Welcome to Doom9's Forum, THE in-place to be for everyone interested in DVD conversion.

Before you start posting please read the forum rules. By posting to this forum you agree to abide by the rules.

 

Go Back   Doom9's Forum > Hardware & Software > Software players

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 16th November 2011, 20:13   #10981  |  Link
noee
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 530
In windowed mode, with SD interlaced video material, if I leave queues to default, the render queue starves and backbuffer queue is very low (0-3/6) and I get a dropped frame about every 10 seconds. If I bump GPU/CPU queues up to 14, then render queue goes to a consistent 3-5, bb queue is still low, 1-3, but it doesn't drop frames.

HD6570 (1GB), not using 3dLUT, upscaling to 1920x1080

Last edited by noee; 16th November 2011 at 20:15.
noee is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16th November 2011, 20:14   #10982  |  Link
cyberbeing
Broadband Junkie
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 1,859
I'm still investigating to see if there are any benefits under heavy load. If my previous deinterlacing testing are any sign, there does seem to be a benefit in never having your CPU queue (including fluctuations) drop below the maximum GPU queue.

As for harm, I seem to be getting more delayed frames than usual in this build (see edit above), but that may be the same bug as Xaurus is experiencing? I'm getting the feeling that setting higher CPU queue causes an increased likelihood of delayed/dropped frames in combination with Flush&Wait settings because of increased CPU contention. It also seems like setting higher GPU queue occasionally causes an increased delay when seeking or resizing with 'Wait till render queues are full' setting is enabled or dropped/delayed frames when it's not enabled.

Last edited by cyberbeing; 16th November 2011 at 20:18.
cyberbeing is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16th November 2011, 20:42   #10983  |  Link
Hprd
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 60
Quote:
Originally Posted by madshi View Post
Interesting. So 512MB seems to be plenty. So: Do bigger CPU/GPU queue sizes help? Do they harm? Anyone any experience on this?
Having it auto adjust is pretty bad for glitches, having it set highly is too. 8/8 for both (same as b4) is about the same as b4 (obviously). Setting it to 4 (and limit render times/render in another thread set) for both though results in very few glitches at all. This is at 48/59 hz with 12 pre-presented frames. 16 pre-presented frames + limit rendering times and 8/8 for CPU/GPU (which is what i've used on previous versions of madvr) seems better on 24/29, as there seemed to be a dropped frame or two (probably the que being too low or something?) on the other settings that worked good for 48/59.

Last edited by Hprd; 16th November 2011 at 20:45.
Hprd is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16th November 2011, 21:20   #10984  |  Link
Thunderbolt8
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 2,197
Quote:
Originally Posted by madshi View Post
That is really weird. Does the black level change everytime you turn deinterlacing on/off via Ctrl+Alt+Shift+D? Does it help if you turn on the "Dynamic Range" option in the GPU "advanced video" options and set it to 16-235?
its weired, but atm it doesnt do it anymore. dont ask me why (theres only a slight shift of brightness with a coloured movie (which is also present in windowed mode), but I presume that is supposed to be normal, because its not as strong as before and in case of a b&w movie, theres no shift of colour at all any more)

at least that shift used to be there in fullscreen exclusive mode. Ill report back in case it should come back :S

(I can only choose to activate or deactivate dynamic range btw., not set anything like 16-235)


Quote:
Originally Posted by madshi View Post
I'm not sure if it's a good idea to process video in ffdshow/aviSynth, if you want to use DXVA2 deinterlacing, because usually you should deinterlace *first* and process afterwards. Sharpening should ideally be performed after deinterlacing + upscaling.
but how can I know the order in which of these are performed?
in ffdshow, I can at least tell to use TFM() first via avisynth before sharpening, because I can set the order of being processed for these two. but where in this chain comes madvr scaling and dxva2 deinterlacing into play? and how could I change that order if I needed to?
__________________
Laptop Lenovo Legion 5 17IMH05: i5-10300H, 16 GB Ram, NVIDIA GTX 1650 Ti (+ Intel UHD 630), Windows 10 x64, madVR (x64), MPC-HC (x64), LAV Filter (x64), XySubfilter (x64) (K-lite codec pack)

Last edited by Thunderbolt8; 16th November 2011 at 22:22.
Thunderbolt8 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16th November 2011, 22:13   #10985  |  Link
jmone
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 652
FYI - Nice update. IMO madVR does a higher quality job of deinterlacing than YADIF.
jmone is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16th November 2011, 22:25   #10986  |  Link
jmone
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 652
Quote:
Originally Posted by noee View Post
In windowed mode, with SD interlaced video material, if I leave queues to default, the render queue starves and backbuffer queue is very low (0-3/6) and I get a dropped frame about every 10 seconds. If I bump GPU/CPU queues up to 14, then render queue goes to a consistent 3-5, bb queue is still low, 1-3, but it doesn't drop frames.

