madVR - high quality video renderer (GPU assisted)

[cyberbeing]

TheElix, have you set write permissions to the madVR directory? If you placed madVR in Program Files on Win7, you'll need to edit the permissions to allow non-Administrative write access. That could certainly cause creation of a 3dlut to fail, but it's just a guess.

madshi, on that note you should probably change the following line:

(1) Unzip "madVR.zip" and copy the folder to a suitable place (e.g. Program Files).

to

(1) Unzip "madVR.zip" and copy the folder to a suitable place with USERS write access (e.g. My Documents).

[TheElix]

Originally Posted by tschi

@TheElix : did you try "restore default settings.bat" and set again your ycms data ? You can also try to generate manually your 3dlut files with ycms but anyway, currently madVR doesn't work well with 3dlut

Nah, I still wasn't able to create the 3dlut file with madVR. I guess I'll just wait for madshi to fix 3dlut issues.
Also, I created two 3dlut files (hd - pc.3dlut & sd - pc.3dlut) using yCMS and specified it in madVR, but it gave me the following error for either of them:
"This 3dlut file does not match the input format required by madVR."
Here's a config file I used to create hd - pc.3dlut:

# Example input file for yCMS v1.0 and up
#
# Settings for creating a 3DLUT file for watching the following Video formats:
# Blu-ray, HD DVD, ATSC HD Broadcast, DVB HD Broadcast
# without any Display correction
# Includes YCbCr->RGB conversion using PC Levels (Black: 0 and White: 255)

# Set input format
Input_Format HD YCbCr 8

# Set output format
Output_Format HD RGB_PC 16

# Grayscale calibration
Grayscale_Measurements
20 1 5.210 0.309 0.329
30 1 11.808 0.314 0.331
40 1 21.633 0.314 0.333
50 1 35.625 0.314 0.332
60 1 53.377 0.314 0.331
70 1 73.243 0.312 0.328
80 1 99.744 0.312 0.326
90 1 129.090 0.312 0.327
100 1 162.966 0.312 0.326

# Gamut calibration
Gamut_Measurements 1
36.994 0.644 0.335
114.868 0.299 0.602
13.224 0.145 0.063
162.966 0.312 0.326

[yesgrey]

Originally Posted by cyberbeing

You'll need to explain the the differentiation you are making between converting and considering to be 6 bit.

An 8 bit source video has values that go from 0 to 255. A 6 bit source video has values that go from 0 to 63. THe external application that uses the 3DLUT (in this case madVR), would be responsible to correlate the 8 bit source video with the 6 bit input 3DLUT. madVR does it using trilinear interpolation.

Originally Posted by cyberbeing

In this way you retain the full 8 bit data, but only apply gamut/gamma correction on the data 1x1x1 data in 4x4x4 chunks (6 bit accuracy). Do you understand?

Yes, I understand, but it would not be worth it. What you are proposing is to create a 6 bit input 3DLUT storing it into an 8 bit one. The way you are proposing would be by using trilinear interpolation, so, if madVR is already doing it, why wasting the extra memory needed to store and manipulate an 8/16 3DLUT? You would get the exact same results using madVR, whether you use a 6/16 3DLUT, or your proposed 8/16 3DLUT.

Originally Posted by cyberbeing

6 bit -> 16 bit
1 (4x4x4) +4.5 = 5.5
....................= 5.5
....................= 5.5
....................= 5.5
4 (4x4x4) +13.5 = 15.5
......................= 15.5
......................= 15.5
......................= 15.5

I think your example is not correct... Wouldn't you want to say:
1 (4x4x4) +4.5 = 5.5
....................= 5.5
....................= 5.5
....................= 5.5
5 (4x4x4) +13.5 = 18.5
......................= 18.5
......................= 18.5
......................= 18.5

[tschi]

@TheElix, you need yRGB RGB_Video input & output like

# Set input format
Input_Format   yRGB RGB_Video 8

# Set output format
Output_Format yRGB RGB_Video 16

[madshi]

Originally Posted by WontonNoodle

so.... how do i use Ycms now??? completely lost

Do you have a meter to measure your display? If not, yCMS will not help you.

