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Old 2nd April 2018, 16:09   #50001  |  Link
Warner306
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Originally Posted by zaemon View Post
Doesn't it defeat the purpose if I force LAV to use copy-back instead of native?

It works though (thanks) but performance is horrible, got dropped frames now.
Try going back to DXVA2 copy-back. Does it get any better? If so, forget about D3D11 as it's unnecessary and native mode doesn't work for you.

There may be a bottleneck with your GPU (only 8 lanes) combined with a lack of PCIe express bandwidth (v2.0 or lower) in copy-back mode. I've run into one other user with this problem. I don't know how he installed his graphics card. He may have installed it in a x4 slot. Native and copy-back shouldn't have radically different performance.

Last edited by Warner306; 2nd April 2018 at 16:17.
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Old 2nd April 2018, 18:14   #50002  |  Link
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Originally Posted by maxkolonko123 View Post
I did bitstream but without using reclock, just direct audio device and lav filters, nothing else.

I will watch some movie tomorrow without bitstream just PCM but i gave a tried alrdy for few minutes and still had some occasional drops.
Fascinating. With JRiver's video option turned on my issues went away using PCM. I think it's similar to how ReClock works afaik. In any case I've watched a few movies now with this setup and it's working extremely well for me.
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Old 2nd April 2018, 19:15   #50003  |  Link
maxkolonko123
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Originally Posted by SamuriHL View Post
Fascinating. With JRiver's video option turned on my issues went away using PCM. I think it's similar to how ReClock works afaik. In any case I've watched a few movies now with this setup and it's working extremely well for me.

For now i droped reclock and im checking internal wasapi in mpc hc, after few quick checks i didnt notice any difference between PCM and bitsream with wasapi, but tbh i didnt had time to watch movie from start to end, i just base my opinion on switching movie to FSE and compare frame repeat time, in both situation it's oscilate around same time.
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Old 2nd April 2018, 21:08   #50004  |  Link
zaemon
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madVR - high quality video renderer (GPU assisted)

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Originally Posted by Warner306 View Post
Try going back to DXVA2 copy-back. Does it get any better? If so, forget about D3D11 as it's unnecessary and native mode doesn't work for you.

There may be a bottleneck with your GPU (only 8 lanes) combined with a lack of PCIe express bandwidth (v2.0 or lower) in copy-back mode. I've run into one other user with this problem. I don't know how he installed his graphics card. He may have installed it in a x4 slot. Native and copy-back shouldn't have radically different performance.


Thanks. I’m back to DXVA2 copy-back, works flawlessly.

My GTX 1080 is plugged in a very old motherboard (X58 chipset, PCIe 2.0) so it makes sense. MB upgrade is scheduled but not a priority ATM.
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Old 2nd April 2018, 21:25   #50005  |  Link
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Motherboard upgrade shouldn't change anything to D3D11 Native problems. Sounds like an NVIDIA driver issue.
Can't you use the previous driver?
What's your OS? If it's Windows 10 you could also try Windowed D3D11 presentation mode, I've never had any issue with it and a 1050 Ti even when using D3D11 Native decoding in LAV at the same time.
Native D3D11 is nice for 4K (as long as you don't use black bar detection) because it gives you better performance than DXVA2 Copyback without the lower chroma quality of DXVA2 Native.
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Old 2nd April 2018, 22:00   #50006  |  Link
Warner306
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Originally Posted by el Filou View Post
Motherboard upgrade shouldn't change anything to D3D11 Native problems. Sounds like an NVIDIA driver issue.
Can't you use the previous driver?
What's your OS? If it's Windows 10 you could also try Windowed D3D11 presentation mode, I've never had any issue with it and a 1050 Ti even when using D3D11 Native decoding in LAV at the same time.
Native D3D11 is nice for 4K (as long as you don't use black bar detection) because it gives you better performance than DXVA2 Copyback without the lower chroma quality of DXVA2 Native.
I thought the performance improvement was small at best? How big of an improvement are you getting?

So why doesn't D3D11 copy-back work for him? It sounds like a bandwidth problem but DVXA2 copy-back works fine.

Native doesn't seem to be selecting his GPU, but the two copy-back modes are wildly-different.

Last edited by Warner306; 2nd April 2018 at 22:10.
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Old 2nd April 2018, 23:05   #50007  |  Link
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So does D3D11 only works in win10 or win7 is fine too?
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Old 2nd April 2018, 23:07   #50008  |  Link
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I thought the performance improvement was small at best? How big of an improvement are you getting?
Its minimal over DXVA2-Native, but DXVA2-Native results in degraded quality, so its often not considered an alternative. If you're talking DXVA2-CB compared to D3D11 Native and 4K 10-bit content on a weak CPU with a weak memory system, it can make up the ability to even play it.
The improvements might be even better if madshi rewrites madVR in D3D11 eventually (its primarily still D3D9 on the inside).

