madVR - high quality video renderer (GPU assisted)

[huhn]

here are my first observations from chroma reconstruction.

judged on a screen that isn't subsampling.

soft is working great so far.
but sharp and placebo have some problems.
they boost colors in this case red:

soft: http://abload.de/img/softreconstructbxxsw.png
sharp: http://abload.de/img/sharpreconstruct22x5d.png
placebo: http://abload.de/img/plareconstruct6bucz.png
bilinear: http://abload.de/img/bilineararreconstruct4nubb.png

sharp and placebo are ringing even with AR and placebo is ringing more than sharp i don't see a real difference in ringing with AR or without:

placebo AR: http://abload.de/img/plaarreconstructtgurb.png
sharp AR: http://abload.de/img/sharparreconstruct3au35.png

there are other issues to like the E in RED and again soft is working great there.
performence:
soft isn't taking a lot of performance about the same as nnedi3 16.

my r9 270 can barely do sharp and can't do placebo for a 1080p23 source at 1080p which is pretty heavy...

edit:
found the first major issue with soft:
here are some screens. the issue is most obvious at the D.

soft: http://abload.de/img/softrdgtmswp.png
bilinear: http://abload.de/img/bilinearrdg24sfi.png
bilateral:http://abload.de/img/bilateralrdgf9sca.png
sharp: http://abload.de/img/sharprdgyes45.png
sharp AR: http://abload.de/img/sharparrdgn4ssg.png

[MistahBonzai]

To those running the v0.90 update with MPC-HC x64. Please check that the MadVR refinement settings (like sharpen and such) appear on the screen upon selection. Mine only display their effects after selecting OK and continuing with the video. Upon rechecking I see that this glitch also occurs in my MadVR x86. It seems to be connected to the v0.90 upgrade - at least this is when it first occured for me. MPC-BE/MadVR v0.90 works fine. If someone joins me here I'll provide specifics. As it is I'm running Win 7 64-bit/sp1, HD 7850 (15.7.1) and all the latest related plug-ins from the nightlies.

[Ver Greeneyes]

Originally Posted by madshi

It depends a whole lot on the sample you're testing with. In some samples Bilateral wins, in some Reconstruction "sharp" wins, in some NNEDI3 wins, in some Reconstruction "soft" wins. Both Bilateral and Reconstruction take the luma channel into account, while NNEDI3 does not. So if the luma channel is helpful for chroma upscaling, Bilateral and Reconstruction may beat NNEDI3, sometimes significantly. But the luma channel might be flat, or even detrimental. In the latter case Bilateral and Reconstruction "sharp" can produce bad artifacts, while Reconstruction "soft" usually at least manages to not make things worse compared to e.g. Jinc or super-xbr upsampling.

Of course it should be said that differences in chroma upscaling quality are often near to invisible. You need to pick specific scenes to really see a difference. E.g. red stuff on black background makes for a great test.

If you want to look at the luma and chroma planes separately, you can toggle between them by pressing Ctrl+Alt+Shift+F12 multiple times.

Thanks for the explanation. Man, that makes it hard to choose though :P I wish there was a way to augment NNEDI3 for chroma to be the best of both worlds - some sort of local structural similarity comparison between chroma and luma to see if bilateral/reconstruction will be effective *handwaves furiously*.

[ryrynz]

Originally Posted by Patrik G

the creator must be fucking drunk.
wtf are you doing ?
arnt you supposed to make the renderer better?
why go back to the 80s for graphics and 16 color system?

Thanks for the laugh Patrik. You should really just state your specs and settings though. Likely you'll find you could deselect one of the sharpeners and that might come right. Alternatively you could do a fresh install of your drivers.. The amount of times I've had issues after upgrading drivers makes me always start there first.. Reinstall and then try reverting and see if it persists!

Originally Posted by Warner306

I don't think madshi would appreciate being called drunk.

Well at least not while he's coding anyway..

Madshi, I think you might need to update your visual comparison graph for Reconstruction, all options for it are identical to Bilateral.

[chros]

Probably you remember that I had/have huge performance difference using D3D9 FSE Old Path on my laptop. I managed to screw up things in the last 2-3 weeks and it works only with 32bit player (luckily found out) and filters now but not with x64 chain!!!
So maybe this is the perfect occasion to figure it out what is going on since I can replicate both now.

