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29th June 2019, 00:25 | #56701 | Link |
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Hey guys, which movie "teases out" the new dci-p3 gamut ?
I'm not seeing a huge difference between wide and standard gamut tv in movies, side by side, both ran through displaycal and i1d3.
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30th June 2019, 12:27 | #56703 | Link |
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A GTX 1060 would do the job.
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1st July 2019, 13:22 | #56706 | Link |
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You're lucky.
Every time I say the same on this very topic, I get death threats from die hard madvr users yelling that madvr can't to anything with only a GTX 1060 and that anyone serious about picture quality should mortgage their house and buy a RTX 2080 TI...
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1st July 2019, 15:39 | #56709 | Link | |
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Quote:
If you only use a few of the features, or are mostly playing 1080p content (or downscale 4K content) on a 1080p display then sure, a 1060 will do fine. But if you have a 4K display/projector and want to use the latest HDR dynamic tonemapping, 3D LUT calibration, 12bits, some processing, black bars detection, NGU upscaling of 480p, 720p or 1080p content to 4K, then I doubt that a 1060 is enough, especially at 60p, unless you're happy to reduce the quality (and I'm not talking going from NGU Chroma very high to high, I'm talking settings that actually reduce the PQ). I have a 1080ti and I have to limit the amount of processing I do in many situations (I use NGU chroma anti-alias high and NGU luma sharp very high). And at the moment, I only use 8bits due to a bug with the JVCs and not 12bits (which does save a significant amount of power. If I could use 12bits, I'd be even more limited). So if you just want it to work and are happy to play with the settings until you don't get dropped frames, use only 8bits on a 1080p screen, are happy to not use a 3D LUT, can live without black bars detection or any other feature that doesn't work with D3D11 native and if you only use HDR passthrough, then sure, get a 1060. If you want to get the best PQ available at the moment (especially for HDR with dynamic tonemapping) and use all the features listed above, then I'd suggest at least a 1080ti. And if you want to be able to tap into the tensor cores potential that might be exploited by madVR at some point, then I wouldn't buy a GTX but would only buy an RTX. Madshi himself recommends to get an RTX rather than a GTX.
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1st July 2019, 15:59 | #56710 | Link | |
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Quote:
Plays 1080p and 4K UHD 24Hz both just fine. If I want to do 60Hz (which is very rare), then I go with Lancosz instead of NGU for scaling and it works. Last edited by SirMaster; 1st July 2019 at 16:02. |
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1st July 2019, 16:25 | #56711 | Link | |
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Quote:
Again, people can be very happy with a 1060 if they only use a fraction of the features or are happy to reduce PQ (NGU Chroma medium or using Lancosz instead of NGU is reduced quality, though I agree not very noticeably), especially (but not only) at 60p. It's all about which features you need, and how happy you are to compromise PQ. You seem to be very happy to compromise PQ and only use a subset of features, there is nothing wrong with that.
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1st July 2019, 17:02 | #56712 | Link |
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Seconded. It's okay with smaller queues but having to compromise on those isn't great. Every major update to Windows 10 has also made things slower for me, although part of that may be CPU-related (I haven't done too much testing since the last time madshi fixed a function that started using a ton of CPU for no reason, so I'm not sure).
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1st July 2019, 19:14 | #56713 | Link | |
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d3d11 doesn't make a real major difference anyway if it would do that how could an iGPU even do a copyback operation at all? rendering at 10 bit doesn't cost much more either hard to even measure it's pretty much writing an 10 bit output instead of 8 the math/work should be the same. blackbar detection can even save performance. even 480p60 upscaling can be done using NGU just tested 576p50 with ngu high quadruple with 13 ms. currently tonemapping and 1080p->UHD scaling or quadrupling which has a huge diminishing return are very costly. |
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1st July 2019, 19:30 | #56714 | Link | |
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Quote:
Black bar detection or UHD BD menus means no D3D11 native. In my setup, copyback is much slower than native. I知 not cropping black bars, I知 detecting them to do a vertical shift of the picture according to the A/R of the content. 12bits (there is no 10bits option with HDMI on nVidia) is significantly slower than 8bits here. Good for you if it痴 not the case with your setup. A 3D LUT is also significantly slower, by this I mean a few ms. Stack all this together and you go from no dropped frames to stutter. Please post all your settings for the upscaling of 480p60 to 4K60 RGB 4:4:4 8bits with NGU luma very high and NGU chroma high in 13ms on an nVidia GPU (which one?) in D3D copyback on Windows 10 Pro x64 1809 or more recent (see my sig for details), at least that would be useful if true.
