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Old 5th June 2015, 18:43   #30761  |  Link
SecurityBunny
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Quote:
Originally Posted by madshi View Post
Great! Then please start with creating a debug log with 30 seconds of playback, using v0.88.11. Those 30 seconds should show how the queues are not filing. Please try to avoid switching back and forth between windowed <-> FSE all the time, to make the log easier to understand. Upload to e.g. tinyupload.com or similar site. Thanks!
I'm assuming I just run the 'activate debug mode' bat file to toggle debugging mode? Running it outputs;

Access is denied.
Access is denied.
Access is denied.
Access is denied.
activating debug mode failed

Running it as admin outputs;

file "madVR.ax" not found (Though it does exist in the folder!)

Anyways, manually renamed the debug .ax file to madVR64.ax to get the log. Ran a video for 30 seconds. It created a log file 110MB in size.

Debug log: https://www.dropbox.com/s/hi8yiom7xc...20log.txt?dl=0

D3D11 FSE, 10-bit, x64 player
Queues are set to the following.

CPU queue size: 24
GPU queue size: 20
frames in advance: 16

Queue fill rate was displaying as the following.

Decoder queue - 22-25/24
Upload queue - 17-20/20
Render queue - 1-5/20
Present queue - 1-8(9, bouncing around)/15

Let me know if you need me to export my madVR registry settings or test with more specific video conditions. (10 bit, 23.976 fps, etc.)

Last edited by SecurityBunny; 5th June 2015 at 18:48.
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Old 5th June 2015, 18:54   #30762  |  Link
Asmodian
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Anima123 View Post
When using SuperRes with Bicubic, for example, the SuperRes works directly on the targeted image size, right? While the image doubling algorithms might need to be downscaled or upscaled if the target size is not exactly 2x or 4x?

There's a lot of combinations to be tried and tested.
Even when using doubling SuperRes (all enhancements) only run once per ~2x or once (depending on the setting). e.g. SuperRes doesn't run immediately after doubling, it runs after scaling to the target resolution.

Though there is still a lot of testing to do, of course.

I have noticed I prefer SuperRes only on high quality and high resolution sources, FineSharp on high quality sources, and LumaSharpen otherwise.

Both SuperRes and FineSharp seem to enhance detail (artifacts) very well.

I need to do more testing but all my fine tuning (so far) needs to be thrown out when I switch sources, even when they the same resolution.
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Old 5th June 2015, 19:15   #30763  |  Link
madshi
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Quote:
Originally Posted by foozoor View Post
This is what I use to improve/enhance my videos with vapoursynth.
After a lot of experimentations, this is the best for me for almost any videos.
I think it will be possible with madvr.

This is my post processing chain:

1) Uscale with needi3 (1,5x or 2x).
2) Sharpen with FineSharp with low strength (0,8 to 1,5).
3) Rescale the video to its original resolution, I use spline64.
4) Debanding.
So basically you're "oversampling"? Meaning you upscale to a higher resolution than the source, then sharpen in the higher resolution, then downscale again? That's a lot of processing. Does the upscaling + downscaling really bring that much benefit?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Anima123 View Post
When using SuperRes with Bicubic, for example, the SuperRes works directly on the targeted image size, right? While the image doubling algorithms might need to be downscaled or upscaled if the target size is not exactly 2x or 4x?
When using SuperRes with Bicubic, still the upscaling is split into several doubling steps, before reaching the final resolution. It depends on the scaling factor, though. If the overall scaling factor is e.g. 4.1x, then with Bicubic the image is doubled to 2.0x, then scaled to 4.1x, and upscaling refinement is performend twice. With an overall scaling factor of e.g. 2.1x, scaling is only done once directly to the target resolution and upscaling refinement is only performed once.

The above applies only when "refine the image after every ~2x upscaling step" is activated, of course.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SecurityBunny View Post
I'm assuming I just run the 'activate debug mode' bat file to toggle debugging mode? Running it outputs;

Access is denied.
Access is denied.
Access is denied.
Access is denied.
activating debug mode failed
Probably the batch needs write access to the madVR folder for your normal non-admin user to work correctly, I suppose. Not sure why it doesn't work as admin, though. Anyway, doing the renaming manually works, too, of course.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SecurityBunny View Post
Argh, stupid me, my workaround didn't work properly. Does the following release mode test build work better? If not, try lowering the number of prepresented frames once again:

http://madshi.net/madVR8811test.zip

Quote:
Originally Posted by Asmodian View Post
SuperRes doesn't run immediately after doubling, it runs after scaling to the target resolution.
It always does run immediately after doubling, if I remember my own code correctly. Whether that's a good idea is another question. Probably in the last step I should only run it after scaling is complete, instead.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Asmodian View Post
I have noticed I prefer SuperRes only on high quality and high resolution sources, FineSharp on high quality sources, and LumaSharpen otherwise.