Originally Posted by xv

Yes that´s it, if I add "Output_Format HD RGB_Video 16" it works, also files are identical except the part where the config file is stored (cause all settings of Output_Format are overridden by the other options).

Yeah, madVR is too stupid to understand that you didn't use "Output_Format" but replaced all its parts by separate commands. madVR requires Output_Format to be present, so it can double check you're using the correct bitdepth.

Originally Posted by xv

What`s wrong with madVR and 3dlut

Calibration via 3dluts doesn't work correctly with the latest madVR version. yesgrey and I are working on a fix.

Originally Posted by JaylumX

Hello Madshi. Can i please request that there is an option in Display Modes in Madvr that stops Madvr switching to ones desired resolution/refresh-rate unless the Media Player is in full screen mode

Has been requested before, is on my to do list. No ETA.

Originally Posted by luke823

So if we're not supposed to use rgb limited, then what is the purpose of madvr having a tv levels setting?

Originally Posted by luke823

In your latter example, wouldn't madvr output 16-235 only to have it expanded by the video card on rgb full? Wouldn't you want to match up rgb limited and tv levels to stay at 16-235 all the way through? (And likewise rgb full + pc levels)? Just trying to understand.

The ATI switch names are not very good. Let me redefine them for you:

The ATI switch "RGB Full" really means: "leave all applications' RGB output untouched"
The ATI switch "RGB Limited" really means: "molest RGB output of all applications behind their back"

For best quality with madVR switch ATI to "RGB Full". Then you can switch between video/PC levels in madVR. You can switch video/PC levels with madVR without quality degradation.

Originally Posted by fairchild

If you have an ATI card that sends unmolested 0-255 then it depends on the capability of your display. For example, on my system with my 5830 through it's HDMI port feeding the signal to my Panasonic plasma HDTV, you can have it setup two correct ways:

Pixel Format: RGB Limited
MadVR: PC Levels

or

Pixel Format: RGB Full
MadVR: TV Levels

The latter should provide the best quality and gives full BTB + WTW same as my Blu-ray player provides.

The problem for me and using RGB Full is that my desktop and games look a bit off and there is black crush going on.

If desktop and games have black crush then you can't have full BTB with "RGB Full" and madVR TV levels, either. Seems to me that your display simply clips away some of the BTB data. That's sad, of course, but there's probably not much we can do about it...

Originally Posted by Qaq

Impression from newer madVRs. Tried 0.62 and Precision 3.
Watched 3 720 videos and 1 FullHD video. With FullHD video everything seems fine. If video has size < actual display size I can't get rid of impression that dynamic range is HUGE. I mean it looks like it's out of the range sometimes. I even had to change Luma scaler from Spline to SoftCubic50 and decrease contrast on my TV from 82 to 79. Didn't make mach comparisons with < 0.62 because it seems like I'm not the only one with similar impressions.

Hmmmm... I'm not sure from your description: Do you like the v0.62 image quality or rather not?

Originally Posted by e-t172

feature request: is it possible to add an option to madVR which disables the video card's 3x1D CLUT when madVR is active, and re-enables it when playback is finished?

Yes, this is on my to do list.

Originally Posted by TheElix

I'm sorry if this problem's been discussed before, but I get "Creating the 3dlut for the display Panasonic-TV failed" error when I try to use yCMS.

That's weird! Can you post the gamut and gamma measurements you're trying to use? Maybe yCMS doesn't like them? Not sure what else could be going wrong.

Originally Posted by TheElix

BTW, what's the preferable pixel format for my display, YCbCr or RGB?

Best output mode should be RGB 0-255, if your display properly supports it.

Originally Posted by Portioli

i am an ATi user & i am using CoreAVC software acceleration as long as DXVA is not supported with MadVR. i would like you to check some of my settings if possible.

should i change the output formats and output levels?

No, should be ok as it is.

