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Old 14th January 2016, 02:44   #35301  |  Link
4h4h270
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after update to madvr .90.2 everything work fine on my system, happy!

just playback a whole movie for test, get some present glitch and frame drop ocasionally, and a massive frame drop during playback at half time, I pause it for some sceconds, it's gone.

Last edited by 4h4h270; 14th January 2016 at 08:10.
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Old 14th January 2016, 03:40   #35302  |  Link
x7007
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I have Present Queue issue, when watching 1080p the present queue drops randomly to 1-2/3 and sometimes 0-2/3 and I have presentation glitches and sometimes dropped frames.
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Old 14th January 2016, 06:20   #35303  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by x7007 View Post
I have Present Queue issue, when watching 1080p the present queue drops randomly to 1-2/3 and sometimes 0-2/3 and I have presentation glitches and sometimes dropped frames.
Your settings are too aggressive. Try lowering them slightly or using some of the trade quality for performance checkboxes.
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Old 14th January 2016, 06:21   #35304  |  Link
apgood
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Manni View Post
One thing I haven't tried is Crimson vs Catalyst (I only tried with Catalyst 14.12). This bug could have been fixed with Crimson, which is quite a big redesign.

- Is it only AMD users who complain about this re 3D with LAV+MadVR?

- Has any AMD owner managed to get 3D to work with LAV+MadVR without the perspective/eye reverse AMD Bug?

- If any AMD user managed to get 3D to work properly, are they using Catalyst or Crimson drivers?
I'm using the latest version of the AMD Crimson drivers and while my projector switches in 3D mode it does seem to have any depth to it (i.e. just looks like 2D).

This is on Windows 10 pro and player is jriver MC.

Note: I haven't tried MadVR 90.2 yet though.
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Old 14th January 2016, 07:35   #35305  |  Link
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Ok - I've had it working twice but not consistently. In all cases I'm getting NV12, 8bit, 4:2:0 (3D) (so LAV is decoding), but most of the time I ether get:
- D3D9 & Side By Side, or
- MC Crashes

I'll test more tomorrow but no obvious pattern, as after one play it stopped working the second time.
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Old 14th January 2016, 08:34   #35306  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jmone View Post
Ok - I've had it working twice but not consistently. In all cases I'm getting NV12, 8bit, 4:2:0 (3D) (so LAV is decoding), but most of the time I ether get:
- D3D9 & Side By Side, or
- MC Crashes

I'll test more tomorrow but no obvious pattern, as after one play it stopped working the second time.
Mine was more stable when I unticked the switching to 2D for 2D movies option in MadVR, but haven't tried it often enough to confirm this has fixed the crashing in MC
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Old 14th January 2016, 09:00   #35307  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by madshi View Post
Oh, good catch. Will have to disable SmoothMotion forcefully, when using 3D. Probably makes no sense to have it enabled, anyway, since movie and display refresh will should always match when playing 3D.
Right.

Quote:
Originally Posted by madshi View Post
Reproduced and "fixed" (by always using 8bit for 3D).
Yes, it’s fixed in v0.90.2. I guess Direct3D doesn’t allow 10 bit for 3D output.

Quote:
Originally Posted by madshi View Post
Interesting. I've now modified the logic to always assume 1080p23 for 3D playback. Hope it fixes this issue. Can you confirm?
Yes, it fixes the issue as tested with the 3D MKV sample I have, but there are two things to consider here:
1. In India, Blu Rays are mastered at 24 fps and not 23.976 fps. I guess it happens the same in most other PAL countries too. So ideally you should force 23p/ 24p for 3D playback depending upon the source fps, if you aren’t already doing that.
2. When you implement processing of SBS and TBB content, for the broadcasted SBS/ TBB you may want to output 50p/ 60p frame packed 3D. However, such content is rare and 3D is anyway not so popular.

Quote:
Originally Posted by madshi View Post
That's weird. It works for me. Just to be safe, can you try making the monitor primary, if it's still secondary right now?
I was outputting to only one display – TV. But this problem is fixed in v0.90.2. So no worries.
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Old 14th January 2016, 09:25   #35308  |  Link
Manni
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Quote:
Originally Posted by apgood View Post
I'm using the latest version of the AMD Crimson drivers and while my projector switches in 3D mode it does seem to have any depth to it (i.e. just looks like 2D).

