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Old 15th February 2013, 15:03   #17481  |  Link
NicolasRobidoux
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Quote:
Originally Posted by madshi View Post
E.g. if I use less blur (= sharper image) with Jinc then comes at the cost of increased aliasing which takes away from the organic look of Jinc, IMHO.
I was not suggesting you change anything: Although a small voice in me says that a blur around .95-.96 may be better, it does seem like .97-.99 is the sweet spot for "naturalness", and that the value I suggested you use (the "plain vanilla LanczosSharp (de)blur) is a good match with AR. The fact that I don't state this in http://www.imagemagick.org/Usage/filter/nicolas/ gives you an idea of how small the voice is. (BTW, the recommended sigmoidal contrast values will go down in the next iteration of this document, to something stritcly between 6 and 7.5 for EWA LanczosSharp. But this does not concern you.)

Last edited by NicolasRobidoux; 15th February 2013 at 18:06.
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Old 15th February 2013, 19:50   #17482  |  Link
madshi
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Originally Posted by Nekomata View Post
new version? when
thx
When it's ready!

-------

Ok, normally I don't reply to such questions. But since the one and only major new feature of v0.86 is already half working, I'll make an exception this once: The next build might already come a day from now. But if I run into trouble, it could also take a week. I just don't know for sure yet.

Quote:
Originally Posted by NicolasRobidoux View Post
I was not suggesting you change anything: Although a small voice in me says that a blur around .95-.96 may be better, it does seem like .97-.99 is the sweet spot for "naturalness", and that the value I suggested you use (the "plain vanilla LanczosSharp (de)blur) is a good match with AR. The fact that I don't state this in http://www.imagemagick.org/Usage/filter/nicolas/ gives you an idea of how small the voice is. (BTW, the recommended sigmoidal contrast values will go down in the next iteration of this document, to something stritcly between 6 and 7.5 for EWA LanczosSharp. But this does not concern you.)
Ah I see, thanks. I'll stay with the current value for max "naturalness"...
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Old 15th February 2013, 21:13   #17483  |  Link
Dodgexander
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Skankee View Post
you can use this image:



Itīs easy to use, all lines are exact 1 pixel wide (You have to look at it verry close).
If not, the display can not show 4:4:4.

4:4:4
horizontal+vertical lines are 1 pixel wide

4:2:2
horizontal 1 pixel , vertical ~3 pixel wide (colors looks washed-out)

4:2:0
horizontal+vertical lines are ~3 pixel wide (colors looks washed-out)

My TV (from 2009) is per default 4:2:0, regardless im choosing YCbCr 4:2:2, YCbCr 4:4:4, or RGB 4:4:4 in my catalyst control center.
(when i use "custom resolution utility" and exclude extension block, it is 4:2:2)

I also noticed something strange.I store this image as: bmp, jpg(100quality, no subsampling) and png.

When i put this png-image into MPC HC (+madVR+LAV) on my RGB 4:4:4 -monitor, it is shown as an "4:2:2 like" image with 2 pixel wide vertical lines ( not washed-out).
The same with jpg-Images. But bmp-images are shown correctly 1 pixel wide.
It looks like there is some down-conversion with jpg and png, or do this only apply to me ?

( GPU: Radeon 4870, Win 7 pro 32bit, MPC HC 1.6.6.6391, madVR v0.85.8, LAV 0.55.1 PC-monitor: LG Flatron IPS 225 TV: LG 37 LH3000)
So because this image is .png we cannot use this to test?

What image can we use to test?

Edit, seems best way is to use the images listed here

Does anyone know about testing if your display supports YCbCr rather than RGB without conversion?

Last edited by Dodgexander; 15th February 2013 at 21:32.
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Old 15th February 2013, 21:42   #17484  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dodgexander View Post
So because this image is .png we cannot use this to test?

What image can we use to test?
It's because of the image's dimensions. This image should work. (just added a black border to make it 400x400)

Quote:
Originally Posted by NicolasRobidoux View Post
This is really interesting. Thank you.
No problem, I'm glad that you found it interesting. I should point out that even when displaying 4:2:2, many displays address their subpixels differently, so up-close images like that may look different depending on the panel type. And I'm sure that other displays probably downsample to 4:2:2 differently as well.
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Old 16th February 2013, 00:22   #17485  |  Link
turbojet
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Failed to connect to D3D device on an extended monitor, tried mpc-be and mpc-hc. EVR works fine, logs at http://www.sendspace.com/file/ke5wq8

Option to disable vsync was mentioned earlier, is this possible? Would it lower cpu/gpu usage when it's disabled as much as it does with EVR? When aero is enabled vsync doesn't help in evr, actually it drops some frames when it's enabled.
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Old 16th February 2013, 08:47   #17486  |  Link
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I think if you "disable VSync" in EVR that probably just means that EVR *itself* doesn't care about VSync, anymore, but leaves that stuff to Aero. But that's a really bad solution because it can introduce heavy motion judder in certain situations. Because of that I consider it a poor choice and there won't ever be a option like that in madVR.

