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Old 10th September 2017, 21:57   #45501  |  Link
70MM
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I am using ordered dither on madvr...
Ive just noticed that dither is set to Auto on my Lumagen Pro, should it be turned off?
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Old 10th September 2017, 22:25   #45502  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 70MM View Post
I am using ordered dither on madvr...
Ive just noticed that dither is set to Auto on my Lumagen Pro, should it be turned off?
No ... why you think it should be turned off?
Not sure what this setting does but if its needed for internal Lumagen processing turning it off is wrong for sure.
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Old 10th September 2017, 22:41   #45503  |  Link
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I just thought maybe it was wrong to be using dithering twice, once in madvr and a second time in the Lumagen...
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Old 11th September 2017, 03:50   #45504  |  Link
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No, anytime processing is done in a higher bit depth dithering should be used when converting (back) to the output bit depth.

It would be better to avoid the second processing step if possible, the Lumagen will mess up madVR's dithering (causing some loss in precision), but it is still better to dither after processing than not. Not dithering simply rounds (or clips!) after processing, which results in the loss of even more precision and madVR's dithering is still damaged because it is the processing itself that damaged it.

Two rights do not make a wrong.
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Old 11th September 2017, 04:04   #45505  |  Link
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Thank you for that information Asmodian. I too thought it would be wrong to have the dithering set to ON in the Lumagen and also be doing it in madvr. Ive been running it "ON" in the Lumagen for all this time and never knew until yesterday when i opened that menu. I turned it off, then today the other guy here said I should have it on, so it went back on....easy to get trapped In here at times...

So I will leave dithering set to OFF in the Lumagen and just use dithering in madvr only, correct?
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Old 11th September 2017, 04:11   #45506  |  Link
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no you leave it on.

the lumagan it self is questionable if you want the madVR image untouched.
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Old 11th September 2017, 04:42   #45507  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 70MM View Post
So I will leave dithering set to OFF in the Lumagen and just use dithering in madvr only, correct?
Ack! What in my statement made you think that?

I messed up badly if that is what you came away with. Sorry.
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Old 11th September 2017, 05:26   #45508  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Asmodian View Post
It would be better to avoid the second processing step if possible, the Lumagen will mess up madVR's dithering
An opening with a line like that did the recommendation no favors
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Old 11th September 2017, 05:35   #45509  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Asmodian View Post
Ack! What in my statement made you think that?

I messed up badly if that is what you came away with. Sorry.
I read this...
It would be better to avoid the second processing step if possible, the Lumagen will mess up madVR's dithering (causing some loss in precision)

I will turn the dithering ON again in the Lumagen in conjunction with madvrs dithering, also ON.
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Old 11th September 2017, 08:39   #45510  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 70MM View Post
I read this...
It would be better to avoid the second processing step if possible, the Lumagen will mess up madVR's dithering (causing some loss in precision)
What he really meant is to get rid of the Lumagen entirely.

If you do any processing, it should apply dithering in the end. But still better to not process at all, then you also don't need any dithering.
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Old 11th September 2017, 09:46   #45511  |  Link
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Well I wont be getting rid of the Lumagen at all. His post didnt look like remove the Lumagen Pro to me.... Oh well case closed!
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Old 11th September 2017, 11:10   #45512  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Siso View Post
Code:
00 ff ff ff ff ff ff 00 10 ac 8b 40 00 00 00 00
2e 16 01 04 a5 43 1c 78 3e ee 95 a3 54 4c 99 26
0f 50 54 25 4b 00 81 00 b3 00 71 4f 81 80 d1 c0
01 01 01 01 01 01 7e 48 00 e0 a0 38 1f 40 40 40
3a 00 80 0e 21 00 00 1a 74 55 00 a0 a0 38 25 40
30 20 3a 00 80 0e 21 00 00 1a 00 00 00 fc 00 44
45 4c 4c 20 55 32 39 31 33 57 4d 0a 00 00 00 10
00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 02 ce