Both SuperRes and FineSharp seem to enhance detail (artifacts) very well.

I need to do more testing but all my fine tuning (so far) needs to be thrown out when I switch sources, even when they the same resolution.
Don't say that, it lowers my hope for finding a simple setting that works for every source...

No, of course do say that, I want to hear the truth, even if I don't like it...
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Old 5th June 2015, 19:16   #30764  |  Link
6233638
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Quote:
Originally Posted by madshi View Post
Was this a one-time-only problem, or does it happen every time? Does this only happen with madTPG, or also with your media player?
Every time with madTPG. Doesn't seem to have been an issue with video playback that I've seen.
It even happens without CalMAN being open. Double-clicking the madTPG window to exit full-screen mode results in a black screen and I have to hit Esc to close madTPG to get rid of it.
EDIT: Seems to intermittently work with this test build. Prior to that it would black out 100% of the time. Now it's more like 75% of the time.

Quote:
Originally Posted by madshi View Post
I think the ideal approach would be to run madTPG on your HTPC, and then to use a laptop to run CalMAN. If you have to run both on the same PC, then yes, maybe that's currently not as smooth an experience as it could be. It's not something I can fix on my own, though. Would have to work with Calman together on that.
That does seem like it would be best, though the only laptops I have access to right now are Macs which can't run CalMAN or madTPG.
I understand that this may not be something you can change on your own, though it would be good if some sort of "single display mode" where madTPG only shows during measurements could be supported - ideally with CalMAN pausing at the beginning of each set to allow the switch into FSE.

Last edited by 6233638; 5th June 2015 at 19:23.
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Old 5th June 2015, 19:22   #30765  |  Link
James Freeman
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@madshi

I noticed an unexpected behavior in the bitdepth conversion in madVR with the OS profile.
I bought an aliexpress chinese LED projector for quick testing, and I noticed it only accepts 6bit without banding.
With 8bit+D smooth pattern has huge bands, while 6bit+D is smooth; From this I deduct that these chinese projectors only accept 6bit and lower without banding.
Bless you for having the option to select output bitdepth in madVR!

Now for the problem I see,
When I output 6bit+D smooth pattern from madVR without OS .icm color management profile, i see no banding at all...Smooth.
When I turn ON the OS color management I see (rainbow) banding with 6bit+D even though it was smooth, to get the pattern smooth again (without rainbow banding) I have to lower the bitdepth to 4bit+D in madVR...??
With 3DLUT the pattern is smooth with 6bit+D with no rainbow banding.

I can only guess that there is something wrong with bitdepth conversion in madVR of the OS profile.
Judging by eye, 4bit is actually higher when using OS profile because I see no dithering or banding, but it is correct(lower) when using 3DLUT and the dithering pattern is a lot more visible.

Let me rephrase,
8bit = banding -> crap projector.
NO system profile 6bit+D = Smooth.
System profile 6bid+D = rainbow banding.
3DLUT 6bit+D = Smooth.
System profile 4bid+D = Smooth with no dithering visible or rainbow banding.
3DLUT 4bit+D = Smooth but heavy dithering visible.

I think there is a miss match between 3DLUT and System Profile bit depths in madVR.
Please look into it.

Thanks

------

Thank you for 88.11, I'll be testing the image enhancement and report.
And congratulations for the new website... may I say, FINALLY!
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Last edited by James Freeman; 5th June 2015 at 19:46.
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Old 5th June 2015, 19:36   #30766  |  Link
SecurityBunny
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Quote:
Originally Posted by madshi View Post
Probably the batch needs write access to the madVR folder for your normal non-admin user to work correctly, I suppose. Not sure why it doesn't work as admin, though. Anyway, doing the renaming manually works, too, of course.
Only have one user and it is an administrator account. Should have full permission access to the madVR folder. If I had to guess why running as admin doesn't work, perhaps it is related to how running command prompt as admin changes the default directory to system32 instead of the user folder?