This is on Windows 10 pro and player is jriver MC.

Note: I haven't tried MadVR 90.2 yet though.
Thanks. This is what I experienced when LAV wasn't installed properly.

Please install the latest MadVR and lastest LAV (not sure if jRiver uses its own versions though, you might want to use MPC-BE to be able to test the independent versions of LAV and MadVR) and report what MadVR displays in the OSD, just to be sure everything is working as it should. It should report 3D both for content and rendering, which is what it does on my system.

Also does your display switch to 1080p24 (FP)? Does it work in 3D with PowerDVD or similar? You can install a demo of PowerDVD if you don't own it, just to make sure your system and display are able to play 3D properly.
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Old 14th January 2016, 10:24   #35309  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CarlosCaco View Post
Hey everybpdy, someone could tell me what the new luma scalling option use sigmoidal light does? when should i use this? should i leave this aways check like linear light on downscalle?
Quote:
Originally Posted by madshi View Post
Sometimes it improves upscaling quality by reducing aliasing and ringing slightly. Sometimes it can also increase aliasing and ringing, though. So it needs some serious testing to come to a conclusion whether it should be enabled by default or not.
I asked for the option after noticing some differences between madvr and mpv and their scaling. It can be very subtle but can also be obvious on certain things. In my experience with it I'd say it's likely to be better most or all of the time and it's unlikely to be noticeably worse so I think it's safe to always have on. For comparison mpv always uses sigmoidal upscaling with their opengl-hq video out driver.

Scaling (only) in linear light is only useful for downscaling in case anyone was wondering why the option was replaced. Sigmoidal upscaling actually implies scaling in linear light.

Quote:
Originally Posted by x7007 View Post
I have Present Queue issue, when watching 1080p the present queue drops randomly to 1-2/3 and sometimes 0-2/3 and I have presentation glitches and sometimes dropped frames.
Remind us again what's wrong with using the default settings for those?
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Old 14th January 2016, 10:33   #35310  |  Link
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madshi - i check latest version, don't work 3D, only side-by-side picture.
I try set TV as primary device, set only only TV in system - don't help.
Try reset settings - don't help.
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Old 14th January 2016, 10:35   #35311  |  Link
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Is 3d supported in the profile rules? Cause watching 3D movies raises my rendertimes to 75ms and I get dropped frames because it selects my 23p profile...
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Old 14th January 2016, 10:48   #35312  |  Link
madshi
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GCRaistlin View Post
madVR doesn't activate the correct interlacing mode (film) for PAL sample and switches to 50 Hz with default deinterlacing settings (+ LAV's YADIF disabled + ReClock's PAL speed down enabled).
Currently madVR doesn't have a good auto-detection for film mode vs video mode. So unless you force film mode, madVR always uses DXVA deinterlacing in double frame rate. That is currently by design.

Quote:
Originally Posted by apgood View Post
I'm using the latest version of the AMD Crimson drivers and while my projector switches in 3D mode it does seem to have any depth to it (i.e. just looks like 2D).

This is on Windows 10 pro and player is jriver MC.

Note: I haven't tried MadVR 90.2 yet though.
Please try v0.90.2. If that doesn't help, please browse through the AMD control panel to see if there's any setting there which you might have changed which might make a difference. Try to set everything to "application controlled" or default settings.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jmone View Post
Ok - I've had it working twice but not consistently. In all cases I'm getting NV12, 8bit, 4:2:0 (3D) (so LAV is decoding), but most of the time I ether get:
- D3D9 & Side By Side, or
- MC Crashes

I'll test more tomorrow but no obvious pattern, as after one play it stopped working the second time.
Interesting. NVidia, right?

Does any AMD or Intel user have 3D crashes? I think it's limited to NVidia? On my PC it doesn't occur, though (as usual ).

