madVR - high quality video renderer (GPU assisted)

[Patrik G]

Originally Posted by huhn

i don't remember the exact number but the max brightness was something like 0.5 nits just as a reference SDR is 100 and HDR is usually about 1000.

yes i noticed it
it says 1 nit for hdr brightness with this demo so something is wrong
the other hdr demos reports 1000 nits

[ang3l]

@madshi

madvr 0.90.19 + mpc-hc (nightly) crash at start with last AMD crimson 16.5.2 hotfix

http://pastebin.com/XCWq7Akt

[Uoppi]

Originally Posted by 70MM

What numbers might some people here increase this to?
I have all mine set at 8...

Just do some testing and raise/lower the values to whatever works.

After some thorough testing a few months ago, my optimal settings for example turned out to be 6/20/20. Less or more than 6 didn't work properly and increasing past 20 didn't bring any added benefit (while 18 on the other hand was a tad too low). Now I never get unexpected drops after the playback has started.

[djfred93]

Just for knowing, ringing is this, right ?

http://imgur.com/zC5U2kK

[CarlosCaco]

Originally Posted by madshi

It's difficult to make this configurable. Some users may share your opinion, others might not. If I added an option for this, it would be hard to understand for most users what the option means exactly.

Maybe you could activate supersampling (see image doubling section)? If you do that, upscaling refinement should work as expected. Of course this solution costs quite a bit of extra performance.

Hey madshi, as you suggest i tried again supersampling on v.19 and madvr still don´t activate upscalling refinements on my resolution movie = 720p, screen =1360x768
double checked on aways 2x supersampling and aways when upscaling is needed,
the image doubles, downscale but not apply the refinements
no image changes and no render times changes even if check all the refinements on high
remember you said one time that supersampling only actives upscaling refinements if screen resolution was the same as movie resolution... still not activating on my situation...
i trie restore default settings uninstal, and copy the new version and begin from 0 but still the same behave
by the time i have to use with only image enhacements with no supersampling, its preety good but has some distortions with ab enabled... thanks for your atention and again sorry for bother you and the others with this situation

[har3inger]

Originally Posted by djfred93

Just for knowing, ringing is this, right ?

http://imgur.com/zC5U2kK

Yes, that is compression ringing (artefact from low video bitrate). However, the dering filter is more targeted towards downscale ringing, which are thin halos right beside lines, not ripples a fair ways away. The filter may not remove the ringing in this image very well/at all.

[James Freeman]

Actually ringing is an artifact of sharpening of downscaled images.

For upscaling (chroma or luma) I don't think more than Bilinear is needed for accurate results.
Anyone disagree and why?

[burfadel]

Originally Posted by ang3l

@madshi

madvr 0.90.19 + mpc-hc (nightly) crash at start with last AMD crimson 16.5.2 hotfix

http://pastebin.com/XCWq7Akt

Works fine here (Windows 10 Insider). What OS and card do you have?

[huhn]

Originally Posted by James Freeman

Actually ringing is an artifact of sharpening of downscaled images.

For upscaling (chroma or luma) I don't think more than Bilinear is needed for accurate results.
Anyone disagree and why?

what?

[aufkrawall]

Originally Posted by burfadel

Works fine here (Windows 10 Insider). What OS and card do you have?

It works fine here for me too with Win 10 x64 final (latest updates) and R9 390.

[madshi]

Originally Posted by CarlosCaco

the same way we choose with all other bigger upscaling factors
if we want to sharpen the source we use image enhacements
if we want apply the sharpen after upscaling use upscalling refinements
if we want use in both use in both

There's a reason I'm disabling the upscaling refinements for very small upscaling factors. As I said before: You don't like it, other users might like it. So if I fulfill your wish, other users might be unhappy. I can't make everybody happy without adding a new option. And that new option would be hard to understand.

Originally Posted by CarlosCaco

as you suggest i tried again supersampling on v.19 and madvr still don´t activate upscalling refinements on my resolution movie = 720p, screen =1360x768
double checked on aways 2x supersampling and aways when upscaling is needed,
the image doubles, downscale but not apply the refinements
no image changes and no render times changes even if check all the refinements on high

Your posts are really hard to read. Try sorting your sentences into logical paragraphs, please, and don't use line breaks, except to separate paragraphs.

So is image doubling not activating for you, if you select "supersampling" in the image doubling section? Or does it activate, but upscaling refinement doesn't activate?

Originally Posted by bcec

Just when I thought madVR can't get any better, and that it is already amazing as it is... this deringing thing is frigging fantastic! Ringing in the original bluray source is my number 1 annoyance. I am even annoyed by ones caused by very mild DNR+EE that is present in newer titles like Force Awakens. This thing is doing wonders! A big THANK YOU!

Originally Posted by Asmodian

I haven't mentioned it yet but "reduce ringing artifacts" is great.. like all these new options it is hard for me to offer useful feedback for but it is a Good Thing. The updated version is better still.
Thanks a lot.

Originally Posted by 70MM

I have "delay playback start until render queue is full" turned on yet I still get the few dropped frames at the start of everything for a couple of secs.

Try with default settings, but "delay playback start" activated. Still the same problem?

Smooth motion FRC does need a moment to activate properly. That's just the way it is atm. It should only be a very short time, though, not a couple of seconds. Maybe your settings are too high so that the GPU has trouble keeping up? That might be partially responsible. Try lowering your madVR settings a bit to give the GPU more room to breathe. That might already fix the problem.