What I did in the past 2-3 weeks (I wanted to try out 4:4:4 output on my system but I didn't manage to do it ):
- uninstalling/installing intel graphic driver and Management Engine as well (it responsible for HDMI handshake if I understand it correctly)
- upgrading nvidia driver to 361.xx
- updating players, filters
Now I tried to "revert" everything to the state that it was before., you can see it in my signature.

What I tried is using different versions of MPC-HC , madvr , lavfilters (external) but nothing helped.

I have created logs with madvr, but all I can see it in them that it using the igsimsum*.dll -s successfully. I checked them in:
- c:\windows\system32 and c:\windows\system32\NV
- c:\windows\wow*\ and c:\windows\wow*\NV (I forgot the full path for that)
but the correct version are there for both 32 and 64 bit.

So, how the heck can I debug it what's the bottleneck?

MadVR x32 and x64 logs (~ 20 sec playback): http://www1.zippyshare.com/v/YdKiA4Zc/file.html

This is the stat of nvidia inspector (GPU-Z provides the same results) http://www.imagebam.com/image/6c7fde458360826
Rows are from top to bottom: GPU usage, VPU usage, memory, GPU Clock, memory clock, sahders (zero all the time), GPU voltage. x64 chain is on the left and x32 is on the right.

Thanks

[Aleksoid1978]

3D in new version don't work for me. System in signature, Win10 Ent x64, try open test 3DMKV(MediaInfo show that video is Stereo High@L4.1 / High@L4.1) - only 2D. I use PowerDVD/Arcsoft Total Media for 3D BD - all perfect.
That a see - LAV Video Decoder don't accept MEDIASUBTYPE_MVC1 - only MEDIASUBTYPE_AVC1.

P.S. Run MPC-BE on LG 47LM620T desktop. I don't use 3D in Nvidia drivers.

[Shiandow]

Originally Posted by huhn

here are my first observations from chroma reconstruction.

judged on a screen that isn't subsampling.

soft is working great so far.
but sharp and placebo have some problems.
they boost colors in this case red:

Keep in mind that sub-sampling has a tendency to diminish colours, especially with small letters such as in that image. The sharp and placebo methods might be overcorrecting it a bit, but the soft method might not be strong enough.

[Manni]

Originally Posted by Aleksoid1978

3D in new version don't work for me. System in signature, Win10 Ent x64, try open test 3DMKV(MediaInfo show that video is Stereo High@L4.1 / High@L4.1) - only 2D. I use PowerDVD/Arcsoft Total Media for 3D BD - all perfect.
That a see - LAV Video Decoder don't accept MEDIASUBTYPE_MVC1 - only MEDIASUBTYPE_AVC1.

P.S. Run MPC-BE on LG 47LM620T desktop. I don't use 3D in Nvidia drivers.

Exactly the same for me with AMD HD7870 and Catalyst 14.12, but I'm waiting for more info on the Intel dll name and location as an incomplete install of LAV might be the issue in my case.

[Nullack]

Hi Madshi. Thankyou for the new 0.9 version some really fantastic features there. I've done some testing on it. I can say for sure, my system Win 10 x64 with all the latest updates (thats threshold 2+ with win10 now being a service not a SP release method) and my GTX 960 2GB with my UHD display, Im still crashing MPC-BE with the tick box enabled for enable stereoscopic mode even when Im still in a 2D desktop but just have the tickbox enabled. Thats the same as before when I reported it in my old UHD madvr thread. The workaround is the same as what it was before too - users can simply disable that mode and all 2D content plays fine. Im on NVIDIAs latest prod drivers being revision 361.43. If I can provide any help with further diagnostic information just ask, thanks.

EDIT: Auto FSE in D11 results in MPC-BE crashes with 3d stereoscopic nvidia on. Auto FSE in D9 mode results in MPC-BE playing audio OK, but the video is all just a blank screen with 3d stereoscopic nvidia on.

[sheppaul]

Originally Posted by Manni

Exactly the same for me with AMD HD7870 and Catalyst 14.12, but I'm waiting for more info on the Intel dll name and location as an incomplete install of LAV might be the issue in my case.

It works well here with HD7850 and the latest Crimson driver. You need to install the nightly build of LAV filters to get the 3d MVC decoding libraries (libmfxsw32.dll, libmfxsw64.dll).

PS. Should use lav source + lav decoder + madVR combinations to get 3d MVC output.

[Manni]

Originally Posted by sheppaul

It works well here with HD7850 and the latest Crimson driver. You need to install the nightly build of LAV filters to get the 3d MVC decoding libraries (libmfxsw32.dll, libmfxsw64.dll).

