
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MeGUI displays the FPS while it is converting
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Old 17th November 2011, 12:21   #238  |  Link
Bloax
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You can also measure script speed by using "Run video analysis pass" in VirtualDub.
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Old 24th November 2011, 23:01   #239  |  Link
widezu69
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Hey Sub, any progress with synchronised unpaired simpler vectors? You can reach me over PM if it isn't ready yet.
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Old 24th November 2011, 23:22   #240  |  Link
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Hey mate, it looked promising at first but then I noticed it was making as many scenes worse as it was making better
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