HD6570 (1GB), not using 3dLUT, upscaling to 1920x1080
I was seeing this as well on my nvidia cards, it seemed that the effort to decode, scale, and deinterlace was impacted keeping the queues full than with progressive HD Material (eg I see this with 1080/50i as well). Likewise I found pushing the new GPU/QPU queues up to max prevented the BB Queue to hitting 0 and hence dropping frames. I still see queues jump around alot, eg on their 1080/50i h264 (TV Series on Blu rip):
Decoder queue: 22-14/24 (stable, never moves)
Upload queue: 16-18/24 (can move around abit especially after a window resize etc)
Deinterlace queue: always moving values between say 9-13 and 10-14/24
Render queue: always moving values between say 8-11 and 10-13/24
Backbuffer queue: 7-8/8 (stable, never moves)

The increase in CPU/GPU settings seems to give enough buffer to handle the changes in the intermediate queues and keep the Backbuffer Queue Stable.

EDIT: YMMV, but on my system, just raising the GPU Queue Size from 8 to 12 was all that was needed and seems a good balance between stability and GPU Mem usage (709/1024). At this setting all queues as stable as well.

Last edited by jmone; 16th November 2011 at 22:30.
jmone is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16th November 2011, 22:45   #10987  |  Link
Gser
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 418
Quote:
Originally Posted by madshi View Post
Can you please post screenshots that show this difference? Ideally also a small video sample? Thanks!
Feel free to use any MPEG2 file you have. HD preferably. You could decode the file to a lossless format using DSS2 with Dscaler's and LAV's decoder and then use Subtract to emphasize the differences.

Last edited by Gser; 16th November 2011 at 22:47.
Gser is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16th November 2011, 23:10   #10988  |  Link
madshi
Registered Developer
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 9,140
Quote:
Originally Posted by Thunderbolt8 View Post
its weired, but atm it doesnt do it anymore. dont ask me why (theres only a slight shift of brightness with a coloured movie (which is also present in windowed mode), but I presume that is supposed to be normal, because its not as strong as before and in case of a b&w movie, theres no shift of colour at all any more)

at least that shift used to be there in fullscreen exclusive mode. Ill report back in case it should come back :S

(I can only choose to activate or deactivate dynamic range btw., not set anything like 16-235)
Please don't confuse "dynamic range" with "dynamic contrast". Two very different things. Dynamic contrast should be turned off. Do you still get visible differences between deinterlacing on/off? That's not really supposed to happen. Can you post screenshots?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gser View Post
Feel free to use any MPEG2 file you have. HD preferably. You could decode the file to a lossless format using DSS2 with Dscaler's and LAV's decoder and then use Subtract to emphasize the differences.
So basically you're saying you're not willing to do a screenshot comparison for me?
madshi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16th November 2011, 23:18   #10989  |  Link
pacemaker1000
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 90
2.7 dual core cpu and current ati 4650 and i can run MadVR for everything other than 1080 stuff
will a new nvidia card enable me to do 1080 if i enable Cuvid?

should have tried it when i had it i know but i sent it back as i got a lot of dropped frames compared to ATI. but that was before renethx pointed out that reclock wroks better with MadVR when Vsync is disabled...doh
pacemaker1000 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16th November 2011, 23:30   #10990  |  Link
SoBizarre
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 15
Hi,

I was wondering if there is way around a little problem I'm having. Actually it's more of an annoyance than a real problem, but it drives me mad nonetheless.
Every time I start a player, the first file I'm playing gives me correct screen refresh rate (usually ~48Hz, but incorrect composition rate (60 and sometimes 30Hz).




It's ALWAYS like that, but reopening the same file ALWAYS gives me matching rate.



From what I understand, exclusive mode and disabling Aero would solve the problem, but unfortunately that does not suit me (disabling and re-enabling Aero messes with some of my open programs).
So, am I stuck with opening files two times in order to watch, or is there something else that can be done?

Actually, there is one more annoyance. When in fullscreen, clicking on "minimize" will crash the player.



But I've learn to live with this one, so it's not a big deal...
EDIT:
I found out elsewhere solution to the last one. Check:
Preferences->General->Fixed window position when minimize


My setup:
Win 7 x64
nVidia 420M
Daum PotPlayer, Haali Media Spliter, CoreAVC, LAV Filters, ffdshow raw video filter, ReClock, madVR - all 32-bit.
madVR is handling the switching to custom resolutions 48/50Hz.

Cheers,
SB

Last edited by SoBizarre; 18th November 2011 at 19:52.
SoBizarre is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16th November 2011, 23:41   #10991  |  Link
joe42
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 25
Quote:
Originally Posted by madshi View Post
The libav VC-1 decoder currently does not support interlaced decoding. However, the Intel software decoder (also supported by madVR) does. So switch to the Intel decoder and it will work. Or use the Microsoft decoder instead. In order to use the Intel decoder you'll need to download the Intel decoder DLL. See first page of this thread.
I installed the Intel decoder, and now the clip works fine with madVR doing the decoding.

