madVR - high quality video renderer (GPU assisted)

[Wile-E-Coyote]

Originally Posted by 6233638

For my audio renderer, I use ReClock, though it is not required for this to work.

I disabled all internal source/transform filters in MPC-HC, though I have now enabled the "MPEG-2 Video" filter, as that allows subtitles to work.

My external filter list is:

• LAV Splitter
• LAV Audio Decoder (with Arcsoft DTS dll installed)
• LAV CUVID Decoder
• ffdshow Audio Processor (I use the Mixer function to downmix to 2 channel audio with a custom matrix)

If you have other splitters installed on your system (e.g. Haali's) you may need to add them to your external filter list and set them to "block" (all filters in my list are set to "prefer")

To start a DVD, make sure you use the "Open DVD" command (CTRL + D) not the "Open Disc" command in MPC-HC.

Menu navigation does not seem to work on all discs, I just load the film directly from the Navigate > Jump To title menu in MPC-HC.

This is on Windows 7, I don't know if it will work on XP/Vista.

I'm on Windows 7. When I tried this method I didn't have LAV Audio Decoder so i'll try again with it. To install Arcsoft DTS dll I assume I have to install TMT and register the dll or something?

Anyway, if it comes down to having to jump to the main title manually, I have noticed that opening the main title's IFO file (something like vts_01_0.IFO) manually works very well no matter what filter/renderer I'm using. Of course that doesn't give me access to the chapters but I don't care about chapters so much.

It's not even that the madVR+MPC combo doesn't like DVDs, it just doesn't like VIDEO_TS.ifo hehe

[madshi]

Originally Posted by namaiki

However, now when vsfilter is in-between ffdshow video decoder(RGB32 output) and madVR, the video and subtitles are flipped upside down (vertically?).

Might be fixed in the next build.

Originally Posted by cyberbeing

Bug: Just now I discovered a bug in madVR 0.67 which causes stuttering with moving subtitles which doesn't exist in VMR9. It only happens when the madVR ffmpeg decoder is enabled, so it may have to do with the bad timestamp problem you spoke of?

Can I have a sample for that, please?

[xv]

madVR 0.67 crashes on 4:4:4 input (from lavvideo decoder), 0.66 works fine (samples are already posted).

On the MP4 problem: Found out it´s not perfectly reproduceable, sometimes it doesn´t work, sometimes it just takes very long. But it seems to me decoder is losing sync (ffmpeg and intel both have the problem, but different). With some file if you try to seek, video starts again from beginning. Problem only with madVR decoder, lavvideo, lavcuvid and ffdshow work fine. Unfortunately I cannot post a sample, the files with the problems I cannot post for different reasons, and all small samples I mux myself work fine. Maybe someone else can find a small sample with the problem and upload it.

Another question: Will you continue with the work on madVR internal decoders or try to make nevvideo+madVR an optimal solution for high quality video presentation?

[madshi]

Originally Posted by xv

madVR 0.67 crashes on 4:4:4 input (from lavvideo decoder), 0.66 works fine (samples are already posted).

Should be fixed in the next build.

Originally Posted by xv

Another question: Will you continue with the work on madVR internal decoders or try to make nevvideo+madVR an optimal solution for high quality video presentation?

I plan to continue to work on the madVR internal decoders, but of course I will also do whatever is needed to make external decoders work as well as possible.

[Wile-E-Coyote]

Update on DVD compatibility.

I works now after installing LAV Audio and making sure MPC uses it. I didn't even have to look into that arcsoft dts dll.

Though it won't use LAV Cuvid. It falls back on ffdshow or whatever filter it can find that reads DVD (my favourite being NVidia Decoder for hardware acceleration).

Still, better than not working at all. Thanks for the help guys.

[JarrettH]

Hm I really don't get how you got it to work. What MPC build are you using? What decoder are you using? I'm sure madshi will have a solution soon anyway

[Wile-E-Coyote]

Originally Posted by JarrettH

Hm I really don't get how you got it to work. What MPC build are you using? What decoder did you end up using? I'm sure madshi will have a solution soon anyway

MPC-HC build 1.5.0.2827

LAV Splitter (latest)
LAV Cuvid Decoder (latest)
NVidia Video Decoder (also works with ffdshow video decoder)
LAV Audio Decorder (latest)
madVR 0.66

Now it works fine even when using File -> Open disc or simply inserting the DVD in the drive...

Go figure *shrug*

[6233638]

Originally Posted by Wile-E-Coyote

I'm on Windows 7. When I tried this method I didn't have LAV Audio Decoder so i'll try again with it. To install Arcsoft DTS dll I assume I have to install TMT and register the dll or something?