02 03 1d 40 50 90 05 04 03 02 07 16 01 06 11 12
15 13 14 1f 20 23 09 1f 07 83 01 00 00 02 3a 80
18 71 38 2d 40 58 2c 25 00 e0 0e 11 00 00 1e 01
1d 80 18 71 1c 16 20 58 2c 25 00 e0 87 10 00 00
9e 01 1d 00 72 51 d0 1e 20 6e 28 55 00 40 b4 10
00 00 1e 8c 0a d0 8a 20 e0 2d 10 10 3e 96 00 b4
78 00 00 00 18 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00
00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 e0
FWIW, I've analyzed this EDID and it very clearly claims that your display's native resolution is 1920x1080. It also lists 2560x1080 as a supported mode, but the "native" resolution is marked as 1920x1080. So it seems the EDID is faulty.

Quote:
Originally Posted by leandronb View Post
Hi guys. I was wondering which option is better, using TV at 60hz and smooth motion on, or make it go to 23/24hz with smooth motion off?
I kinda like smooth motion on because there is no flashing on screen because there is no refresh rate change.
Also I really don't know if my tv can actually handle 24p content, is a Samsung Eh6030, maybe 120hz because of 3D and accept various refresh rates.
My brother's TV can change to 24hz too but is not a 120hz tv so I think is a waste making it change to 24hz everytime.
So what do you guys think about this?
Native 23Hz/24Hz should provide better quality, but only if your TV is able to properly handle it. Not all TVs that accept 23Hz/24Hz input handle it properly.

So there are 2 questions to answer:

1) Does your TV handle 23hz/24hz properly? Only your eyes can judge that. Use a video with smooth camera pans to find out.
2) If your TV can't handle 23hz/24hz then there's no question and smooth motion is your best option. Otherwise it's your personal judgement whether smooth motion is an acceptable compromise or not. We can't really decide that for you.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SamuriHL View Post
HEYYYY there we go! I got it to freeze again and maybe this'll shed a little light on the subject. Can someone with a 1060 try this and see what they get for results? With D3D11 Native mode enabled, watch a 3D movie for a couple minutes. Stop playback and then try to watch a 2D movie. It's now frozen for me. The average and max stats do seem to be changing in the OSD, but, the queues are full and no video is playing. That's...weird right?

Ok, I think I got this one figured out finally. If I exit out of JRiver MC23, go to display properties and toggle 3d off, then back on, I'm able to play the 2D movie again. So I have a feeling something's not getting reset on playback of a 3D movie.
That sounds bad. So even just restarting MC23 doesn't help at all? You have to toggle 3D off -> on to make it work again? Sounds like a GPU driver bug to me. But why do you want to play a 2D movie with 3D mode toggled on? Have you tried letting madVR auto enable/disable 3D for you, depending on whether the movie is 2D or 3D?

Quote:
Originally Posted by mparade View Post
Active Decoder says: avcodec
madVR OSD says: P016, 16bit 4:2:0.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mparade View Post
It seems, even these days there is no GPU assisted decoding method for main12 HEVC sources. After reading the specs of my card I was pretty sure it could be done at least via CUVID or DXVA. I was wrong, or just not having enough info.
I don't know the limitations of the hardware decoders. That's something that you might want to discuss with nevcairiel in the LAV thread.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mogli View Post
I was playing around with the hdr to sdr conversion. Why is the default display's peak nits set to 400?
I read sdr content is usually intentionally limited to 100 nits for compatibililty with older devices. I understand that newer devices allow for more nits but that's not exactly sdr anymore. So when conversion to sdr is needed wouldn't 100 nits (less than madVR even allows to be set) be the most sensible default?
Well, if you want to simulate how a Blu-Ray looks then maybe choosing a value nearer to 100 nits might make more sense. However, today's flat panel TVs are exceedingly bright. So converting HDR to SDR with a nits target of 400 nits should actually produce better looking results overall. In the end, it's only a default value and you can override if you don't like it, of course.

