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Old 18th December 2004, 19:59   #141  |  Link
Digga
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hi there.

first of: nice gui Kurtnoise13

I have a suggestion for the LAME (MP3) setting tab.
presets like r3mix are hopeless outdated and should not be used anymore. there are newer and better presets available. so r3mix should be removed IMHO.
second, all stereo modes besides joint-stereo are not as good! (mono may come handy sometimes though). it would be a good idea to remove that section too.
Gabriel, an active member at the HydrogenAudio forums and a LAME developer had made a very simple but nice and recommended interface for the average user, available here: http://lame.sourceforge.net/lame_ui_example.html

please note: my intention is not to bitch around here, but to try to help make this nice gui maybe even better.

cheers,
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Old 18th December 2004, 22:26   #142  |  Link
Kurtnoise
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Yes...Gabriel Bouvigne himself has suggested me the same idea. ;-)

It's on my todo list.

Last edited by Kurtnoise; 19th December 2004 at 09:10.
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Old 19th December 2004, 02:37   #143  |  Link
Digga
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Quote:
Originally posted by Kurtnoise13
Yes...Gabriel Bouvigne himself suggests me the same idea. ;-)
It's on my todo list.
I see.
so this is another thing you could work on if you got too much free time
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Old 19th December 2004, 08:44   #144  |  Link
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Hi Kurtnoise,
I would like to set up a download mirror for this file but your link is dead

Edit:
mirror is online.
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Last edited by daphy; 20th December 2004 at 08:20.
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Old 19th December 2004, 09:04   #145  |  Link
Kurtnoise
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Sorry for the damage, but I don't know why...The board where I hosted the file is down at the moment. I sent you a mail to mirror the last build.
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Old 19th December 2004, 09:34   #146  |  Link
Kurtnoise
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http://www.videohelp.com/tools?tool=BeLight :: A link mirror.
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Old 19th December 2004, 15:19   #147  |  Link
Happygolucky
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Quote:
Originally posted by Kurtnoise13
http://www.videohelp.com/tools?tool=BeLight :: A link mirror.
Unfortunately, their mirror link (to free-codecs.com download site) is dead, too. Their main link points back to here on doom9.org, so no way to download the util using that site. I was able to download the .20 Final from daphy's link.
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Old 20th December 2004, 01:05   #148  |  Link
Kurtnoise
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Just for info, the link from the french board is again available.


BTW, the new mp3 tab is almost finished... Stay tuned.
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Old 22nd December 2004, 13:48   #149  |  Link
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bugs in v0.20 final

Wanted to do a personal listening test of AAC and wanted to compare different encoding/profile settings.

Then I found out that BeLight stopped changing command line display according to manual changes made to the output file field after the second file!

Also if PNS is enabled for output the file won't play in winamp 5, but no problems with direct show players such as bsplayer (CoreAAC installed).

It seems that the latter hasn't been documented anywhere else, which suprises me...

As far as I understood PNS reduces filesize by replacing different noise occurences with the same pattern.
So, I really wanna use that feature...
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Old 22nd December 2004, 14:57   #150  |  Link
Kurtnoise
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Re: bugs in v0.20 final

Quote:
Originally posted by Bluedan
Then I found out that BeLight stopped changing command line display according to manual changes made to the output file field after the second file!
Yes you're right. It's my fault. It's fixed now.

Quote:
Originally posted by Bluedan
Also if PNS is enabled for output the file won't play in winamp 5, but no problems with direct show players such as bsplayer (CoreAAC installed).
Maybe your plugin is outdated...

Quote:
Originally posted by Bluedan
It seems that the latter hasn't been documented anywhere else, which suprises me...

As far as I understood PNS reduces filesize by replacing different noise occurences with the same pattern.
So, I really wanna use that feature...
Much more info about PNS here.
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Old 22nd December 2004, 23:45   #151  |  Link
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Hi Kurtnoise, many thanks for your program!

Small problem in current version: when I choose an .eq file to feed the shibatch equalizer the path is not within quotes, so the besweet exits at once if I start encoding. If I manually put the quotes around the path the problem is solved. One thing more (maybe related to this): if I choose an .eq file then at the next session BeLight asks at every move the location of that file.