Just drop the "dtsdecoderdll.dll" from TMT5 into the LAV Filters folder and it should work. (you will get 24-bit etc. reported if it's working, if it's 32-bit float it's using the default ffdshow filters) Arcsoft is bit-perfect decoding, ffdshow may not be.

Originally Posted by Wile-E-Coyote

It's not even that the madVR+MPC combo doesn't like DVDs, it just doesn't like VIDEO_TS.ifo hehe

That's possible, I just use actual DVDs and use the "Open DVD" option, "Open Disc" or other methods of starting a DVD still result in a Macrovision error.

Originally Posted by Wile-E-Coyote

After inserting the DVD I get the "macrovision fail" message in MPC, then I do File -> Open DVD and manually select the disc, and it works!

Note : using File -> Open disc also gets the job done.

Weird, autoplaying discs works fine for me. "Open disc" sometimes works depending on the title, but "Open DVD" is 100% reliable for me.

Glad you have it sorted now though.

[JarrettH]

I went back to MPC 3262 which was the only thing I could think of. Anyway, I guess I'll be content with EVR-CP + Microsoft with DVDs for a little while longer

[Wile-E-Coyote]

Originally Posted by JarrettH

I went back to MPC 3262 which was the only thing I could think of. Anyway, I guess I'll be content with EVR-CP + Microsoft with DVDs for a little while longer

Forgot to mention I have all the filters mentioned above are set to "prefer" except for ffdshow.

[HitomiKun]

I just noticed that subtitles sometimes start blinking/stuttering for like 0.5 sec while switching to the next line. It happens very rare and isn't too annoying. I didn't even use the decoders you gave us with 0.67 (I used CoreAVC). Just sayin, maybe it's that bad timestamp problem?

Edit: I tried to reproduce that problem, but it doesn't happen on the same spot. - It didn't happen at all. This is completely random.

I use MPC-HC 1.5.2.3423 with following external filters:
CoreAVC Video Decoder *prefer
madFLAC Decoder *prefer
ffdshow raw video filter *prefer (for some post-processing)

I have set madVR under Playback -> Output.
CoreAVC outputs YV12 only. Same does ffdshow raw video filter.

[Vern Dias]

Well, you could delete the log after every try. Then the size stays down.

That could be pretty hard to do when you have to be in exclusive mode to see if it fails. It's the switch out of and then back into exclusive mode that causes the issue. The 2 logs I have are 300 MB and 900 MB, so there is no way to post them anywhere.....

BTW, the audio playback (and the logging) continues after the screen freezes or goes black....

How about a little more sophistcated logging scheme??? Maybe an option to define a log size and overwrite in round robin fashion? Or an option to control what's logged?

I'll try and see if I can get you a complete log, but when a minute of video creates a multi MB log, it's pretty tricky.

BTW I am also seeing multiple lines of red text flashing up onto the upper left of the screen, but it's only there for a frame or two, so it's impossible to read....

Vern

[madshi]

Originally Posted by HitomiKun

I just noticed that subtitles sometimes start blinking/stuttering for like 0.5 sec while switching to the next line. It happens very rare and isn't too annoying. I didn't even use the decoders you gave us with 0.67 (I used CoreAVC). Just sayin, maybe it's that bad timestamp problem?

Edit: I tried to reproduce that problem, but it doesn't happen on the same spot. - It didn't happen at all. This is completely random.

The timestamp problem I mentioned only applies to the internal decoders. If you have problems with external decoders, that's a completely separate issue. It might be a bug in CoreAVC or in the splitter.

Originally Posted by Vern Dias

The 2 logs I have are 300 MB and 900 MB, so there is no way to post them anywhere.....

Is that 300MB before zipping it or after? Try RAR, you'll be amazed how small the files get!! The logs are just simple text files, so they compress extremely well. Text files like this is exactly where ZIP/RAR work best.

[Mercury_22]

Originally Posted by madshi

Actually it *is* correct. If you ask madVR to output PC levels, by definition black is set to 0 and white to 255. BTB would be negative numbers with PC levels, and that's not technically possible. So with PC levels the darkest color your display can get is exactly black. This is how PC levels work. If EVR still shows BTB even with PC levels, this is incorrect behaviour by EVR.

TVs and projectors usually expect TV levels. With TV levels, black is set to 16 and white is set to 235. So BTB values are transported to the display in the 0-15 range. Your display will not show the BTB range by default, but you can make it visible by increasing brightness.

madVR is behaving perfectly accurate. It's EVR that is doing things wrong. You need to decide whether you want to use PC levels or TV levels. If you use PC levels, BTB is automatically clipped with no way to get it back by increasing brightness on your TV. If you want to be able to see BTB by increasing display brightness, then you need to use TV levels. Of course you will need to calibrate your TV accordingly, so that BTB and WTW areas are not shown.

