madVR - high quality video renderer (GPU assisted)

[hannes69]

Originally Posted by jmone

While madVR's config GUI says this setting will last 7.79 hours, I can confirm it worked perfectly for just under 2 hours. Interestly, is that madVR kept updating the reported display calculation from 23.9758 @ 1 min, to 23.97608 but the end of the movie as well as the expect drop.repeat frames.

Normal behaviour. The longer you measure physical quantities, the more accurate gets the measurement. This is the case when the value is a constant one in reality.
Here the values (frequencies) aren´t constant, they are e.g. temperature dependant. So when watching a movie and heating up your computer case these values will drift to a certain degree.
So your custom resolution is more or less perfect now (as perfect as you can tune it) when drifting between a couple of hours and some days drop/repeat time.

[RXP]

Originally Posted by cyberscott

I own a LG C6 and I've noticed no additional banding or issues with 12 bit enabled in the Nvidia control panel with madVR. Of course, all equipment has variations so best thing to do is a "stare and compare" with a paused video or better yet a .pgn screen capture with 12 bit on and off.
Even so, madVR's 8 bit processing is excellent so even with 12 bit not enable, you'd be hard pressed to see a difference, I'd think.

Thanks - I'll keep it at 8 bit so when I have my JVC x9000 on it'll work with that too.

[tp4tissue]

Originally Posted by j82k

I suggest everyone running their LG Oleds at 12-bit or in PC-mode to check out Rtings 16-bit gradient test pattern played in madVR.

https://www.rtings.com/images/test-m...ent-16-bit.tif


By the way PC-mode also forces 3:2 pulldown even when outputting 23.976 Hz.

Are we sure that this test pattern is Valid and that if it shows banding, it means our 10bit HDR remuxes would suffer the same ?

Are you talking about PC-mode on the LG, or pc-mode in NvidiaCP (hdmi intent) ?

[j82k]

I'm of course talking about PC-Input mode on the LG Oled, as that is the only way to get 4:4:4 chroma.

I also notice the banding on HDR gradient test pattern when using pc-mode or 12-bit so it's not a pattern issue.

I'm not trying to prove anything here, use whatever you like. I was just a bit baffled that there are quite a few people using such a subpar setup.
4:4:4 chroma is nice but not at the cost of increased banding and 3:2 pulldown judder...

[SamuriHL]

I personally agree with you. I shut off PC mode because of the banding issues. I haven't looked back since.

[el Filou]

Originally Posted by j82k

I was just a bit baffled that there are quite a few people using such a subpar setup.
4:4:4 chroma is nice but not at the cost of increased banding and 3:2 pulldown judder...

Out of curiosity, do those issues also happen if using YCbCr 4:4:4 as input, or just with RGB?
I'm disappointed that UHD TVs that are supposed to be high end can't properly process 4:4:4 @ 4K without suffering those kind of quirks. This shows they have not yet reached the same maturity as the late high end 1080p displays (maybe in the 2019 models it will be fixed?).

[j82k]

PC input mode has always been somehow fu*ked up on LG Oleds. Some time ago I pretty much tried all the color/bit-depth combinations in pc-mode and while some were better than others, all of them produced worse gradients than the standard hdmi mode, especially in darker colors. Output was set to 24Hz, so surely this can't be a HDMI bandwidth issue.

[SamuriHL]

It's very likely caused by their video processor (the a9 or whatever it's called). I have my doubts about the 2019 models fixing 12 bit banding issues or banding issues with PC mode. But we'll know in a few weeks when the first models are released I guess. I'm certainly not upgrading again any time soon.

[Asmodian]

Originally Posted by j82k

4:4:4 chroma is nice but not at the cost of increased banding and 3:2 pulldown judder...

I notice this as well, in PC mode. I need to use smooth motion at 60 Hz instead of 24 Hz.

However, I do like smooth motion more than 4:2:2 chroma. 4:2:2 chroma bothers me really a lot.

Originally Posted by SamuriHL

I personally agree with you. I shut off PC mode because of the banding issues. I haven't looked back since.

I notice PC mode causes banding issues for HDR on my C7 but not for SDR. Does SDR seems to have more banding in PC mode for you?