I noticed that next to the VC-1 checkbox in madVR settings, I can choose either libav or Intel decoder. I actually still have it on libav, but the interlaced VC-1 clip still decodes properly.

Is madVR using libav for non-interlaced VC-1, and automatically choosing Intel decoder for interlaced VC-1?
joe42 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 17th November 2011, 00:12   #10992  |  Link
dansrfe
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 1,210
If I play a clip in exclusive mode on monitor 1 then everything is "frozen" on monitor 2. I'm guessing that is normal behavior but just wanted to confirm since if the reverse happens I can use monitor 1 like normal.
dansrfe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 17th November 2011, 00:17   #10993  |  Link
pankov
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Sofia, Bulgaria
Posts: 661
I have the same problem but I would not call it "frozen" but rather the application on monitor 2 can't get the focus.
I can move the windows around but they can't become the active application.
__________________
Z370M Pro4 | i3-8100 | 16GB RAM | 256GB SSD + 40TB NAS
NVIDIA GTX 1060 6GB (385.28) | LG OLED65B7V
Win 10 64bit 1803 + Zoom Player v14
pankov is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 17th November 2011, 00:38   #10994  |  Link
Gser
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 418
Quote:
Originally Posted by madshi View Post
So basically you're saying you're not willing to do a screenshot comparison for me?
It's rather late at night. I was hoping to get some sleep first.
Gser is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 17th November 2011, 00:42   #10995  |  Link
PhrostByte
Grand Fruitioner
 
PhrostByte's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Chicago, IL
Posts: 115
bug report: resuming from sleep, or switching between single-monitor and extended desktop modes (win+p in vista/7) causes madVR to become very choppy.
__________________
Lanczos4, Spline36, what!? Don't know how to pick a resizer? Take a look at my kernel visualizations.
Want a high-quality, gamma-aware resizer? Check out my ResampleHQ filter.
PhrostByte is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 17th November 2011, 02:15   #10996  |  Link
BatKnight
Registered User
 
BatKnight's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Portugal
Posts: 161
0.79 and MPC-HC refresh rate changer

I have a problem with madVR 0.79 that doesn't happen with 0.78.
As you probably know I use MPC-HC fullscreen refresh rate changer and it has always worked.

But with 0.79, when I play a 24fps movie my LCD starts as 60Hz, then I go fullscreen and the LCD changes to 24Hz but it shows the MPC seek bar kinda out of place, I hear the audio of the movie but no image. I pause and unpause, then I can see the movie, but 2 to 3 seconds later after the movie is already playing, the LCD changes back to 60Hz even though I didn't exit the fullscreen. It should stay at 24Hz.

I go back to 0.78 and all is fine as it has always been.

Did you change anything that could have broke the MPC-HC refresh rate changer?


PS: madVR's refresh rate changer works with 0.79 and mantains the 24HZ throughout the movie. I would like to use your changer, though, if it would allow me to change the rate, only when in going fullscreen.
__________________
Win 11 x64, Geforce RTX 4060 Ti 16GB, TV Sony KD-55X8509C HDMI, Denon AVR-X2700H, Core i7-9700K, 32GB DDR4, Creative Labs Gigaworks S750 7.1 speakers
MPC Home-Cinema
madVR
LAV Filters
BatKnight is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 17th November 2011, 04:22   #10997  |  Link
dansrfe
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 1,210
I absolutely LOVE DXVA2 deinterlacement vs. YADIF. It's like magic. I wish there was a way to deinterlace using DXVA2 in AviSynth.
dansrfe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 17th November 2011, 04:39   #10998  |  Link
mr.duck
quack quack
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 259
madVR + hardware deinterlacing with 50p output is glorious
__________________
Media Player Classic Home Cinema Icon Library: NORMAL VERSION / GLOWING VERSION
mr.duck is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 17th November 2011, 07:37   #10999  |  Link
ryrynz
Registered User
 
ryrynz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 3,646
Have dropped the CPU and GPU queues down to 4/4 and everything is running sweet.

Last edited by ryrynz; 17th November 2011 at 08:01.
ryrynz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 17th November 2011, 08:33   #11000  |  Link
nx6
Playing with MKV files...
 
nx6's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 278
Quote:
Originally Posted by madshi View Post
Hmmmm... Please create a log and uploaded it (zipped). Please try to keep it small. Which means: Start your media player, go to fullscreen mode, wait 10 seconds, close your media player. Done. Thx.
http://www.sendspace.com/file/w5r27b
__________________
Intel Core i7 920, 6 GB RAM | GeForce GTX670 | Win8.1 | LAV 0.64 / MadVR 0.87.10 | Zoom Player v10 / MPC-HC 1.7.8
nx6 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
direct compute, dithering, error diffusion, madvr, ngu, nnedi3, quality, renderer, scaling, uhd upscaling, upsampling

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 17:18.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.