I hope you don't mind that I've moved this here Please bear with me cause now I'm a little confused
So what I understand from you is that the value of the Black video level (which is 16 no?) in the test pattern is changing (to 0)if I use PC levels so I can't see the -4% black bar ?

Pattern Layout: The pattern consists of a background at video black, then a symmetrical three step PLUGE on both the left and right side of the log gray scale in the middle of the pattern. The outer part of the PLUGE contains a -4% black bar on the video black background followed by a +4% bar and +2% bar as you go towards the middle from either side. The gray scale in the middle represents steps of about 18.4%, 32.1%, 69% and 100%.

Turn the brightness control up far enough for the 2% strip to be visible and there will be a difference between the blacker than black and video black background

Page 40 of 69 Joe Kane Productions AVFoundry Video Forge Generator

[madshi]

Originally Posted by Mercury_22

I hope you don't mind that I've moved this here Please bear with me cause now I'm a little confused
So what I understand from you is that the value of the Black video level (which is 16 no?) in the test pattern is changing (to 0)if I use PC levels so I can't see the -4% black bar ?

That is correct.

Please understand that all DVD and Blu-Ray players by default output TV levels, not PC levels. And by far most TVs and projectors expect TV levels. So what Joe Kane says is true, because he silently implies that you're using TV levels.

PC levels are not commonly used in the CE world. PC levels are mostly used by PCs. Surprise! That's where the name comes from. Windows always renders black to 0 and white to 255. If you ask your video player to output PC levels, it outputs black as 0 and white as 255. As a result BTB is cut off.

Which type of display are you using? If it's a computer type display, it might expect PC levels. In that case: If you connected a standalone DVD or Blu-Ray player to your display, you would probably have raised black levels. The image would look similar to what you see when you switch madVR to TV levels. Computer type displays were never made to show BTB.

Some displays and some CE sources (mainly PS3 and Xbox) can be switched between PC levels and TV levels. So because of PS3 and Xbox the whole PC levels topic has been growing more important in the CE business, too.

P.S: Most DVD and Blu-Ray players actually output YCbCr and not RGB by default, and YCbCr is pretty much always TV levels. The difference between PC levels and TV levels mostly only applies to RGB.

[Mercury_22]

Ok for your help
It seems I've got confused "because he silently implies that I'm using TV levels"
My display accepts all levels (see my signature) and the EVR normally looks like madvr PC levels but I've manually "adjusted" the CCC's video settings so I can see BTB with pc levels (stupid now I know)

[Vern Dias]

Thanks, the files do compress amazingly well.

Here are the links to the files:

http://www.yousendit.com/download/cn...SU9OMUJjR0E9PQ
http://www.yousendit.com/download/cn...eDN3NUpjR0E9PQ

Vern

[Vern Dias]

And by far most TVs and projectors expect TV levels.

Yes, but most projectors and flat panel TV's also have an option to select full range. My JVC projector works far better when connected to a PC by selecting the full range option on the JVC and the PC. That allows the passage of WTW and BTB and makes calibration patterns much easier to interpret.

Vern

[madshi]

Originally Posted by Vern Dias

Thanks, the files do compress amazingly well.

I've checked out your logs and the cause of the problem is that at some point when the playback window resolution changes (e.g. happens if you resize the player window, or switch between fullscreen and windowed mode), and madVR tries to update all GPU resources accordingly, madVR can no longer create or upload Direct3D vertex buffers. It just fails, for whatever reason. When that happens, madVR can not render any frames, anymore, as a result the screen stays black or frozen, and madVR tries to render again all the time, probably pushing the CPU to 100%.

The big question is WHY can madVR not create or upload the Direct3D vertex buffers, anymore? It would be a GPU driver bug. Have you tried updating to the latest driver version? It could also be madVR just running out of GPU memory. I see you're using a 3dlut. Does the problem go away if you disable the 3dlut? I'm asking because the 3dlut is of course eating GPU memory like crazy. You could also try switching to a 7bit 3dlut. Or maybe turning off Aero would also do the trick?

[zeroo]

Here is one more case when the picture freezes, while the sound keeps running. It happens only on the secondary display in fullscreen exclusive mode. When I switch back to windowed mode, it unfreezes the picture.

http://www.mediafire.com/?hg5we3qf2lu0jrd

I can reproduce the freezing by open/minimize/maximize a window of another app on primary display. But it happens also by itself, sometimes after 15 minutes of playback, 1 hour etc.
I'm using the NVIDIA 275.33 drivers.