The goal of my HDR -> SDR conversion is not to get as near to SDR Blu-Ray as possible, but to provide the best possible image quality.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Grimsdyke View Post
Hi Madshi, would it be possible to add something like a 'lock-buttom' for a custom mode once a perfect setting was found ? I am asking because last weekend I spent hours trying to find a setting for a refresh rate but with each new measurement it got worse, e.g. dropped frames down to minutes until I remembered that I had already found a p.s. for that frequency.
But unfortunately that remark was changed to 'optimization available' after playing another file not long enough or with interruptions or whatever ...
So after, say, a driver update it can get unlocked - tested - and locked again.
Makes sense, I'll think about it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dorohedoro View Post
Ok Madshi I got it!

I've deleted every custom resolutions and started from scratch, made the new custom mode (1080p23) on madvr again but this time I followed the Asmodian advice (letting madvr automatically change the resolution every time a new video is open) it worked!!
To be honest, I'm still not sure why it didn't work before. But I'm glad you got it working now.

Quote:
Originally Posted by StinDaWg View Post
I am getting a few random freezes/crashes with D3D11 DXVA.
Might be fixed in the next build. If not, please let me know.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cruzader View Post
@madshi, this is the Ctrl+J OSD when playing 3D MVC while the windows desktop resolution is on 4k

Hmmmm... The screenshot resolution is 1456x820, but the OSD seems to suggest that madVR thought the display mode was 3840x2160. What was the actual display mode? Was it 3840x2160 or 1920x1080? Can you create a debug log for this situation (please zip it, upload it somewhere else and then link to it here)?

Quote:
Originally Posted by digitech View Post
Sounds very interesting, this video explains it better:
http://web.cecs.pdx.edu/~fliu/project/adaconv/demo.mp4

Madshi is it possible to implement this interpolate method in MadVR?
Quote:
Originally Posted by ryrynz View Post
Holy crap that is amazing, absolutely add this to madVR at whatever cost for the paid version.
Quality looks really good, but speed is too slow. 0.9 seconds for one 1080p frame on a Titan X? That means we need a GPU that is about 21.5x faster than a Titan X to make this algo suitable for realtime playback of 1080p24 movies. Doing so would produce 1080p48, not even 1080p60. Ok, for 24fps SD content (720x480 DVD) we'd only need a GPU that is about 3.5x faster than the Titan X. So maybe 2 years from now this algo could be run in real time for NTSC DVDs (but only after IVTC!).

Maybe these algos could be dumbed down a bit. A certain quality hit would be quite acceptable if that would buy us a big speed improvement. However, we'd need at least a 50x speed improvement to make this viable for 1080p playback. For 3D playback we'd need a 100x speed improvement, for 4K 200x. And that's just for 24p -> 48p, we wouldn't even reach true 60p yet.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ForceX View Post
I got a new 100Hz G-Sync monitor connected to a GTX 1080 which I have configured to switch to 50,60,85 Hz. However, when it's playing a 60fps video in fullscreen (non-exclusive) on MPC-BE, the queues are all starved (https://i.imgur.com/fjUU2mR.jpg) and I get a couple drop/repeat frame each second. This doesn't happen in window mode or if there's an overlaying element like MPC-BE's seek bar or right-click menu is shown, but as soon as those are dismissed the queues are down again.

Any idea what's going on and how I can fix this?
For some reason the decoder queue seems to be struggling, too, which seems kinda weird if it runs smoothly in windowed mode. Also, rendering times seem very high, how are they in windowed mode?

Are you using the "device\display modes\hack Direct3D..." option in madVR? If so, does disabling that one help? Alternatively, you could also try to reduce the number of pre-presented frames and/or the size of the GPU queue, just in case you're running into VRAM trouble.

Quote:
Originally Posted by knightvision View Post
I used an older version and there i had always a TAB for HDR settings in MADVR. But now i donwloaded the newest madvr on your website and have activate it an deleted the older one.

But now i see no HDR Tab and options for HDR anymore.
How can this be?
That sounds pretty weird. The HDR tab should always be there! Can you make a screenshot?