PS. Should use lav source + lav decoder + madVR combinations to get 3d MVC output.

Yes, I have cleared this up with Nev in the LAV thread. I had all this installed as confirmed above, but with KCP, which doesn't allow a full install of the 3D libraries in LAV. I'm going to try to install everything separately tonight, and I'll report.

Good to know it works well on AMD.

[Aleksoid1978]

For see 3D BD movie on PowerDVD/Arcsoft Total Media i don't install 3D Vision from Nvidia drivers - and 3D working. But not working with latest LAV Source + Video Decode + madVR. What's wrong, maybe some logs or debug info help ??
Or it's requires install 3d Vision from Nvidia ??

[madshi]

@Aleksoid1978, please see the bottom of this post for 3D requirements:

http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.ph...82#post1752682

Do you have 3D enabled in madVR? If so, what does LAV say what the "active decoder" is in the LAV settings page, while playing such a 3D MKV file? (3D Vision should not be required.)

[Sunset1982]

What are the keyboard shortcuts for madvr's 3dlut splittscreen?

Is there an overview for all madvr keyboard shortcuts?

[MokrySedeS]

madshi, I think there's a deinterlacing regression in the latest version.

http://i.imgur.com/ePy3ry0.png

Here's a sample: http://www39.zippyshare.com/v/x6jBv8gv/file.html
It's an interlaced ProRes file.
With 0.89.19 I get lots of repeated frames but at least it looks ok.

[Aleksoid1978]

Originally Posted by madshi

@Aleksoid1978, please see the bottom of this post for 3D requirements:

http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.ph...82#post1752682

Do you have 3D enabled in madVR? If so, what does LAV say what the "active decoder" is in the LAV settings page, while playing such a 3D MKV file? (3D Vision should not be required.)

Yes - 3d enabled in madVR. Problem that LAV Video Decoder don't accept MEDIASUBTYPE_MVC1 from LAV Source, but accept standart MEDIASUBTYPE_AVC1 and play as normal H264 stream.

[nevcairiel]

Originally Posted by Aleksoid1978

Yes - 3d enabled in madVR. Problem that LAV Video Decoder don't accept MEDIASUBTYPE_MVC1 from LAV Source, but accept standart MEDIASUBTYPE_AVC1 and play as normal H264 stream.

Make sure the Intel DLL is present then, and LAV was re-installed to accept the new type.
If you use it as an external filter in MPC-HC/BE, you may need to refresh its type list in there as well.

[RainyDog]

Originally Posted by madshi

So short summary: You sound like you hate all of those algos?

FWIW, I've noticed myself that "sharpen edges" might be slightly too dark. It will be ever so slightly brighter in the next build. However, I'm not sure if anything will change for artificial test patterns. Due to the way "sharpen edges" works internally, it might not look too great on such test patterns.

I do like artificial test patterns to get an idea of what an algorithm does exactly. But final judgement of an algo's quality should be made with real life content. After all, if you sit down at an evening to use madVR for your entertainment, you're going to watch movies and not look at test patterns. That said, a good test can be movies with hard coded subtitles. They make a good compromise between artificial test patterns and filmed content. They're usually very sharp, but still often have a bit of anti-aliasing in them, which makes them more suitable to sharpening tests than 1 pixel on/off patterns.

No, not at all I’m a big fan of HQ sharpening and actually use it all the time, not just to sharpen upscaling softening. These new sharpeners are my favourite addition to madVR in ages.

I prefer sharpening to have a noticeable, pronounced effect and personally think it can subjectively enhance good quality content tenfold. Currently really happy with the combination of Sharpen Edges at 1.4, Thin Edges at 0.6 and Enhance Detail at the default 1.0.

With the test pattern observations, was just pointing out how it lays bare each sharpeners flaws and what areas they generally target on the make up of an image. Agree that it’s not the best way to assess whether you like what they do or judge which one you prefer though. Always fall back on actual viewing content for deciding that and tweaking and tuning.

In fact, Image Enhancement and Upscaling Refinement shortcut toggles would be handy if you wouldn’t mind sometime please

[Aleksoid1978]

I do full reinstall LAV.
libmfxsw32.dll/libmfxsw64.dll is present.
In MPC-BE remove all LAV entries and add LAV Souce/LAV Video Decoder again. Don't help - don't accept MEDIASUBTYPE_MVC1(it's present in PinInfo but active is MEDIASUBTYPE_AVC1).

[Aleksoid1978]

nevcairiel
Maybe you do debug build for testing ??