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1st July 2019, 20:40 | #56715 | Link | |||||||
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it's a 576i50 file which should give higher render times then 480p60 while obviously still easier to do in real-time. |
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1st July 2019, 21:45 | #56716 | Link | ||||||
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In any case, I only mention the black bars detection because it's a common software feature that requires copyback. I need copyback for UHD Bluray Menus in jRiver, so black bars isn't really relevant. Quote:
And what difference do you make between "a couple of ms" and "2ms"? That's exactly what I said. Quote:
It's all the extra features that push a perfectly fine 35ms to a stuterring 42ms. You only need a few ms here and a few ms there to end up on the wrong side of 41ms, especially with 1.78 content in HDR. A lot of people brag about their lower GPU, but they either don't use all the features or they compromise on quality. Or they don't notice frame drops. Quote:
Again, my point isn't to say that you can't be happy with a 1060. Clearly a lot of people are happy with a 1060, and I'm very happy they are. But if someone buys a 1060 today, I'd rather be sure that they realise that they are limiting the number of features and the PQ they can get. That's all. I didn't upgrade to a 2080ti because I don't really need to, but I'm glad I have the 1080ti, especially since madshi is doing the dynamic HDR Tonemapping, it's VERY taxing.
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1st July 2019, 21:51 | #56717 | Link |
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I need to sacrifice something on my new computer for madvr 1080p->4k.
gtx 1650 + 16GB RAm + 250GB NVme SSD M2 + fancy case with lots of 3.5/2.5 slots or gtx 1660 + 8GB RAM + normal ssd 250GBG + not so fancy case with enough but limited 3.5/2.5 slots. Please help!!! |
1st July 2019, 21:57 | #56719 | Link |
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You need D3D11 for 10bits in Full screen windowed mode. D3D9 isn't an option for 10bits unless you're happy with FSE (I'm not).
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1st July 2019, 22:06 | #56720 | Link |
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Maybe just some simplicity for noobs?
There are two camps: 1080p PJ's with and without fake 4k or Displays that are 4k. You are one or the other, perhaps both. 1080p needs a way to play 4k titles especially using HDR. Look into all the testing that is being created for this camp and the hoops you need to jump through in order to produce HDR looking results. Expect to use the high quality expensive video cards to process something watchable. A GTX 1070 is the minimum from what I understand and more expensive higher cards will produce even better results. Can't speak for AMD cards. 2160p displays can use low to mediocre cards producing the same if not better results than the algo camp above ^. GTX 960 4GB is a good example. With a good UHD HDR rip, nothing more is needed imo. You are not going to increase any picture quality by using a higher quality video card to use more algo processing because there isn't anything to improve on a native UHD rip on a native 4k display. That's assuming you have a decent display that doesn't need its deficiencies improved which is a whole nuther story. If that's the case, then you belong in the PJ camp. You can expect better results upscaling 540, 720, and 1080p titles on your 4k display but tbh, the results will more than likely appear (small) and I doubt YMMV. This includes junk rips downloaded from someplace. You can only improve this crap so much before the return is negligible and you don't need 6/8 GB of memory to improve them nor do you need new cards costing as much as a mortgage payment. The prices are and have been outrageous forever not because of the tech and production cost but to appease over exuberant stock market investors and nothing more.
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direct compute, dithering, error diffusion, madvr, ngu, nnedi3, quality, renderer, scaling, uhd upscaling, upsampling |
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