Originally Posted by Portioli

@ ati catalyst control
pixel format is set to 4:4:4 FullRGB

Good.

Originally Posted by mark0077

madshi, I found an issue today playing any video file that has a higher frame rate than my display refresh, when in fullscreen exclusive mode. (trying some 60hz video files today with my display at 50hz)

The problem is that some frames seem to appear on screen in the wrong order, then I might get a few seconds of perfect playback, then another few seconds of glitchy backwards / forwards motion, as I say it looks like some frames come in the wrong order.

I narrowed the problem down to the enabling of the "run presentation in a seperate thread" option. With it off, the problem never happens, with it on, it seems to always happen. I'm using a GTX 295 in Wind 7 64bit. I have it turned off now and am 100% happy, just thought you should know. If you think I should report it over on the nvidia forums as a bug on their end I'll do so. I'm using madVR 0.65.

Can anybody else reproduce this?

FWIW, those tweak options like "run presentation in a separate thread" were added in order to fix presentation glitches. You should only enable these tweaks only if you really need them. Otherwise it's better to leave them off.

Originally Posted by Portioli

Could somebody tell us what happens with conversions and output levels settings?
When I set madvr in pc levels and catalyst pixel format fullrgb
I have very dark picture on my display like fairchild.

Then set madVR to "TV levels".

Originally Posted by cyberbeing

The problem wouldn't (5) or (7), it would potentially be (9). What does 'display corrected gamma' default to with gamma correction disabled? In the above example it should be 709 gamma, so there is no change from (1). Converting to anything else other than (1) in step (9) would result in a change of gamma.

The chain I described was for the situation where you provide yCMS with both gamut and gamma measurements. In that situation the 3dlut of course applies corrections for "bugs" in your display's measured gamma response.

Originally Posted by cyberbeing

Seeing the more detailed workflow you posted, it appears (2) became the functional replacement of 3dlut input_transfer_function in prior versions. In which case it would be (2), the curve you initially choose the linearize the video with, which would need to be tweak-able. The janos666 'special-tweak' would be setting (2) to your display gamma. I personally never did this, so I like it as you currently have it.

Changing the gamma curve in the madVR "Color & Gamut" settings tab has the same effect as changing either Gamma_Curve or Input_Transfer_Function with madVR v0.61. So this is already fully flexible. Which means: No loss in flexibility at all. All the things that are fixed in the connection between madVR <-> 3dlut are adjustable in runtime inside of madVR now. madVR has practically replaced some of the yCMS functionality. I still believe that there's no loss of flexibility worth mentioning for all real time video playback usage scenarios.

Originally Posted by cyberbeing

Interesting. Which software is this? Do you have a link?

PM me, if you want to know. Don't want to advertize a competitor of yesgrey here...

Originally Posted by cyberbeing

Just to confirm, this applies to RGB input as well? You should probably make a note of this in the Readme.txt or something.

Yes, it applies to everything. madVR has not reached version 1.0 yet. So madVR users have to live with certain limitations. And I won't list them all in the readme. Things change too fast for that to make sense.

Originally Posted by cyberbeing

Well I finally got around to testing today. I can't get 0.61 to match 0.65 when using a 8 bit 3dlut. It appears other people are having issues as well

Yes, there's a bug somewhere. yesgrey and I are working on it.

Originally Posted by cyberbeing

I don't know if this is good news or bad news. 8bit and 7bit had the bug, but 6bit didn't.

So with 6bit you have no stuttering? That's good news, at least.

Originally Posted by cyberbeing

Is this even worth it quality-wise? You'll need to explain how madVR deals with a 6 bit lut.

The professional photo industry commonly uses 3dluts with 17x17x17 input points, I've been told. madVR/yCMS 8bit 3dluts use 256x256x256 input points. With 7bit it's 128x128x128 input points, with 6bit 64x64x64. So even a 6bit madVR/yCMS 3dlut still has a higher resolution than what the professional photo industry commonly uses. I think that should put things nicely into perspective.

