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30th April 2012, 07:20 | #1 | Link |
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WMV/VC-1 Encoder Development Progress Until Now
Hello everyone (& hi Mr. Alex Zambelli ),
-As we know, H.264 encoders (specifically x264) - and to some extent, VP8/WebM too (refer http://blog.webmproject.org/) are continuously being improved over time to make them better, more efficient and produce higher quality output files. Even XviD has (somewhat) continually minor improvement/bug fixes, with last official patch released last year (2011) . -The questions: 1. How about WMV/VC-1? Is there any improvement to WMV3/WMV9/VC-1 since WMP11/WMSDK11 (according to http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=112634 this is the latest)? 2. Do the encoder bundled with Windows Live Movie Maker 2011 is the latest/an improved version? 3. How about the encoders in Expression Encoder 1/2/3/4; do they gradually get an increase in the output quality/improve their encoding efficiency with each newer release? 4. Do Expression Encoder 4 uses the built-in encoder in Windows or the one bundled with .NET Framework 4 ? I can't seem to find the binary that do the encoding in its Program Files directory. EDIT: I found vc1ecore.dll with version 11.5.2568.7346 dated 04 November 2009 (in its security certificate) there, which I assume should be the encoder binary I'm looking for. 5. Any test has been done? Any change log? -Also, is there any (better) third-party encoder(s) aside those from Microsoft that I'm unaware of? Thanks & regards. Last edited by Musafir_86; 30th April 2012 at 11:25. |
30th April 2012, 14:51 | #4 | Link |
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^ To my eyes, there are no significant differences regarding quality, BUT there are significant differences regarding the encoding SPEED --- MCR 2 is somewhat faster.
Notice, I have used only Windows Media Encoder 9 + WMF 11 (through Zambelli's wmcmd.vbs) and TinTime's modified avs2asf, so I have nothing to say about Expression Encoder, except that it's overbloated for what it does, and still depends on the silly dotNET framework. |
30th April 2012, 15:12 | #5 | Link | |
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-Regarding Expression Encoder, I'm not sure too, that's why I asked here (I don't have resources to do thorough comparison). -And yes, I also dislike .NET platform for overheads it causes; beside Expression Encoder, Paint.NET is the other .NET app that useful for me. IMHO, a developer should prioritize his program's quality instead of taking easier path, by using C++ or such (or even assembly where it makes sense) instead of interpreted/managed code e.g. .NET or Java. I understand the argument of improved code security & reliability, but the same can be achieved without a managed platform, just need more effort, skills, and time (the same quality vs. speed argument as first paragraph). Regards. |
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30th April 2012, 15:30 | #6 | Link | ||
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EDIT: The FAQ thread you mentioned in the first post is outdated, because it doesn't say a word about Microsoft's VC-1 SDK: http://alexzambelli.com/blog/vc-1-sdk-faq/ Last edited by Midzuki; 30th April 2012 at 15:34. |
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30th April 2012, 16:17 | #7 | Link | |
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1st May 2012, 21:57 | #8 | Link |
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x264 in terms of quality and speed is alot better than vc1. stick to x264 and forget about the rest until x265
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2nd May 2012, 15:21 | #9 | Link | ||||
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vc1ecore.dll is compiled from the VC-1 Encoder SDK. There hasn't been any significant development of the VC-1 encoder at Microsoft (to the best of my knowledge) since 2009/2010, largely due to lack of demand and the ongoing change in industry priorities. Most companies, including Microsoft, are relying on H.264 for interoperability so continuing to invest money into VC-1 encoding for marginal enhancements just doesn't make a lot of sense fiscally. VC-1 decode speed advantage, which was important in the early days of HD, has lost its relevance with the advent of multi-core computing, DXVA and hardware decoders. VC-1 played an important role in the previous decade in advancing HD video adoption and forcing MPEG-LA to lower licensing fees for advanced codecs such as H.264 (competition always drives prices down). There's still a market for VC-1 encoder innovation out there, but I think that market is better suited for small companies at this point. I doubt Microsoft will ever release another singificant VC-1 encoder update. |
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2nd May 2012, 16:28 | #10 | Link | |||
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-Thanks for taking your time in answering my questions.
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Thanks again & regards. |
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10th May 2012, 01:50 | #11 | Link | ||
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Expression Encoder has the same VC-1 Encoder SDK lib on all platforms, so that's an easy way to 8-way threading and other improvements on XP and Vista. Plus you don't need to mess with registry keys to get access to advanced settings. Quote:
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26th March 2013, 21:33 | #13 | Link |
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Probably just bug fixes and (maybe) some perf optimizations, but I doubt any development work went into quality improvements or new features. Most team seems to be focused on H.264 encoder these days. http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/libr...(v=vs.85).aspx
Unless some other company decides to develop a better VC-1 encoder, I doubt we'll ever see a better VC-1 encoder than the Microsoft VC-1 encoder that shipped with Windows 7/8. Note: I no longer work at Microsoft either, so I'm merely speculating about the above. |
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development, encoder, expression, vc-1, wmv |
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