Quote:
Originally Posted by madshi View Post
Argh, stupid me, my workaround didn't work properly. Does the following release mode test build work better? If not, try lowering the number of prepresented frames once again:

http://madshi.net/madVR8811test.zip
Unfortunately not. Same queue numbers as before. And similar to before, have to reduce prepresented frames to 6 to get it to fill completely. (Am able to use 8-16 perfectly fine with 0.88.8.)
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Old 5th June 2015, 19:44   #30767  |  Link
v0lt
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@madshi
Frame rate = 59.94, refresh rate = 75 Hz, madVR writes: "1 frame repeat every 3.89 minutes". I think it is wrong.
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Old 5th June 2015, 19:45   #30768  |  Link
Budtz
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Im very happy with just using finesharp. I do hope the option to ajust strength of sharpnes does not get reduced to low/medium/high. Also i am hoping for limitedsharpenfaster as i can not get it stable with avisynth. I know expanded shadersupport is needed for this one.
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Old 5th June 2015, 19:47   #30769  |  Link
madshi
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 6233638 View Post
Every time with madTPG. Doesn't seem to have been an issue with video playback that I've seen.
It even happens without CalMAN being open. Double-clicking the madTPG window to exit full-screen mode results in a black screen and I have to hit Esc to close madTPG to get rid of it.
EDIT: Seems to intermittently work with this test build. Prior to that it would black out 100% of the time. Now it's more like 75% of the time.
Hmmmm... I seem to be able to reproduce the issue - but only when doubling clicking. Try Alt+Enter, that works for me. For you, too?

Quote:
Originally Posted by James Freeman View Post
I noticed an unexpected behavior in the bitdepth conversion in madVR with the OS profile.
I bought an aliexpress chinese LED projector for quick testing, and I noticed it only accepts 6bit without banding.
With 8bit+D smooth pattern has huge bands, while 6bit+D is smooth; From this I deduct that these chinese projectors only accept 6bit and lower without banding.

Now for the problem I see,
When I output 6bit+D smooth pattern from madVR without OS .icm color management profile, i see no banding at all...Smooth.
When I turn ON the OS color management I see (rainbow) banding with 6bit+D even though it was smooth, to get the pattern smooth again (without rainbow banding) I have to lower the bitdepth to 4bit+D in madVR...??
It is known that the OS color management and DXVA color management sucks.

It is known, khaleesi.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SecurityBunny View Post
Unfortunately not. Same queue numbers as before. And similar to before, have to reduce prepresented frames to 6 to get it to fill completely. (Am able to use 8-16 perfectly fine with 0.88.8.)
Ok, could you please create another debug log with this build:

http://madshi.net/madVR8811test2.zip

Quote:
Originally Posted by v0lt View Post
Frame rate = 59.94, refresh rate = 75 Hz, madVR writes: "1 frame repeat every 3.89 minutes". I think it is wrong.
Yes, that looks weird.
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Old 5th June 2015, 19:51   #30770  |  Link
SecurityBunny
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Quote:
Originally Posted by madshi View Post
Ok, could you please create another debug log with this build:

http://madshi.net/madVR8811test2.zip
Debug log: https://www.dropbox.com/s/hi8yiom7xc...20log.txt?dl=0

Same results as before - unfilled queues with high prepresented frames.
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Old 5th June 2015, 20:07   #30771  |  Link
RainyDog
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JPulowski View Post
Hi madshi,

Thanks for including LumaSharpen. I did some testing and here is some feedback:
  • Looks like currently you are using the old version of LumaSharpen, which is 1.4.1. Current version is 1.5.0, which is included with Reshade + SweetFX bundle. I have already modified it for MPC-HC use, you can find it here.
  • Current madVR implementation uses Pattern 2 (9 tap gaussian, 4+1 texture fetches), although it looks nice on video games it doesn't look that good when it comes to videos. In my opinion, it would be better if you'd include the other patterns as options.
  • This is more of a personal request: I am normally used to MPC-HC's shader management. For instance I do always apply LumaSharpen, no matter if there is resizing or not. With madVR even though I can use profiles it gets complicated in this case. Because sometimes I watch videos downsized in windowed mode, which LumaSharpen does not apply unless it is pre-resize. And pre-resize and post-resize(upscale) applications of LumaSharpen is quite different from each other and requires additional fiddling. It would be nice if there would be an option to apply LumaSharpen always as post-resize.
If you're looking for feedback for LumaSharpen madshi, I remember seeing this post a few weeks ago and it seems to have been lost amongst the influx of new stuff happening at the time.