Technically, as yesgrey said, madVR uses trilinear interpolation. Consider an 8bit 3dlut as being a big cube consisting of 256x256x256 little subcubes. So there are 256 * 256 * 256 junction points, at most of which 8 cube corners meet. At each of these junction points there's a data value stored. The 3D coordinate of a junction point is the input RGB value. The data value stored at that junction point is the RGB output value. Now if you feed a simple 8bit video into this big cube, every pixel will hit exactly one of the junction points, resulting in a direct output value. Now imagine you feed 9bit video into this 8bit cube. Some video values will still hit junction points. But others will e.g. hit the middle of a subcube. No big problem, though. You can interpolate the correct output value, by calculating a weighted average of the 8 nearest junction points, taking the distance to the junction points into account. This is called "trilinear interpolation". GPUs do that almost for free.

Originally Posted by cyberbeing

Even though it fixes the rare 3dlut performance issue, I'm unsure this is the best answer to the problem. I hope it at least gives you an idea of what the bottleneck may be, and are able to come up with a higher quality solution.

The bottleneck is likely to be the texture cache of your GPU.

Originally Posted by cyberbeing

ps. I like the changes you made to settings dialog. Everything is much less confusing now. My only request would be duplicating the bit-depth selection for the 3dlut into the Calibration or yCMS tab so all the settings are in one place, and you can just click apply to create it when done.

Glad you like the changes. I've thought about putting the 3dlut bitdepth setting into the yCMS tab, too. But then I decided against that because it would take space away for the gamma measurement list. Furthermore it truely is a "trade quality for performance" option and should only be used if you need to trade quality for performance. I think there are arguments for both locations for this option. But I think I prefer it where it is right now.

Originally Posted by Portioli

Is it possible to have a standard 3dlut file for every single tv ?
Just like icc profiles for pc monitors?
E.g. Pqnasonicvt30.3dlut , lgpk550.3dlut etc

I think 90% of users would be very pleased with a standard calibrated setting.

You mean a database where users upload 3dluts they have created for their displays? The problem with this is that the measurements of your display will vary VERY MUCH depending on how your display is configured. E.g. change brightness, contrast, saturation, color, whatever settings even slightly and measurements (and thus the 3dlut file) will change noticeably. So I rather doubt that such an uploaded 3dlut file would really work well for other users of the same display - unless you 100% match all display settings. But even then, I've heard of manufacturers changing from one LCD panel manufacturer to another panel manufacturer in the middle of a product lifetime. So I doubt this would really work...

Originally Posted by tschi

features request : shortcut configurable

Already on my to do list.

Originally Posted by suanm

why do I only get black video image(actually no video image,but sound) with madvr 0.65,when I choose "calibrate this display by using yCMS" function. However I get normal video image with madvr 0.61 by using yCMS,This is why?
virtually I don't understand at all how I should setup the parameters of yCMS ,so I setup the parameters of yCMS random,the result is that I get no video image(black screen),what should I do for perfect video image?

Random parameters won't work. The black video is probably a result of those random values. If you want to use yCMS, you need to have a meter to measure your display. If you have a meter and don't know how to get the values needed for yCMS then please ask in the yCMS thread.

Originally Posted by cyberbeing

TheElix, have you set write permissions to the madVR directory? If you placed madVR in Program Files on Win7, you'll need to edit the permissions to allow non-Administrative write access.

Actually, madVR is cleverer than that. If there's no write access to the current folder, yCMS is downloaded and installed to "user\local application settings\madVR\...".

Originally Posted by TheElix

Also, I created two 3dlut files (hd - pc.3dlut & sd - pc.3dlut) using yCMS and specified it in madVR, but it gave me the following error for either of them:
"This 3dlut file does not match the input format required by madVR."
Here's a config file I used to create hd - pc.3dlut:

madVR v0.62+ needs specific parameters. Please do a search for "yRGB", if you want to know the exact details.