Quote:
Originally Posted by dvd1 View Post
finally, now i have a 1050 TI 4gb. to have a picture with many dettegi on the 576i to 1050p What madVR filters should I use?
For 576i movie content try forced film mode. For image upscaling try NGU Anti-Alias High, or alternatively NGU Standard or Sharp High. For chroma you could try NGU Anti-Alias Medium, if your GPU is fast enough for that. For image upscaling is much more important.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Magik Mark View Post
Can somebody point me to the right link if this has been answered. I'm having problems searching this:

1. It seems I can't get madvr to generate optimized setting for custom mode. I have played numerous videos already

2. Sometimes I get Black Screen. Hitting pause then unpause so far solves this. is there a way to prevent this?
1. So madVR doesn't offer to optimize the modes? Did you create the custom modes in the madVR settings dialog? Or did you create them with the Nvidia/AMD/Intel custom mode tool?

2. Not enough information for me to say anything.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dorohedoro View Post
After some more attempts (a couple of days trying, what a nightmare..) I got one that worked this morning (85%), only 1 frame repeat after 6 hours, so I'm really happy right now because it was all luck, like hitting the jackpot lol. I'm going to treasure this values like gold.
Glad to hear that! Will have to do some more tests with my JVC X35, maybe I can figure out why JVC projectors seem to be picky with custom resolutions, and how I can maybe create more custom modes that the JVCs will like.

Quote:
Originally Posted by x7007 View Post
LAV Filters 0.70.2-74 Nightly 64-bit D3D11 is very good in performance, but there is big motion blur that I never had before...
Sounds weird. Are you sure that you compared the exact same video frame? Sometimes when there's motion, some video frames are very blurry already in the original video file. I'm not sure how D3D11 DXVA decoding could blur the video. Doesn't sound likely, from a technical point of view.

Quote:
Originally Posted by petran79 View Post
Whenever I set a profile group, MadVR crashes if I open a video file.
I sent a bug report here:
http://frd.li/695682d5f1f1b243cef85800862eb8f8
This will likely be fixed in the next build.

Is there a reason you prefer NNEDI3 for SD videos? I believe NGU Anti-Alias Very High should look better than NNEDI3-256 in most situations. Although if you look at only one video/image, there's always a chance that one algo might look better than another. The important thing is to test with various different videos.
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Old 11th September 2017, 11:28   #45513  |  Link
70MM
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As we all seem to use RGB with madvr, there is something I have been confused about...
Lumagen tells us that they process in 422 and to always use 422 out of the Lumagen regardless of what you input.
So I have always used RGB from madvr into the Lumagen Pro and output 422 from the Lumagen.

Yet I feel that RGB from madvr > Lumagen > RGB would be more correct.
Are there others here using a Lumagen and how do they feel about it, even though "they" always tell us we should use 422 out.
Thoughts please on the subject....
I think madshi commented about this once....

Last edited by 70MM; 11th September 2017 at 11:31.
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Old 11th September 2017, 11:38   #45514  |  Link
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Well, this is really a question you should ask Lumagen. *Why* are they recommending 422 over RGB output? If the reason is that they internally process everything in 422, then it may make sense. But I don't know the exact processing pipeline in the Lumagen. If you tell it to output RGB, how will it internally convert 422 to RGB? Maybe the Lumagen's 422 -> RGB conversion isn't optimal?

Generally, IMHO a high quality external video processor should be doing its internal processing in 12bit+, either in 444 or RGB. IMHO 422 as a processing format is disappointing. E.g. if you run your Xbox, PS3 or HTPC through the Lumagen, a 422 processing pipeline means that you automatically lose half the chroma resolution with every game, your browser, DSLR photos etc.
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Old 11th September 2017, 11:50   #45515  |  Link
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I think what lumagen says makes sense for video processing, because RGB 4:4:4 input is not "supported" by many displays (especially TV's).