The first two points are certainly important things for you to look into. In the original SweetFX thread opinion was unanimous that Pattern 3 was better for video than Pattern 2.
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Old 5th June 2015, 20:22   #30772  |  Link
6233638
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Quote:
Originally Posted by madshi View Post
Hmmmm... I seem to be able to reproduce the issue - but only when doubling clicking. Try Alt+Enter, that works for me. For you, too?
When using that test build, I tried maybe 50 times and did not see a black screen when hitting alt+enter.
The first time that I tried double-clicking after that, it turned black again.
After I got the first black screen, even using alt+enter results in a black screen every time.

I'll also point out that prior to 0.80.11 and that test build, I did try using alt+enter and was still getting black screens occasionally.
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Old 5th June 2015, 20:48   #30773  |  Link
krille
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I get a lot if dropped frames if I enable madvr;s debanding. Also the queues does not stay stable.
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Old 5th June 2015, 21:31   #30774  |  Link
cyberscott
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Quote:
Originally Posted by madshi View Post

Hope v0.88.11 is working fine for you?
It works as well as test build 5 in DSD11 10 bit exclusive mode. As long as I set the "presented in advance" frames to 4 it works ok, though I do tend to take more repeated and dropped frames with higher scaling settings and when things get "busy" on video with action and/or a lot of subtitles displaying at the same time. I've attributed this to the lower pre-presented frames and not enough frames in advance to compensate for all the action /subtitles on screen.
It was more stable on v0. 88.8 in DSD11 10 bit exclusive on several of my "test" videos due to being able to set the pre-presented frames higher. When not in 10 bit mode, all is well with the queues.
It looks like other have started to chime in about the pre-presented queues not totally filling in DSD11 10 bit mode after build v.088.8. I was beginning to wonder if I was the only one to be experiencing this.
To end on a good note, the revised de-banding is working good for me in this build.
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Old 5th June 2015, 22:11   #30775  |  Link
vivan
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Quote:
Originally Posted by krille View Post
I get a lot if dropped frames if I enable madvr;s debanding. Also the queues does not stay stable.
This mean that your hw is not fast enough / your settings are too demanding.
What about rendering time? Video fps, display and video resolution? What is your hardware?
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Old 5th June 2015, 22:18   #30776  |  Link
tobindac
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yeyy, still no "ding" from the installer.
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Old 5th June 2015, 22:42   #30777  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by madshi View Post
FWIW, madVR is reporting the detected refresh rate via the madVR interface. If Reclock wanted, it could get the refresh rate from there.
Does it mean that ReClock icon could be yellow because it detects the refresh rate incorrectly? My projector supports 24 Hz, and madVR is customized to switch the projector to this mode while playing 24/23.976 fps movies, but ReClock goes yellow almost always. I have to manually change the video playback rate to get the green icon.

There is an issue with 0.88.10 and 0.88.11: the playback freezes sometimes. It happens to me a couple of times on two different BDRemuxes. The issue is unstable; I've tried to reproduce it later (same video, same time, same player, etc.) but had no luck. Maybe the issue was introduced in one of the earlier 0.88.x builds - I can't use them on the regular basis because of http://bugs.madshi.net/view.php?id=284. But I've never experienced it on 0.87.14. WinXP, GF 8800 GT, driver v340.52.
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Old 5th June 2015, 22:52   #30778  |  Link
nlnl
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madshi
Tested new image ehancement option using this image https://cloud.mail.ru/public/AbGY/UwuASurxH
The results:
Fine Sharp ON

FS OFF


Can not see horisontal lines when FS OFF and the same with SuperRes filter OFF for chroma upsampling.
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Old 5th June 2015, 23:07   #30779  |  Link
krille
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Originally Posted by vivan View Post
This mean that your hw is not fast enough / your settings are too demanding.
What about rendering time? Video fps, display and video resolution? What is your hardware?
Intel Corei5 2400, Nvidia gtx 960. Rendering g times 5,5 ms average, 7,4 ms max. 1080p mkv, gpu usage about 14%.

Hade the same problem with 0,88.10, but then I could use Shiandows debanding witch caused no problems.
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Old 5th June 2015, 23:09   #30780  |  Link
MS-DOS
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Originally Posted by krille View Post
Intel Corei5 2400, Nvidia gtx 960. Rendering g times 5,5 ms average, 7,4 ms max. 1080p mkv, gpu usage about 14%.

Hade the same problem with 0,88.10, but then I could use Shiandows debanding witch caused no problems.
Do you have a trade option "don't render frames when fade in\out is detected" checked ?
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