Bye and thanks again.
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Old 23rd December 2004, 00:16   #152  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally posted by marcellus
Small problem in current version: when I choose an .eq file to feed the shibatch equalizer the path is not within quotes, so the besweet exits at once if I start encoding. If I manually put the quotes around the path the problem is solved. One thing more (maybe related to this): if I choose an .eq file then at the next session BeLight asks at every move the location of that file.
Ok...I'll fix it.
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Old 23rd December 2004, 00:38   #153  |  Link
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For the users who want to test new things. I've made 0.21 beta 1. But be carefull : it's only for testing. There are always some bugs which aren't resolved.

changelog :
- Added : mp3 tab completely revisited. Please read carefully explanations below.
- Now BeLight enables to ask you if you want overwrite the output file (if you have a file having the same name as your output) or not.
- Some bugs fix.

BTW, I hope to fix all bugs before Xmas.



So, some explanations about the new mp3 tab :

Some functions under BeSweetGUI are outdated. This is the case for MP3 part. We know all that BeSweet uses one of the best mp3 encoder more exactly LAME. But some people as Gabriel Bouvigne by example, one of the LAME developpers, has suggested me to involve the mp3 part to facilitate and enhance comprehension for users. That's why I follow his recommandations and some new things are appeared :



With the latest LAME releases (3.95.xx and sup), the developpers want to simplify as much as possible the using of this encoder. That's why, now we can have the choice between "Target Bitrate" and "Target Quality". This is the most important thing to know actually.
The "Target Bitrate" refers to ABR/CBR Mode. I hope everybody know what is it. So, as soon as you choose it, you can move the Bitrate slider to fix a target following your bitrate. The range is very large as you can see. By default, the bitrate is 128 kbps.
To access at CBR Mode, you must check the "Restrict Encoder to Constant Bitrate" case. In this way, you force LAME to have a constant bitrate. In other word, you can't change the bitrate. If you want to create some encode with this Mode, you must know the bitrate will be restrict to 128 kbps.

Now the second choice : "Target Quality". This Mode is equivalent to the famous VBR Mode. So, if you check this, you can choose a certain quality level (between 10 and 100). If you are used to transcode your files into Ogg Vorbis with the Q-Mode, you know it's the same idea. I think it's more easier to understand a level quality than to choose a bitrate level.
One important thing you must to know : more this quality level is low, worse the result final is. A good point could be to choose between 50-80. It's more safer. By default, it's a value of 80 which is taken. For people who know LAME command, this quality level corresponds to -V 2.
With this "Target Quality", we can have also the choice between the Fast Variable Bitrate Mode and the Standard Mode. By default, this is Standard Mode which is chosen. For information, this Mode refers to --vbr-old LAME command whereas Fast Mode is --vbr-new.

The last part concerns the possibility to active the Mono Encoding. The "Other Settings" is available but *only* for advanced users. In the most cases, the best for you is to play with "Target Bitrate" or "Target Quality".

Due to the fact BeSweet doesn't recognize some single LAME commands, I was forced to use some old arguments.That's why I put here a table to have some equivalences. I hope this help you.


Quality = 10 | -V 9 | 64 kbps |
Quality = 20 | -V 8 | 80 kbps |
Quality = 30 | -V 7 | 96 kbps |
Quality = 40 | -V 6 | 112 kbps |
Quality = 50 | -V 5 | 128 kbps |
Quality = 60 | -V 4 | 166 kbps | --(alt)-preset medium
Quality = 70 | -V 3 | 176 kbps |
Quality = 80 | -V 2 | 192 kbps | --(alt)-preset standard
Quality = 90 | -V 1 | 224 kbps |
Quality = 100 | -V 0 | 256 kbps | --(alt)-preset extreme

If people or LAME developpers want to add something, don't hesitate.
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Old 23rd December 2004, 09:37   #154  |  Link
Gabriel_Bouvigne
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Quote:
To access at CBR Mode, you must check the "Restrict Encoder to Constant Bitrate" case. In this way, you force LAME to have a constant bitrate. In other word, you can't change the bitrate. If you want to create some encode with this Mode, you must know the bitrate will be restrict to 128 kbps.
Why restricting to 128kbps?
My idea was to restrict it on allowable cbr bitrates, but still allow all of them.
On the user interface, this would translate to only beeing able to set the bitrate slider on the vertical marks locations when using cbr.
This means that ideally you should have one vertical mark per allowed cbr bitrate. Here, that would mean changing "176" to "192".

I would also try to stretch the bitrate slider differently, in order to have the distances beeing roughly translatable to bitrate differences: distance between 64 and 128 would be equal to the one between 128 and 192.

(I understand that those two points might be not so easy to implement in a real UI).

Last thing, I think that perhaps there could be some additionnal information on both side as sliders; "smaller files" and "higher quality"
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Old 23rd December 2004, 09:58   #155  |  Link
Gabriel_Bouvigne
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I tryed the gui, and have additionnal comments:

*The bitrate slider moving along with the vbr one is an interesting idea. I originally only though of aligning the slider bars, not moving the slider itself.

