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Old 12th February 2019, 08:58   #54681  |  Link
sat4all
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Nvidia bug affect both madVR passthrough and Pixel Shader with HDR output enabled, Do some comparaison by playing your HDR content using TV internal media player and you will see what i'm talking about.
But if you ask me, Pixel Shader with HDR output enabled is the best of the worst.
I was digging arround nvidia forums and i couldn't find a single topic about this bug, so time they hear our voice. and maybe madshi could help us by using his NV contact.

https://forums.geforce.com/default/t...-hdr-metadata/

Edit: haha madjock was faster quoting my own post
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Last edited by sat4all; 12th February 2019 at 09:00.
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Old 12th February 2019, 09:50   #54682  |  Link
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Thanks guys, but does 385.28 mean you can pixel shader with HDR output without issue? Easy for me to downgrade
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Old 12th February 2019, 10:09   #54683  |  Link
sat4all
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Yes, 385.28 work properly with either passthrough or HDR pixel shader.
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Old 12th February 2019, 10:46   #54684  |  Link
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Anyone know what the last nvidia driver to work properly for hdr passthrough is?
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Old 12th February 2019, 10:59   #54685  |  Link
sat4all
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The bad news, is nvidia's hdr api is deprecated and pending removal.
As nevcairiel said, maybe madshi should consider OS HDR API instead of NV.
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Old 12th February 2019, 12:07   #54686  |  Link
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So, because of all this bogus metadata talk I compared nvidia drivers 385.28 (red) and 418.81 (yellow) simply by running a 4000 nits metadata grayscale sweep in HCFR.
TV is a LG C8.

As can be seen in the attached picture, below 450 nits there is no difference but above that the roll-off is much smoother with the correct metadata (385.28).
Using windows HDR produces the same bogus metadata result as 418.81.




I really hope this will get fixed soon.
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Old 12th February 2019, 12:16   #54687  |  Link
iSeries
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Quote:
Originally Posted by j82k View Post
So, because of all this bogus metadata talk I compared nvidia drivers 385.28 (red) and 418.81 (yellow) simply by running a 4000 nits metadata grayscale sweep in HCFR.
TV is a LG C8.
Hi j82k, thanks for this - I know you're likely to be busy but any way you could test a couple other driver versions? (I loaned my meter to someone). Specifically 398.11, which is apparently the last driver that is working fine for HDR passthrough (and conveniently the driver that brought improved 23p playback...I never could get any good timings with 385.28)

Last edited by iSeries; 12th February 2019 at 12:45. Reason: Added thanks
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Old 12th February 2019, 12:23   #54688  |  Link
sat4all
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@j82k
Thanks, that very helpfull, would you please install the latest test build along with nvidia 418.81 drivers and take measurements with those settings:

tone map HDR using pixel shaders
output video in HDR format = enabled
target / real display peak nits = 800
apply dynamic clipping = enabled
apply target nits selection = disabled
LG dynamic tone mapping = off

Because it seems ok for me and almost matchs correct playback using my tv embedded media player.

Btw, did you take the previous measurements with your tv's dynamic tone mapping on or off?

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Last edited by sat4all; 12th February 2019 at 13:19.
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Old 12th February 2019, 12:28   #54689  |  Link
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@j82k

Thanks for clarifying and the explanation.
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Old 12th February 2019, 13:06   #54690  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by iSeries View Post
Hi j82k, thanks for this - I know you're likely to be busy but any way you could test a couple other driver versions? (I loaned my meter to someone). Specifically 398.11, which is apparently the last driver that is working fine for HDR passthrough (and conveniently the driver that brought improved 23p playback...I never could get any good timings with 385.28)
I'm already back to 385.28.

But it's easy to test even without a meter. I explained this before, don't know if you missed it. On the LG C8 the 20-point white balance adjustment points are different when the TV receives 1000 or 4000 nits metadata.

Just open madTPG and enable HDR. Go into your TVs 20 point white-balance settings and check the second last adjustment point. With 4000 nits metadata it should be 713. The number will change in real time when you switch between 1000 and 4000 nits in madTPG. If it doesn't show 713 when madTPG is set to 4000 it means the TV is getting the bogus metadata.

As for timings for 23p. On my 1050ti all I have to do in madVRs custom modes tool is pick EDID/CTA and change the pixel clock from 296.70 to 296.69 which gives me almost perfect 23.976 Hz. But of course that could be different on other GPUs.


Quote:
Originally Posted by sat4all View Post
@j82k
Thanks, that very helpfull, would you please install the latest test build along with nvidia 418.81 drivers and take measurements with those settings:

tone map HDR using pixel shaders
output video in HDR format = enabled
target / real display peak nits = 800
apply dynamic clipping = enabled
apply target nits selection = disabled

Because it seems ok for me and almost matchs correct playback using my tv embedded media player.

