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23rd July 2005, 14:46 | #1 | Link |
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@mantis2k:
I suggest this script for a Pulldown Conversion from PAL to NTSC: Code:
loadplugin("D:\x\dgdecode.dll") loadplugin("D:\x\decomb.dll") mpeg2source("man.d2v") # crop away black borders crop(0,72,0,-96) # match fields telecide(order=1,guide=2,post=0) #shift chroma and remove chroma flicker mergechroma(crop(0,4,0,0).addborders(0,0,0,4).blur(0,1)) # convert image size to NTSC converttoyuy2() last.lanczosresize(last.width,round(last.height/1.2)) addborders(0,ceil((480-last.height)/2),0,floor((480-last.height)/2))
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23rd July 2005, 14:53 | #2 | Link |
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@scharfi,
Isn't it better to do the color space up conversion in MPEG2Source (using upConv=true), where you can be sure you are doing the correct upsampling on the original encoded MPEG2 pictures? It's perhaps a small point, but worth noting. |
23rd July 2005, 14:58 | #3 | Link | |
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bit of all sorts really animation mainstream films and the such - just wondered how it would be done so i could mess about and see if i could get the hang of it as there has been a few ntsc films my uncle has brought with him on visits fromt he states (he lives there now) that my standalone has an issue with - was wondering if converting it to pal might solve the issue
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23rd July 2005, 15:05 | #4 | Link |
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since I am SURE, that I have a progressive image after telecide, I can upconvert it progressively after teleciding with a simple converttoyuy2().
also, I don't think, that relying on the frametype alone for upconversion is so good (but it is a starting point...). I've seen several DVB-S streams where the image content was interlaced, but the image was coded progressively (motion probably was und a certain threshold). In past I've done some motion adaptive YV12<->YUY2 conversions for hybrid video: http://forum.doom9.org/showpost.php?...64&postcount=1 of course, for this video those routines will probably fail due te big imperfection.
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23rd July 2005, 15:17 | #5 | Link |
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The flags reliably state how the video was *encoded*. And that is how the upsampling should be done at the time an MPEG picture is decoded. Whether the *content* is actually progressive is irrelevant.
I think your idea that since you've decombed you can now treat it as if it was *encoded* progressively is a misconception. Think about that carefully, please. |
23rd July 2005, 15:22 | #6 | Link |
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An interlaced encoded progressive PAL-movie is better upsampled progressively.
interlaced downsampling of progressive frame contents can be upsampled progressively without drawbacks. Have I written drawback? upsampling interlaced mpeg2 with progressive video in a progressive way enhances chroma quality! one can do so, because the inventor of YUV 4:2:0 has wisely choosen the position of the sampling points. They are the same for interlaced and progressive. Only their origin is different.
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23rd July 2005, 15:26 | #7 | Link |
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We'll have to agree to differ. I am giving the correct MPEG2 theory. You are giving unsupported claims.
It is not correct that the sampling points for interlaced and progressive encoding are the same. I remind you that quality DVD players that avoid the chroma upsampling bug all follow the progressive flag and upsample per MPEG2 picture. I will try to prepare a demonstration that illustrates the perils of not upsampling at picture decode time. |
23rd July 2005, 15:43 | #8 | Link | |
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23rd July 2005, 15:43 | #9 | Link |
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how can I convince you?
EDIT: I have several interlaced encoded movies, that look MUCH better using progressive upsampling than interlaced upsampling. also, I claim that motion adaptive upsampling of real interlaced content looks better than plain interlaced upsampling. According the this page, the chroma sampling points are located in the SAME spatial position for interlaced and progressive YUV 4:2:0: http://www.mir.com/DMG/chroma.html
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23rd July 2005, 15:45 | #10 | Link | |
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I read your argument as that the method may not be fully correct per MPEG2, but it has useful side effects that may improve matters in some cases. I can accept that in principle, but I'd like to see a specific example if you can provide one. And I'll try to give a counter example. It may be yet another case where the nature of the content is the determining factor. But let's do it offline. Thanks for engaging in this with me. I always learn a lot from our interactions. |
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23rd July 2005, 15:56 | #11 | Link | |
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23rd July 2005, 15:58 | #12 | Link | |
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I also have to leave now. EDIT: could you split this thread in a way, that our chroma-discussion is located in a new thread?
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23rd July 2005, 23:23 | #13 | Link | |||||||
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Thanks for all your help so far! However, I don't wish to muck around with the boarders!? Surely, the picture would look the wrong aspect ratio when authored back to DVD? |
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24th July 2005, 01:33 | #14 | Link | |
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24th July 2005, 01:35 | #15 | Link | |
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24th July 2005, 01:52 | #16 | Link | |
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24th July 2005, 13:11 | #18 | Link | ||||
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www.avisynth.org Also his explanations make totally sense to me and my native language isnt English either Quote:
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24th July 2005, 17:02 | #19 | Link |
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Can I add to @communist's answer:
If you're working from VHS, please read the analogue capture guide; it tells you, among other things, that AVISynth is unrelated to any encoder, that capturing in MPEG is (to put it mildly) not the preferred method and, perhaps of more use to you at the moment, exactly how you should preserve the aspect ratio. I believe it also has an introduction to using AVISynth in it. Out of curiosity, may I ask what you are capturing? (Preservation of old tapes -- mainly children's programmes! -- being my main interest.) Grrr.. the speech recogniser posted this before I was finished again. I wanted to say one other thing, which is that in a limited medium like this, it can be very hard to read the tone of people's posts. So it is best to try and make sure that there is absolutely no way that your comments can be interpreted as being aggressive, sarcastic or critical unless that is really what you intend (and if that is really what you intend then you would be better off starting flame wars on USENET). Something to bear in mind is that, despite the fact that they have answered these questions literally hundreds of times, @scharfis_brain and @neuron2 still seem to take the time to keep answering them... so it is if nothing else more polite to say 'I'm sorry, I really didn't understand that, could you give me an idea of what terms to search for so I can' rather than that something 'makes no sense to the average person'.
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