Quote:
Originally Posted by omarank View Post
Yes, it fixes the issue as tested with the 3D MKV sample I have, but there are two things to consider here:
1. In India, Blu Rays are mastered at 24 fps and not 23.976 fps. I guess it happens the same in most other PAL countries too. So ideally you should force 23p/ 24p for 3D playback depending upon the source fps, if you aren’t already doing that.
2. When you implement processing of SBS and TBB content, for the broadcasted SBS/ TBB you may want to output 50p/ 60p frame packed 3D. However, such content is rare and 3D is anyway not so popular.
Yes, I'm aware of 23p vs 24p. But for now I just wanted to stick to the most common standard and make that stable first, before looking at corner cases.

My projector doesn't support frame packed 3D at 50p/60p, AFAIK. I'm not sure if many other display do?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Aleksoid1978 View Post
i check latest version, don't work 3D, only side-by-side picture.
I try set TV as primary device, set only only TV in system - don't help.
Try reset settings - don't help.
If you do that (primary device), do you then get a 3D checkbox in your OS display resolution control panel (see screenshots for Windows 8.1 and 10 earlier in this thread)? This is the key thing you need to achieve. If you don't get that checkbox, then Direct3D11 will most probably not allow me to switch to 3D.

Do you use some sort of EDID override? It seems to me that your OS doesn't recognize that your display can do 3D. We need to find out why. Maybe if you don't have an EDID override now, it might be worth trying to do one which announces 3D support, so the OS and GPU actually understand that your display can do 3D?

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Is 3d supported in the profile rules?
Not yet, but probably next weekend.
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Old 14th January 2016, 11:19   #35313  |  Link
Aleksoid1978
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Quote:
Originally Posted by madshi View Post
If you do that (primary device), do you then get a 3D checkbox in your OS display resolution control panel (see screenshots for Windows 8.1 and 10 earlier in this thread)? This is the key thing you need to achieve. If you don't get that checkbox, then Direct3D11 will most probably not allow me to switch to 3D.

Do you use some sort of EDID override? It seems to me that your OS doesn't recognize that your display can do 3D. We need to find out why. Maybe if you don't have an EDID override now, it might be worth trying to do one which announces 3D support, so the OS and GPU actually understand that your display can do 3D?
I don't have 3D options in OS (Win 10 Ent x64) - but PowerDVD/TMT playback in 3D perfect.
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Old 14th January 2016, 11:19   #35314  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by madshi
Oh well, then I don't know why it's not working for you. It seems to be a problem with the GPU drivers (?). You could try reinstalling those, or try a different version.
tried 3-4 different versions. no difference. any other idea?



Quote:
Originally Posted by madshi
Not yet, but probably next weekend.
that would be great! thx.



Quote:
Ok - I've had it working twice but not consistently. In all cases I'm getting NV12, 8bit, 4:2:0 (3D) (so LAV is decoding), but most of the time I ether get:
- D3D9 & Side By Side, or
- MC Crashes

I'll test more tomorrow but no obvious pattern, as after one play it stopped working the second time.
same problems here. GTX 970 (361.60), Win 10, all latest software and 64bit.
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Old 14th January 2016, 11:49   #35315  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Manni View Post
Thanks. This is what I experienced when LAV wasn't installed properly.

Please install the latest MadVR and lastest LAV (not sure if jRiver uses its own versions though, you might want to use MPC-BE to be able to test the independent versions of LAV and MadVR) and report what MadVR displays in the OSD, just to be sure everything is working as it should. It should report 3D both for content and rendering, which is what it does on my system.

Also does your display switch to 1080p24 (FP)? Does it work in 3D with PowerDVD or similar? You can install a demo of PowerDVD if you don't own it, just to make sure your system and display are able to play 3D properly.
I did replace the versions in jriver with latest nightlies of LAV (dated 13 Jan) and MadVR (90.1 at the time) and my projector was reporting that was receiving a 3D frame packed video stream it just doesn't look 3D. Also, when I disabled 3D in MadVR it was displaying a SBS video stream so I assume it was working.

I have a PowerDVD license and uses to use it for 3D viewing but don't really like it, so I swapped to a Mede8er for 3D movies which handles 3D really well, but if I can get a LAV and MadVR combo to work then I'll probably switch to that because the zoom functionality is so seamless in changing aspect ratios on my scope screen.