For your D3D extended problem, if you think this is a bug in madVR, please create a bug entry in the madVR bug tracker. And please include details such as: Does the problem occur in fullscreen or windowed mode or in both? Does the problem only occur if you start playback on the primary monitor and then move the media player to the extended monitor? Or does it also occur if you move the media player to the secondary monitor before loading the video? Or does it occur with software or DXVA decoding or both? Or does it occur only with some decoders or with all? Details like this are very important.
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Old 16th February 2013, 10:45   #17487  |  Link
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Interesting, i checked the images you guys posted, and it seems this monitor displays 4:4:4, however Madvr reports 4:2:0 to 4:2:0 conversion in the stats. Why this inconsistency?
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Old 16th February 2013, 11:00   #17488  |  Link
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What madVR reports in the OSD is what the *decoder* is doing. madVR always produces dithered 8bit RGB 4:4:4 output.
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Old 16th February 2013, 13:39   #17489  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by madshi View Post
When it's ready!

-------

Ok, normally I don't reply to such questions. But since the one and only major new feature of v0.86 is already half working, I'll make an exception this once: The next build might already come a day from now. But if I run into trouble, it could also take a week. I just don't know for sure yet.
Iīm curious, is it going to work for 23.976fps and 24fps sources only or all sources that are not an exact multiple of the 60Hz (59.940Hz) composition rate? (e.x. 25fps, 50fps and 30fps). I am so anxious to try it out with all my samples.

EDIT: Hm, I think I found the answer, so only for 24fps? Thatīs a pity. Wouldnīt that mean that we absolutely need Reclock in this case to speed up 23.976fps to 24fps before madVR can fill in the gaps with the right frames?

Last edited by iSunrise; 16th February 2013 at 13:57.
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Old 16th February 2013, 14:00   #17490  |  Link
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You might be pleasently surprised.
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Old 16th February 2013, 18:06   #17491  |  Link
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Originally Posted by madshi View Post
What madVR reports in the OSD is what the *decoder* is doing. madVR always produces dithered 8bit RGB 4:4:4 output.
Right, thanks
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Old 16th February 2013, 19:44   #17492  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by madshi View Post
You might be pleasently surprised.
* J i g g l e s*
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Old 16th February 2013, 20:08   #17493  |  Link
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Originally Posted by Dodgexander View Post
So because this image is .png we cannot use this to test?

What image can we use to test?
The problem with png and jpg i mentioned in the last part of my post is about viewing this image in MPC HC+madVR.
That has no influence on the test itself when you look at the test image in your browser/in any other image viewer at 100% size (as it was intended).

Maybe that was a little bit confusing.
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Old 16th February 2013, 20:36   #17494  |  Link
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Old 16th February 2013, 23:20   #17495  |  Link
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According to him, it's on madshi's to-do list but other feature have more priority.
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Old 17th February 2013, 00:21   #17496  |  Link
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The D3D error was a windows update driver issue. Clean install of the latest nvidia drivers fixed it.

I trust your judgment on motion judder, I may just not notice it. The only reason for such an option would be maybe to allow IGP/budget gpu's to use a wider variety of resizers.
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Old 17th February 2013, 07:11   #17497  |  Link
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Once i drag the render window to the second monitor, madvr freezes on the last frame (the audio continues to play in the background). If i drag back the MPC to the primary monitor, the video continues to play. If i leave madvr on the second screen frozen for a while, MPC crashes down.

I'm on Win8 64bit (using 32bit player).

Any ideas why is this bug happening or how could i prevent it? It doesnt shows up on other renderers, they are working fine, only madvr is glitching in this case. I've tried several different madvr versions, i am on latest 0.85.8 now. Tried also a number of different MPC versions, its definitely a madvr bug, not a player issue.
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Old 17th February 2013, 10:35   #17498  |  Link
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Originally Posted by psishock View Post
Once i drag the render window to the second monitor, madvr freezes on the last frame (the audio continues to play in the background). If i drag back the MPC to the primary monitor, the video continues to play. If i leave madvr on the second screen frozen for a while, MPC crashes down.

I'm on Win8 64bit (using 32bit player).

Any ideas why is this bug happening or how could i prevent it? It doesnt shows up on other renderers, they are working fine, only madvr is glitching in this case. I've tried several different madvr versions, i am on latest 0.85.8 now. Tried also a number of different MPC versions, its definitely a madvr bug, not a player issue.
use the bug tracker: http://bugs.madshi.net/my_view_page.php

you are using dxva right? are the monitors at different grafikcards like first monitor is connect to the onboard and second one is connected with different one or something like that?
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Old 17th February 2013, 11:13   #17499  |  Link
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Originally Posted by huhn View Post
use the bug tracker: http://bugs.madshi.net/my_view_page.php

you are using dxva right? are the monitors at different grafikcards like first monitor is connect to the onboard and second one is connected with different one or something like that?
No, dxva(2) scaling is turned off (turning it on doesnt make any difference on the problem). Both of the monitors are hooked on the same card, nvidia670. The only difference that one is aligned vertically, while i kept the other one horizontally, so there is a resolution difference between two... i dont really think that should cause any trouble.

I dont have an onchip video card on my intel 3930k.

Anyway, i will file a bug on the tracker site for this issue, hope madshi can work this one out.
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Old 17th February 2013, 11:14   #17500  |  Link
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Rotated screens are not supported by madVR at this time.
Its on madshis list to support it, but not a high priority, iirc.
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