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So does D3D11 only works in win10 or win7 is fine too?
Only on 8.1 or 10. Not on 7.
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Old 3rd April 2018, 00:24   #50009  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by maxkolonko123 View Post
For now i droped reclock and im checking internal wasapi in mpc hc, after few quick checks i didnt notice any difference between PCM and bitsream with wasapi, but tbh i didnt had time to watch movie from start to end, i just base my opinion on switching movie to FSE and compare frame repeat time, in both situation it's oscilate around same time.
I hope you get it working! I was getting irritated with it and decided my time was better spent watching a movie without dropped frames than any continued effort. I'm a bitstreaming fan but ultimately the audio is going to get decoded somewhere and IMO it's not worth the aggravation for such little gain. If I could have made it work in the time I gave it I'd have been happy. I may give it another shot after I finish my current project of setting up a NAS for all my media storage. I need to revisit my madvr settings, too, at some point.
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Old 3rd April 2018, 01:01   #50010  |  Link
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Originally Posted by nevcairiel View Post
Its minimal over DXVA2-Native, but DXVA2-Native results in degraded quality, so its often not considered an alternative. If you're talking DXVA2-CB compared to D3D11 Native and 4K 10-bit content on a weak CPU with a weak memory system, it can make up the ability to even play it.
The improvements might be even better if madshi rewrites madVR in D3D11 eventually (its primarily still D3D9 on the inside).



Only on 8.1 or 10. Not on 7.
I was thinking more in terms of a user who is able to decode via DXVA2 copy-back (like the original poster) and wants to use D3D11 Native. What kind of performance improvements would be seen in madVR at 4K?

And what kind of CPU/RAM combination fails at copy-back with adequate VRAM? I thought it had to be an issue with PCIe speed with the GPU having to transfer so much data back-and-forth, rapidly? Some modern CPUs are not up to the task?
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Old 3rd April 2018, 01:27   #50011  |  Link
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Hello,

I am using MPC-HC, madVR and LAV filters for my HTPC (iGPU HD 630).
I have disabled all image correction settings in Intel drivers.

Setting decoding to D3D11 native result in an average rendering time of 25ms, mostly stable even with light scaling settings. Using D3D9, average rendering was much better (5ms) but with max rendering time > 25ms.
Should I have a faster rendering with D3D11?

I have not been able to watch "The world in HDR" 4K 60fps 10bit demo:
http://4kmedia.org/the-world-in-hdr-uhd-4k-demo/
Even using bilinear scaling, on my 1080p TV the rendering is very slow. I tried with EVR, the video is smooth but HDR is not converted to SDR. Maybe the madVR HDR>SDR conversion is too heavy to be handled by the iGPU?

Using the HDMI port on Intel iGPU does not allow to output 10bit because the drivers always dither to 8bit (I checked that with my AVR reporting 4:4:4 8bit signal).
https://www.intel.com/content/dam/ww...hics-paper.pdf
Could we have an option in madVR to force 12bit output?

Thank you very much.
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Old 3rd April 2018, 01:38   #50012  |  Link
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No, you should not have faster rendering with D3D11 than D3D9.

Yes, others have also reported that the 630 is too slow for good quality HDR to SDR. Have you tried changing madVR's HDR options?

madVR will not be able to force the output bit depth, the GPU has to be the one in control.
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Old 3rd April 2018, 01:58   #50013  |  Link
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just a quick question...(yeah, i know kinda strange question but i want to make an icon for MadVR, so i need some input)

I just wanted to ask, what does teh "VR" stand for in MadVR?
I want to make an ICON for MadVR and teh Media Player using it, i thought it would have a nice touch to it, seeing it in the taskbar and teh player icon..

And to be honest, the VR reminds me to much of "Virtual Reality" so i wanted to know what it stands for.. its just an non related question, haha..But it would help ,me on the icon.

THX, and greetings...

Keep it up madshi and HAPPY EASTERN!!!
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Old 3rd April 2018, 02:06   #50014  |  Link
maxkolonko123
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I hope you get it working! I was getting irritated with it and decided my time was better spent watching a movie without dropped frames than any continued effort. I'm a bitstreaming fan but ultimately the audio is going to get decoded somewhere and IMO it's not worth the aggravation for such little gain. If I could have made it work in the time I gave it I'd have been happy. I may give it another shot after I finish my current project of setting up a NAS for all my media storage. I need to revisit my madvr settings, too, at some point.
Hopefully one day yeah
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Old 3rd April 2018, 02:18   #50015  |  Link
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I just wanted to ask, what does teh "VR" stand for in MadVR?
Video Renderer
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Old 3rd April 2018, 10:05   #50016  |  Link
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By the way, which madVR options can I use to reduce GPU memory usage? I assume the GPU queue size is relevant and the number of frames to be presented in advance, but what about "trade quality for performance" options? Does "store custom pixel shader results in 16bit buffer instead of 32bit" help a lot?
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Old 3rd April 2018, 10:24   #50017  |  Link
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if you are using a custom pixel shader maybe but it's most likely very little.
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Old 3rd April 2018, 12:11   #50018  |  Link
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New issue just popped up for me. Whenever I play a video and fullscreen it (exclusive fullscreen enabled), there's a ~3 second stutter, then it plays for half a second followed by another ~3 second stutter. Audio/Video is still playing in real time, as it just skips ahead after. Happens even on an SSD, and disabling exclusive fullscreen fixes it but then I can't get 3D/HDR correctly.

Only thing I can think of is I upgraded to Win10 Spring Creative Update which went RTM a few days ago.
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Old 3rd April 2018, 13:30   #50019  |  Link
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First thing I'd do is uninstall and reinstall graphics drivers, maybe try DDU as well if normal uninstall doesn't change anything.
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Old 3rd April 2018, 14:07   #50020  |  Link
tyrindor
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First thing I'd do is uninstall and reinstall graphics drivers, maybe try DDU as well if normal uninstall doesn't change anything.
Sadly, no go. Spring Update hits either today or next tuesday, so if it's caused by that we're gonna see posts soon. I don't believe I changed anything other than that.

Last edited by tyrindor; 3rd April 2018 at 14:12.
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