I tried messing with madVRs tone mapping in passthrough and it didn't make a difference on the grayscale sweeps. I was still on madVRhdrMeasure43 though.
But I think displaying single colored squares isn't really a good way to test dynamic tone mapping.
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Old 12th February 2019, 13:55   #54691  |  Link
iSeries
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Quote:
Originally Posted by j82k View Post
On the LG C8 the 20-point white balance adjustment points are different when the TV receives 1000 or 4000 nits metadata.

Just open madTPG and enable HDR. Go into your TVs 20 point white-balance settings and check the second last adjustment point. With 4000 nits metadata it should be 713. The number will change in real time when you switch between 1000 and 4000 nits in madTPG. If it doesn't show 713 when madTPG is set to 4000 it means the TV is getting the bogus metadata.
Thanks - just tested this with 416.81, and got 696 on the second last adjustment

EDIT - and tested 398.11 and it shows 713.

Last edited by iSeries; 12th February 2019 at 14:15.
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Old 12th February 2019, 14:03   #54692  |  Link
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Originally Posted by sneaker_ger View Post
There is no black bar detection with D3D11 native (or DXVA2 native). D3D11 copy-back or DXVA2 copy-back aren't fast enough on your system?.
I own an Rtx 2070 but I never seen D3D11 copy back option in lav decoder... Look at the attached picture....

Why?

On the other side I've tried dxva2 copy back but... With uhd 24fps films I've to lower ngu up scaling to "sharp low quality".
With uhd 60fps demo clip I forcely need to use d3d11 decoding to have no dropped frames.
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Old 12th February 2019, 14:13   #54693  |  Link
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Its actually right in front of you if you read the wording at the bottom.

As far as selecting scalers, I think a lot of the newer cards need to be FSE to get the most out of them.
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Old 12th February 2019, 15:55   #54694  |  Link
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For people with NVIDIA & HDR who have a way to test what the TV is receiving (with diag dongle or light meter), did you try changing the "SDR brightness" slider in Windows Settings to see if that changed the bogus metadata being sent to the TV?
It may be a bug with Windows making everything go through the SDR-to-HDR convertor.

Edit: another test: try playing some HDR file with Windows' own Movies & TV app to see if the metadata being sent is different from when using madVR. If yes, then MS may have added some HDR API available from UWP apps but not from Win32?
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Last edited by el Filou; 12th February 2019 at 16:02.
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Old 12th February 2019, 16:34   #54695  |  Link
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Originally Posted by madjock View Post
its actually right in front of you if you read the wording at the bottom.

As far as selecting scalers, i think a lot of the newer cards need to be fse to get the most out of them.
why fse ?
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Old 12th February 2019, 16:38   #54696  |  Link
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No doubt, but what concerns me is if we/they mess to what they think it should look like, then are they actually seeing what it was meant to be. I am sure like me people read UHD reviews on Bluray.com and the amount that say the colours are this, or uptick in detail here, but how many people actually care what there TV is doing. We are actually buying Blurays or UHDs from reviews when its just a normal TV with no fancy third party application making it perfect ? if there is such a thing and looking at that forum, it is going round in circles with every new clever iteration.
madjock, if you don't care, why are you here ? why post at all ? why argue ?
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Old 12th February 2019, 16:50   #54697  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by el Filou View Post
For people with NVIDIA & HDR who have a way to test what the TV is receiving (with diag dongle or light meter), did you try changing the "SDR brightness" slider in Windows Settings to see if that changed the bogus metadata being sent to the TV?
It may be a bug with Windows making everything go through the SDR-to-HDR convertor.

Edit: another test: try playing some HDR file with Windows' own Movies & TV app to see if the metadata being sent is different from when using madVR. If yes, then MS may have added some HDR API available from UWP apps but not from Win32?

I thought madshi said he wasn't developing for os-hdr.
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Old 12th February 2019, 16:52   #54698  |  Link
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madjock, if you don't care, why are you here ? why post at all ? why argue ?
Where does it say I don't care, this is not just about HDR, why 3 posts at once ?
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Old 12th February 2019, 16:53   #54699  |  Link
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why fse ?
Because 2070s drivers are quite new and it seems to have helped some.
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Old 12th February 2019, 18:04   #54700  |  Link
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madshi's response in that nVidia thread is troubling. If there's no "windows api for hdr" that he can call to enable/disable hdr and nVidia removes their deprecated api that's going to leave us in quite a bind when it comes to new drivers. Awesome....sigh
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