[TheElix]

Originally Posted by madshi

That's weird! Can you post the gamut and gamma measurements you're trying to use? Maybe yCMS doesn't like them? Not sure what else could be going wrong

Here: http://rghost.ru/10309331/image.png
In plain text:
red, Yxy, 36.994, 0.644, 0.335
green, Yxy, 114.868, 0.299, 0.602
blue, Yxy, 13.224, 0.145, 0.063
white, Yxy, 162.966, 0.312, 0.326

20, Yxy, 5.210, 0.309, 0.329
30, Yxy, 11.808, 0.314, 0.331
40, Yxy, 21.633, 0.314, 0.333
50, Yxy, 35.625, 0.314, 0.332
60, Yxy, 53.377, 0.314, 0.331
70, Yxy, 73.243, 0.312, 0.328
80, Yxy, 99.744, 0.312, 0.326
90, Yxy, 129.090, 0.312, 0.327
100, Yxy, 162.966, 0.312, 0.326

Originally Posted by madshi

madVR v0.62+ needs specific parameters. Please do a search for "yRGB", if you want to know the exact details.

tschi has already pointed at my mistake, and it worked. I'm able to use the 3rd option for now (to calibrate using an external 3DLUT file).

And if my Panasonic PDP doesn't support Full RGB, which pixel format should I use and what levels should I use in video driver, in renderer settings?

[madshi]

Originally Posted by TheElix

In plain text: [...]

Weird. 3dlut creation works for me with those numbers. Don't really know what's going wrong for you...

Originally Posted by TheElix

And if my Panasonic PDP doesn't support Full RGB, which pixel format should I use and what levels should I use in video driver, in renderer settings?

That's a misunderstanding. Pretty much all TVs support RGB input. It's just that many of them expect black to be at value 16 and not at value 0. If you switch your GPU to "Full RGB" and your display can't be switched to expect black at value 0, then your desktop and applications and games will look too dark. But you can still use madVR that way, you just have to switch madVR to "TV levels". The GPU will then output 0-255, but madVR will make sure that it renders black to value 16, so that your display is happy. So even if your display doesn't support 0-255 input, it still does support your GPU being set to "RGB Full" as long as you switch madVR to TV levels. But, as I said, with that setup games and applications will have black crush.

[TheElix]

Originally Posted by madshi

But, as I said, with that setup games and applications will have black crush.

Blacks are crushed only when I choose 4:4:4 Full RGB. In all other cases (4:4:4 Limited RGB, 4:4:4 YCbCR and 4:2:2 YCbCr) the picture seems normally calibrated. You suggest that in order to watch videos I have to switch to FullRGB? That's problematic. I don't want to switch back and forth every time I want to watch something. Currently I use 4:4:4 YCbCR with 0-255 levels set everywhere and the picture seems fine. Let me change the question: which is more preferable of the other three?

[madshi]

Originally Posted by TheElix

which is more preferable of the other three?

Don't know, I don't test anything other than what is optimal for image quality.

[pankov]

TheElix
have you tried setting RGB Full and change your brightness and contrast in the same time?
Do you see the missing dark shade detail or you simply get brighter blacks but still no detail?
You can/should use some test patterns which show grey scale ramp from 0 to 255 with at least levels 16 and 232 marked out.

[pankov]

Originally Posted by madshi

madVR v0.64 released

...
* seekbar is now shown only if mouse cursor is on playback monitor
...

madshi,
I'm sad to report that the second part of problem 2 that I reported here
http://forum.doom9.org/showpost.php?...postcount=7453
is still present - moving the mouse anywhere on the secondary monitor still forces the seebar to show up.

[fairchild]

Originally Posted by madshi

If desktop and games have black crush then you can't have full BTB with "RGB Full" and madVR TV levels, either. Seems to me that your display simply clips away some of the BTB data. That's sad, of course, but there's probably not much we can do about it...

I've verified that I do. When using RGB Full in CCC + TV levels in MadVR I get full flashing bars from 2-25 (once I adjust my Brightness up, obviously a properly calibrated display will only show 17-25 once it's configured properly) and shows full WTW flashing bars from 230-252. This is verified with the AVS HD 709 calibration disc.