Also the input lag in non-PC mode is way too high for me, I need to start worrying about adding an audio delay, the mouse feels laggy, etc.

[SamuriHL]

I didn't really test a lot of SDR content so I'm not really sure. I noticed it in HDR and ended up having to turn it off. I don't have the input lag issues you're seeing, though. But I have almost all processing turned off.

[j82k]

In SDR the difference is more subtle than in HDR and can only be seen on test pattern or very specific scenes but I absolutely hate color banding so PC-mode is out of the question, at least for movies.

[Rippner]

hello, it is normal I notice an huge quality improvement only with 2160p files? I have a 32 uhd monitor, default madvr settings. 1080p files looks the same compared to windows media player

[el Filou]

Try NGU Sharp for upscaling.

[cyberscott]

Originally Posted by j82k

I suggest everyone running their LG Oleds at 12-bit or in PC-mode to check out Rtings 16-bit gradient test pattern played in madVR.

https://www.rtings.com/images/test-m...ent-16-bit.tif

My LG C8 shows noticeable banding, especially visible in the darker green gradient when using either 12-bit or 8/12-bit PC-mode. In 8-bit, non-pc mode it looks fine.
It was the same on my C6 so I don't really understand if something is wrong with my setup or if other people just don't notice the banding.

By the way PC-mode also forces 3:2 pulldown even when outputting 23.976 Hz.
So you get 4:4:4 chroma and lower input lag but you'll also get color banding and forced 3:2 pulldown.

Thanks for the test pattern!

I tried the test pattern and I do see what you mentioned about the banding in PC mode on the C6. I goes away disabling PC mode and switching to the YCbCr444 color space in the control panel.
To my eyes, the banding is slight and with some madVR setting tweaks, it can be pretty much eliminated in videos but at the cost of more processing power.
I can deal with it but hopefully TV manufactures can sort out PC mode better in the near future.

[Rippner]

Originally Posted by el Filou

Try NGU Sharp for upscaling.

thanks, but you mean chroma upscaling? I tried ngu sharp very high quality, but no improvement. also I tried image upscaling ngu sharp, but still no improvement

[tp4tissue]

Originally Posted by cyberscott

Thanks for the test pattern!

nip nip

Do you guys think, it might be that the Banding is actually gone in other modes, because the LG's internal processor is applying its own debanding?

So with PC mode, it's actually doing the raw input without internal deband, and thereby exhibiting the natural output ?

It doesn't seem right that the banding comes back so consistently on multiple products, unless something internal has been set intentionally.

[cyberscott]

Originally Posted by tp4tissue

Do you guys think, it might be that the Banding is actually gone in other modes, because the LG's internal processor is applying its own debanding?

So with PC mode, it's actually doing the raw input without internal deband, and thereby exhibiting the natural output ?

It doesn't seem right that the banding comes back so consistently on multiple products, unless something internal has been set intentionally.

It is entirely possible. Pretty much all picture enhancements are disabled in PC mode in order to get RGB 4:4:4 and the lower latency.
All the other modes have some or all of the enhancements available.
I enjoy the over all picture quality of C6 in conjunction with madVR in PC mode. Best thing to do is just experiment with the other modes and choose what looks best for YOU.

[ryrynz]

No need to quote an entire post directly above yours, thanks.

[madjock]

Having a play with one of the latest test builds of HDR->SDR now I have a graphics card that can handle it. I think it looks really nice, but unsure if this is because my SDR is calibrated more for blacks and whites (using test patterns and nothing fancy) and going from HDR to an HDR -> SDR comparison is hard to compare as I cannot really calibrate the HDR side, so the SDR looks brighter and punchier for an initial comparison.

Any expert or more experienced person done a more in depth analysis with an LED TV and have any thoughts ?

[j82k]

So I just measured a 50 point saturation sweep using 20% pattern stimulus on my LG C8 in PC HDMI input mode (4:4:4 chroma) vs standard HDMI input mode.
All picture enhancement settings were disabled. GPU was set to RGB Full 8-bit.



That pretty much confirms the banding I'm seeing when using pc-mode.
I didn't even bother to check other colors.