Anyway this is not the personal support thread for @70MM and everything about Lumagen is really off topic here. Feel free to start a new thread and we can talk about it.
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Old 11th September 2017, 13:13   #45516  |  Link
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Originally Posted by madshi View Post
Hmmmm... The screenshot resolution is 1456x820, but the OSD seems to suggest that madVR thought the display mode was 3840x2160. What was the actual display mode? Was it 3840x2160 or 1920x1080? Can you create a debug log for this situation (please zip it, upload it somewhere else and then link to it here)?
The ss might have been auto resized by imgurl.
The actual display mode was 3840x2160. I've attached the log file here

http://s000.tinyupload.com/index.php...51262117668096
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Old 11th September 2017, 13:32   #45517  |  Link
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Originally Posted by Cruzader View Post
The ss might have been auto resized by imgurl.
The actual display mode was 3840x2160. I've attached the log file here

http://s000.tinyupload.com/index.php...51262117668096
Some interesting extracts from the log:

Code:
00000338.635 Render   needed framerate: 23
00000338.643 Render   current display mode, width: 3840, height: 2160, rate: 30, interlaced: -
00000338.646 Render   DisplayModeCount: 0
00000338.647 Render   IsStereoContent: +, IsStereoPresentation: +
00000338.648 Render   we're doing frame packed stereo presentation, so we use 1080p23 display mode
00000338.650 Render   matching display mode, width: 1920, height: 1080, rate: 23, interlaced: -
00000343.536 Render   started madHcCtrl helper process to restore display mode (3840x2160 30Hz) -> +
00000882.167 Render   ChangeDisplaySettingsEx() -> +
00000885.027 Render   resulting display mode, width: 1920, height: 1080, rate: 23, interlaced: -
[...]
00004790.218 Creator  WM_SIZE: 3840, 2160
00004790.223 Creator  CQueue::WindowSizeChanged(width: 3840, height: 2160);
00004790.486 Reset    Window: 00210504; WindowRect: 0, 0, 3840, 2160; ClientRect: 0, 0, 3840, 2160; ClassName: madVR
00004790.491 Reset    ParentWindow: 000D04CE; WindowRect: 0, 0, 1920, 1080; ClientRect: 0, 0, 1920, 1080; ClassName: Kodi
[...]
00004798.376 Render   display mode: 1920x1080, 23 Hz, progressive, 16
So it seems madVR switches the display mode to 1920x1080p23, because you're playing 3D content and most displays don't support 3D with a 2160p display mode. So far, so good. However, after the mode change, Kodi's main window has a size of 1920x1080, but madVR's rendering window has a size of 3840x2160. So basically only the top left quarter of the madVR rendering window is actually visible.

It's Kodi's responsibility to resize the madVR rendering window properly. So it seems to be a Kodi bug to me.
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Old 11th September 2017, 14:29   #45518  |  Link
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Originally Posted by madshi View Post
That sounds bad. So even just restarting MC23 doesn't help at all? You have to toggle 3D off -> on to make it work again? Sounds like a GPU driver bug to me. But why do you want to play a 2D movie with 3D mode toggled on? Have you tried letting madVR auto enable/disable 3D for you, depending on whether the movie is 2D or 3D?
Restarting MC23 did not help, no. I do have that option set in madVR, however, I think I went the opposite way with it. Meaning turning off 3D when playing a 2D movie. I'll try it with that setting turned off in windows and see if it makes any difference. I'll play around with it more and see if I can give you more info.
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Old 11th September 2017, 15:58   #45519  |  Link
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madshi, you were right. Turning off 3d in the display properties solves the issue. I can play 3D and 2D MKV's no problem and switch between them without issue. This problem only happens when the 3D option in Windows display properties is turned on. Thanks!
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Old 11th September 2017, 17:40   #45520  |  Link
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Hi guys, i'm getting slight pauses in playback that last for approx 1-2 seconds, it happens once every few minutes.

Madvr 0.91.11 , Jriver Media Player 21, Windows 10, 1080ti - 385.41

This has only started to happen recently but I can't put my finger on whats causing it.

I'm using a 3dlut for calibration.


Last edited by fluidz; 11th September 2017 at 17:45.
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