When I use RGB Full in CCC + PC levels in MadVR, that's when I get no BTB/WTW. Basically, no matter how high I set my brightness (calibrated is 60, have to go to 77 to get rid of the black crush and get proper 17-25 black bars flashing), I never get anything below 17 to flash. WTW gets clipped and only gives 230-234 flashing bars on the White clipping pattern.

So my display doesn't give BTB/WTW info with RGB Full and MadVR PC levels, which might explain why things look off and I get black crush during gaming (even after properly setting the brightness and bringing it up to get no clipping from 17-25 on the Black clipping pattern).

The weird thing is, when I use EVR (with Output Range 0-255) and select the Input Range in ffdshow as Full Range (Y :0-255, CbCr :16-240) then I get full BTB and WTW with properly calibrated settings on my TV (I don't have to change the brightness or anything). But this still doesn't help my situation with the desktop being crushed and having to adjust the brightness up when I want to game and possibly have some lost detail.

For now I've just dealt with using RGB Limited + TV levels so I don't have to fuss with changing back and forth settings. This is of course not going to give me optimal image quality, but IMO the visual quality difference is most likely neglible to my eyes and ultimately I love MadVR for it's unparalleled smoothness + ycms.

[TheElix]

Originally Posted by pankov

or you simply get brighter blacks but still no detail?

This. I'm able to get some detail, but not as perfectly as with Limited RGB (I'm able to distinguish 1-2 from 0 at Limited RGB but only 7-8 with Full RGB).

[Neeto]

madshi you are seriously good!
I'm getting very good uplifts in the WAF (Wife Approval Factor) - there is no higher praise ;-)

Given the recent intenstive discussions on color correction etc, I think I might be able to get some guidance on something that I've long wanted to ask.

To watch movies, MPC-HT is invoked from Window Media Center via My Movies & with 3DLUT support & display calibration it's all good picture quality :-)

But the splitter/decoder/render chain is DMO etc when watching live TV in Windows.

This is the "family" HTPC onto a 50" Panasonic PDP and needs to service "never logged onto a PC but have perfect eye sight" users.
i.e. no custom Live view TV apps! So I'm stuck using Media Center for Live TV viewing & thus the DMO chain.

Windows 7 added automatic custom ICC Profile loading
Control Pannel->All Control Pannel Items->Display->Screen Resolution->Advanced Settings->Color Management->Color Management

And this is processed in the video card - right?
What if any limitations does this have compared to what is done madVR with yCMS/3DLUTs?

So given that I want best picture in BOTH MPC-HT and standard windows 7 DMO chains, would it be best to:

1. Calibrate display as best as possible
using the standard ICC profile is "sRGB IEC61966-2.1" via the standard DMO windows chain
Is sRGB IEC61966-2.1 the correct profile?

2. Then create a "Panasonic 50 model xxx" custom ICC profile and assign this as the default ICC Profile for the display device in windows color management using standard DMO windows chain
Recommendations on how to create & what tools the customer ICC Profile for auto loading by Windows7 Color Managament? I have an Eye One.

3. Then calibrate again and get another set of primary measures for madVR/yCMS using MPC-HT, ffdshow, madVR chain

Windows 7 DMO chain will use 1 & 2.
MPC-HT will use 1, 2 & 3.

If I'm lucky I won't need 2 or 3 because I'll be able to perfectly calibrate my display? (I live in hope)
And I might not need 3 because 1 & 2 will give me a correct picture
But in reality I'll need all 1, 2 & 3?

The standard windows DMO chain seems to want to output TV levels, even with FullRGB set in CCC.
This if is fine a picture/jpg display & desktop seem to be fine.
And I can set TV Levels in madVR and get everything correct.