*In abr, it would be nice to have the slider beeing free to move anywhere on the scale, not only on vertical marks.

*having a 160 mark instead of the 166 and 176 ones would perhaps be nice.

Now, the "other settings" box:

*"experimental psy tunings" can be removed, as this was previously enabling --nspsytune, which is now enabled by default.

*references to Gpsycho could be renamed to "psychoacoustic model" or "psy model" or "model", as Gpsycho is not the default model anymore.

*of course I do not like seeing those options. To me the only ones that should be kept would be the lowpass and sampling freq ones. Bit-swapping could be interesting only if you are using stdin or raw files as input. If you are using wav files as input, this option is useless.
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Old 23rd December 2004, 10:44   #156  |  Link
Kurtnoise
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Hi Gabriel,

Quote:
Originally posted by Gabriel_Bouvigne
Why restricting to 128kbps?
My idea was to restrict it on allowable cbr bitrates, but still allow all of them.
Yeah I thought the same thing but when I tested --abr xxx --cbr command under Lame 3.96.1, I noticed the bitrate was still at 128 kbps. That's why I fixed it on 128 kbps. But I can change it easily.

Quote:
Originally posted by Gabriel_Bouvigne
I would also try to stretch the bitrate slider differently, in order to have the distances beeing roughly translatable to bitrate differences: distance between 64 and 128 would be equal to the one between 128 and 192.
I can try but it's not easy..

Quote:
Originally posted by Gabriel_Bouvigne
Last thing, I think that perhaps there could be some additionnal information on both side as sliders; "smaller files" and "higher quality"
mmmh, ok.
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Old 23rd December 2004, 10:50   #157  |  Link
Kurtnoise
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Quote:
Originally posted by Gabriel_Bouvigne
*The bitrate slider moving along with the vbr one is an interesting idea. I originally only though of aligning the slider bars, not moving the slider itself.


Quote:
Originally posted by Gabriel_Bouvigne
*In abr, it would be nice to have the slider beeing free to move anywhere on the scale, not only on vertical marks.
Ok...I can try to implement that.

Quote:
Originally posted by Gabriel_Bouvigne
*having a 160 mark instead of the 166 and 176 ones would perhaps be nice.
aah, yes.

Quote:
Originally posted by Gabriel_Bouvigne
*"experimental psy tunings" can be removed, as this was previously enabling --nspsytune, which is now enabled by default.
Well...ok I can removed it.

Quote:
Originally posted by Gabriel_Bouvigne
*references to Gpsycho could be renamed to "psychoacoustic model" or "psy model" or "model", as Gpsycho is not the default model anymore.
ok..thanks to point me out.

Quote:
Originally posted by Gabriel_Bouvigne
*of course I do not like seeing those options. To me the only ones that should be kept would be the lowpass and sampling freq ones. Bit-swapping could be interesting only if you are using stdin or raw files as input. If you are using wav files as input, this option is useless.
Yes, me too...but on some sources ATH could be interesting. But I said these "other settings" it's only for advanced users.
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Old 23rd December 2004, 11:10   #158  |  Link
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Quote:
Yeah I thought the same thing but when I tested --abr xxx --cbr command under Lame 3.96.1, I noticed the bitrate was still at 128 kbps.
Yes, I just tryed, same result. This is indeed a bug
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Old 23rd December 2004, 17:36   #159  |  Link
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Another suggestion:
Everyone who uses Lame efficiently nowadays is using one of the presets. I know presets probably will disappear in Lame 4.0, so introducing the quality slider right now is a good idea.

However, people are not used to it. That’s why I’d love an additional label saying »equals preset standard« etc. when the slider is moved to a »preset position«.

I’m sure this could prevent a lot of confusion.
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Old 23rd December 2004, 18:53   #160  |  Link
Kurtnoise
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Quote:
Originally posted by Brother John
Another suggestion:
Everyone who uses Lame efficiently nowadays is using one of the presets. I know presets probably will disappear in Lame 4.0, so introducing the quality slider right now is a good idea.

However, people are not used to it. That’s why I’d love an additional label saying »equals preset standard« etc. when the slider is moved to a »preset position«.

I’m sure this could prevent a lot of confusion.
Of course I can... A label or a hint ??

Maybe into a label will overload the tab. Into a hint seems to be a good thing. What do you think ??

Last edited by Kurtnoise; 23rd December 2004 at 18:57.
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