Originally Posted by 70MM

Is there a way for a 3rd party control system to control any of the MADVR functions via IP? I have currently been using Eventghost but I would like to eliminate the middleman and control it directly if possible.

Haven't we discussed this already a while ago? I'm pretty sure somebody asked a similar question not long ago, and I think it was you, wasn't it?

Originally Posted by mzso

??? What's the point of this? Adding grain is just more noise isn't it?

Most movie sources have a bit of grain in them. The way the deringing works, it totally smoothes areas where ringing was detected. As a result these areas look smoother than the rest of the image, which is a visible artifact. So I'm adding grain to make these areas appear more natural and not overly smoothed over.

Originally Posted by Patrik G

problem with the Sony HDR camp Demo

Just read a couple pages back. This was already reported and extensively discussed.

Originally Posted by Werewolfy

I understand your point but maybe it would makes sense to do a test build with different tresholds to play with? Maybe we will find a better compromise, maybe we won't.

I just tried it and I found more artefacts. Look at the teeth of the characters. It's maybe the only thing that keeps me to use it all the time with compressed videos.

Deringing 90.18 vs 90.19
Deringing off vs on

Here's the original picture but I don't know if it will help because on my side, deringing doesn't seem to work on juste one picture.

http://postimg.org/image/5t877ur9t/

Oh well, I suppose I'll have to check where the artifact is coming from. Maybe I can fix it. I don't think modifying the thresholds it very promising. Maybe as a last resort, if everything else fails. But I'd much prefer not having a strength setting. The visible difference would be very small and users wouldn't know which setting to use.

Originally Posted by aufkrawall

As expected, unfortunately deringing in .19 looks quite dirty with cartoons.

.18:


.19:

It's not looking that dirty to my eyes, but my computer monitor isn't very good, I suppose. I guess I could try to adjust the grain level to the grain that is in the rest of the image. So I would add more grain for grainy sources, and less grain for very smooth sources.

Originally Posted by ang3l

@madshi

madvr 0.90.19 + mpc-hc (nightly) crash at start with last AMD crimson 16.5.2 hotfix

http://pastebin.com/XCWq7Akt

Does this one fix it?

http://madshi.net/madVR9019amdFix.rar

[James Freeman]

Originally Posted by huhn

what?

Yeah.
A simple interpolation is all that it takes for upscaling.
You can't ADD detail that is not there, can you?

[Nevilne]

the irony of saying that in madvr thread

[madshi]

Originally Posted by James Freeman

A simple interpolation is all that it takes for upscaling.
You can't ADD detail that is not there, can you?

OMG, are you serious? Why don't you take a nicely sharp photo, scale it down to 25% with a good downscaling algorithm, and then scale it back up with madVR to 100%. Then compare Bilinear to the more sophisticated algorithms. If you think that Bilinear is producing the best quality (or comes nearest to the original image), then you need to go visit an eye doctor, and very quickly.

[James Freeman]

No offense of course, just some speculation.
Interpolation is for interpolation which always starts with nearest neighbor, sharpening and anti-aliasing comes on top of that if wanted or needed.

[Ver Greeneyes]

Nearest neighbor, linear and bicubic (and its variants) are interpolation-based, but upscalers like SuperXBR and NNEDI3 work quite differently.

[aufkrawall]

Originally Posted by madshi

It's not looking that dirty to my eyes, but my computer monitor isn't very good, I suppose. I guess I could try to adjust the grain level to the grain that is in the rest of the image. So I would add more grain for grainy sources, and less grain for very smooth sources.

Some areas look very dirty to me in comparison, e.g. the dark wooden wall at the stairway.
Well, looking forward to your grain detection.

Originally Posted by madshi

OMG, are you serious? Why don't you take a nicely sharp photo, scale it down to 25% with a good downscaling algorithm, and then scale it back up with madVR to 100%. Then compare Bilinear to the more sophisticated algorithms. If you think that Bilinear is producing the best quality (or comes nearest to the original image), then you need to go visit an eye doctor, and very quickly.

mmd

[huhn]

Originally Posted by James Freeman

Yeah.
A simple interpolation is all that it takes for upscaling.
You can't ADD detail that is not there, can you?

but you can remove them.

and bilinear is pretty good at making the image extremely unsharp so it is not that "accurate".

spline 3 is know to have pretty high psnr or was it gaussian?
what so ever PSNR is just math and not subjective.

i mean x264 can be used to achieve the highest possible PSNR but this usually doesn't result in a better subjective visible results. it is off by default for a reason.

doom9 was down so i guess i'm a little bit late.

[madshi]

Originally Posted by James Freeman

No offense of course, just some speculation.

Why do you feel the need to speculate at all? It's so easy to test it. Please do yourself (and us all) a favor and do the test I suggested in my previous comment. If you do that, you'll quickly see that your speculation is way off.

[mark0077]

madshi, very small issue I have after every upgrade. I just want to get your opinion on it, as to whether to register it as a bug or not on madVR bug list.

After I upgrade versions, if I then launch a movie and go to fullscreen. If I then open the madVR properties via right click mpc-be window and open madVR properties, some sort of permissions dialog box appears behind the madVR window but I actually can't get to the "Edit Settings" section. Its like as if mpc-be and the "Properties" dialog are in some sort of modal setup where no combination of clicking Close / OK / Cancel / Alt-Tab can get me out of it. I have to kill with task manager or if I can't get to it which is the case right now, I have to reboot.

Just not sure if its anything that be made so that it doesn't appear on each upgrade.

EDIT: OK I reproduced in non full screen mode, and its Windows Smartscreen pop up thats saying its an unknown application. (Windows 10 64bit)