[pacemaker1000]

anybody find a fix for the horrible green bar and colours being off you get with certain mp4 videos when switching refresh rate while loading

loading another file before hand, in other words changing refreesh first, solves the problem

[suanm]

Hi madshi & yesgray
To me playback doesn't drop frames or isn't stuttering & stammering any longer for no use calibration function with madvr 0.65 version.This is very great.But no use yCMS calibration function will make video image quality reduced.I want to use yCMS function,But I don't know how to setup values of yCMS parameter,I don't have any of instruments or meters to test RGB on my displayer.what will I do?

[madshi]

Originally Posted by pankov

madshi,
I'm sad to report that the second part of problem 2 that I reported here
http://forum.doom9.org/showpost.php?...postcount=7453
is still present - moving the mouse anywhere on the secondary monitor still forces the seebar to show up.

Playback on primary, mouse on secondary?

Originally Posted by fairchild

I've verified that I do. When using RGB Full in CCC + TV levels in MadVR I get full flashing bars from 2-25 (once I adjust my Brightness up, obviously a properly calibrated display will only show 17-25 once it's configured properly) and shows full WTW flashing bars from 230-252. This is verified with the AVS HD 709 calibration disc.

When I use RGB Full in CCC + PC levels in MadVR, that's when I get no BTB/WTW. Basically, no matter how high I set my brightness (calibrated is 60, have to go to 77 to get rid of the black crush and get proper 17-25 black bars flashing), I never get anything below 17 to flash. WTW gets clipped and only gives 230-234 flashing bars on the White clipping pattern.

When you set madVR to PC levels, madVR renders black to 0 and white to 255. RGB does not support negative values, so BTB and WTW are automatically cut off. Setting madVR to PC levels means that it's impossible to transport BTB/WTW to the display. That is bad if you want to check calibration stuff, but it's not a big problem (if any at all) for real movie watching since BTB/WTW are not supposed to be seen, anyway.

This has nothing to do with games, though. If you can make all 16-235 bars visible with madVR and GPU set to PC levels, then you should see all game information, too. However, it's possible that modifying the display brightness/contrast options so much could screw up the gamma response somehow.

Originally Posted by fairchild

For now I've just dealt with using RGB Limited + TV levels

RGB Limited + TV levels means double expansion for video. With this setup video black should be brighter (more grey) than games black.

Originally Posted by Neeto

Given the recent intenstive discussions on color correction etc, I think I might be able to get some guidance on something that I've long wanted to ask.

For strictly calibration related questions it'd be better to ask in the yCMS thread. I can't answer most of those questions.

Originally Posted by pacemaker1000

anybody find a fix for the horrible green bar and colours being off you get with certain mp4 videos when switching refresh rate while loading

Have you tried a different decoder?

Originally Posted by suanm

But no use yCMS calibration function will make video image quality reduced.I want to use yCMS function,But I don't know how to setup values of yCMS parameter,I don't have any of instruments or meters to test RGB on my displayer.what will I do?

The main purpose of yCMS is to fix imperfections in your display. In order to do that yCMS first needs to know if your display has any imperfections and what they are exactly. There's no way for you to tell yCMS that without having a meter. So if you don't have a meter, you simply can't use yCMS. End of story.

[WontonNoodle]

so for madvr pre 0.61, how did ycms work??? (I dont have a meter)

[madshi]

Originally Posted by WontonNoodle

so for madvr pre 0.61, how did ycms work??? (I dont have a meter)

With older madVR versions you could activate a 3dlut, but without a meter yCMS just performed some rather simple conversions. These simple conversions are now performed by madVR instead in real time via pixel shaders in the same quality. So with newer madVR versions using yCMS doesn't bring any benefit, anymore, if you don't have a meter. From now on yCMS is only for people who have a meter (or who know the exact primary coordinates of their display).

So to sum up:

If you don't have a meter, don't use yCMS. There's no need to. madVR does all that you need in the same quality.

If you do have a meter, use yCMS to calibrate/optimize your display.

[kostik]

I have a question about pixel format.
How do I know that when I choose Full RGB , my card is really outputting full RGB?
When I choose full RGB it looks I get strong white and black. But when I choose Limited it seems to be more brighter and less "PUNCHY" like RGB FULL.