Good idea. I'll try to get some time tomorrow night to install mpc-be as a control just to make sure it isn't can issue with jriver mc and I how I've installed LAV.
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Old 14th January 2016, 12:02   #35316  |  Link
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Originally Posted by Aleksoid1978 View Post
I don't have 3D options in OS (Win 10 Ent x64) - but PowerDVD/TMT playback in 3D perfect.
As I mentioned earlier, PowerDVD/TMT probably use a special protected media playback path offered by Microsoft, which has the main purpose of protecting content from being ripped. See here:

https://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/lib...s.85).aspx#pmp

Using that path requires MediaFoundation and uses a special video renderer which you cannot replace and probably runs through different GPU driver routines and uses different APIs. Because of all that what PowerDVD/TMT do is *VERY* different to what madVR does. If we wanted to achieve the same result as PowerDVD/TMT, then MPC-HC/BE would have to use a MediaFoundation 3D splitter and decoder, which would have to be specially code-signed to work inside of the protect media playback path, and MPC-HC/BE would then have to use the stock OS video renderer, because the video renderer can not be replaced in the protected media player path. So this would be the opposite of using madVR.

I can only work with the APIs that the OS offers to me, which is Direct3D11, which is the same that games etc can use. I'm pretty sure that games will not be able to output 3D on your PC, either.

You didn't answer my question, though: Are you currently using an EDID override of some sorts?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sunset1982 View Post
tried 3-4 different versions. no difference. any other idea?
You could try going through the GPU control panel to see if anything is set to non-default values. Try "application controlled" everywhere, and default values where "application controlled" is not available. Also disable GSync, FreeSync, or other related extra features.

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Originally Posted by apgood View Post
when I disabled 3D in MadVR it was displaying a SBS video stream so I assume it was working.
No no no. If you disable 3D in madVR, you're supposed to see simple 2D, not SBS!!!

Are you really playing an MVC MKV? Or are you playing an SBS encoded MKV? Those are two *totally* different things. The new 3D support is atm only for MVC MKVs, which are straight remuxes from 3D-BluRay to MKV by using MakeMKV. MKVs encoded as side-by-side are not supported atm.
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Old 14th January 2016, 12:12   #35317  |  Link
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I not using any EDID override.
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Old 14th January 2016, 12:14   #35318  |  Link
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About PowerDVD - it's not MediaFoundation. It's use a DirectShow mechanism.
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Old 14th January 2016, 12:18   #35319  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by madshi View Post
Currently madVR doesn't have a good auto-detection for film mode vs video mode. So unless you force film mode, madVR always uses DXVA deinterlacing in double frame rate. That is currently by design.
Do I understand it right then that the best practice currently is to have madVR's "forced film mode" set (as the most interlaced sources are telecined and, besides that, DXVA deinterlacing doesn't work properly in a number of cases) and to enable LAV's YADIF video mode deinterlacing when playing natively interlaced videos?
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Old 14th January 2016, 12:40   #35320  |  Link
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About PowerDVD - it's not MediaFoundation. It's use a DirectShow mechanism.
The Microsoft "protected media path" is based on MediaFoundation and I believe all official players like PowerDVD/TMT *must* use it to protect the content. Maybe PowerDVD uses DirectShow for unprotected sources, but I don't think they're allowed to do that for protected content. Or am I wrong?

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I not using any EDID override.
Ok. Might make sense then to analyze your display's EDID to double check whether it announces 3D support or not. Can you please create a report with this tool:

http://www.entechtaiwan.com/util/moninfo.shtm

Please use the "real-time" information for your 3D display, and do "File -> Save Report".

Quote:
Originally Posted by GCRaistlin View Post
Do I understand it right then that the best practice currently is to have madVR's "forced film mode" set (as the most interlaced sources are telecined and, besides that, DXVA deinterlacing doesn't work properly in a number of cases) and to enable LAV's YADIF video mode deinterlacing when playing natively interlaced videos?
That depends on how many telecined and how many native video sources you're typically using. The "set-and-forget" option would be video/DXVA deinterlacing. If you're willing to manually switch based on the exact video source you're playing, then I'd switch between forced film mode and either DXVA or YADIF. Usually DXVA is better than YADIF, but sometimes YADIF might be better. Might depend on the video source, and also on the GPU. DXVA algorithms are totally different between different GPU manufacturers and sometimes even models or drivers.
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