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Old 2nd November 2019, 19:33   #7161  |  Link
Forteen88
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Originally Posted by Boulder View Post
You could try --frame-threads 1 to limit encoding to one frame at a time.
Yeah, I'd do this if I were the person you answered to, since this also increases the picture-quality of the encode.

Last edited by Forteen88; 2nd November 2019 at 19:38.
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Old 3rd November 2019, 19:19   #7162  |  Link
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At those rates you may very well get better results with AVC, to be honest.
I've done tests, 1080p with bitrate 22mb, x264 10bit (placebo, subme 11, bframes 8, etc) and x265 10bit (slow, no-rect, subme 4, bframes 8 and some other tweaks). In the end I get almost the same encoding speed. And x265 looks much better. I don't know why many people say that at high bitrate x264 beats x265.

Last edited by redbtn; 3rd November 2019 at 19:32.
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Old 3rd November 2019, 23:01   #7163  |  Link
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Originally Posted by redbtn View Post
I've done tests, 1080p with bitrate 22mb, x264 10bit (placebo, subme 11, bframes 8, etc) and x265 10bit (slow, no-rect, subme 4, bframes 8 and some other tweaks). In the end I get almost the same encoding speed. And x265 looks much better. I don't know why many people say that at high bitrate x264 beats x265.
BS. 22 Mbps is insanelly high for 1080p. That's basicaly a blu-ray teoritory. You are lieing saying that x265 looks MUCH BETTER.
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Old 3rd November 2019, 23:31   #7164  |  Link
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Originally Posted by Atak_Snajpera View Post
BS. 22 Mbps is insanelly high for 1080p. That's basicaly a blu-ray teoritory. You are lieing saying that x265 looks MUCH BETTER.
I know that 22 is very high for 1080p, I did it specially for test. After encode I upscaled FHD to UHD and compared them. I don't say that x265 MUCH better, but it significantly better at preserving small details. And I can definitely say it's not worse anyway.
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Old 4th November 2019, 20:45   #7165  |  Link
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It's definitely not impossible that x265 would produce better results than x264 at 22 Mbps for 1080p. I think it's fair to say that for MOST content the difference would be quite negligible, especially at the same encoding speed. Even if you can get a small improvement when encoding several times slower, is it really worth it?

In many use cases, probably not. But for some? Absolutely.
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Old 4th November 2019, 22:53   #7166  |  Link
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Originally Posted by Blue_MiSfit View Post
It's definitely not impossible that x265 would produce better results than x264 at 22 Mbps for 1080p. I think it's fair to say that for MOST content the difference would be quite negligible, especially at the same encoding speed. Even if you can get a small improvement when encoding several times slower, is it really worth it?

In many use cases, probably not. But for some? Absolutely.
Yes, you are right, it absolutely impossible notice the difference at 22mb between x264 and x265 just by watching video. Like I said, I upscaled screens to 4K for noticing difference.
But IMO, if x265 better at low bitrates and better at high bitrates, I don't see why I should use x264 at any cases.
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Old 5th November 2019, 09:30   #7167  |  Link
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I'm getting this warning. I'm trying to test the new frame duplication switch:

x265 [warning]: Frame-duplication require NAL HRD and VBV parameters. Disabling frame duplication

How do I address this?
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Old 5th November 2019, 09:36   #7168  |  Link
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Originally Posted by Magik Mark View Post
I'm getting this warning. I'm trying to test the new frame duplication switch:

x265 [warning]: Frame-duplication require NAL HRD and VBV parameters. Disabling frame duplication

How do I address this?
--hrd --vbv-maxrate <value> --vbv-bufsize <value>
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Old 6th November 2019, 04:31   #7169  |  Link
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Originally Posted by froggy1 View Post
--hrd --vbv-maxrate <value> --vbv-bufsize <value>
What value shall I use?
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Old 6th November 2019, 06:22   #7170  |  Link
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Originally Posted by Magik Mark View Post
What value shall I use?
This depends. maxrate sets a specific maximum bitrate ceiling while buffer size sets a buffer, which usually should be higher than maxrate
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Old 6th November 2019, 18:34   #7171  |  Link
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Originally Posted by Magik Mark View Post
What value shall I use?
For the values, you can use anything you want, but I would recommend using values to meet a certain Tier and Level so you can get Hardware accelerated decoding. You can see those at https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High_E...y_Video_Coding, under Tiers and levels section.

I usually set bufsize and maxrate as the same. I cannot find anywhere that shows how high bufsize can be set to to maintain DXVA hardware decoding, so I use the following for all my encodes for x265.

480p:--vbv-bufsize 12000 --vbv-maxrate 12000
1080p:--vbv-bufsize 20000 --vbv-maxrate 20000
2160p:--vbv-bufsize 25000 --vbv-maxrate 25000

These have all resulted in DXVA compatible files.
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Old 7th November 2019, 04:34   #7172  |  Link
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Originally Posted by froggy1 View Post
With my settings above and HME turned on, I can shave ~100 MiB of an encode. Encoded Blade Runner once with and once without HME. The result was 100 MiB in size reduction with better subjective quality when HME is on
What was the total filesize, from which you shaved off 100 Mb? I mean, what was the percentage reduction in bitrate? Also, what was the video resolution?

I'm trying to figure out if HME is worthwhile for me, given that the encoding is significantly slower.
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Old 7th November 2019, 11:39   #7173  |  Link
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Originally Posted by Majorlag View Post
For the values, you can use anything you want, but I would recommend using values to meet a certain Tier and Level so you can get Hardware accelerated decoding. You can see those at https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High_E...y_Video_Coding, under Tiers and levels section.

I usually set bufsize and maxrate as the same. I cannot find anywhere that shows how high bufsize can be set to to maintain DXVA hardware decoding, so I use the following for all my encodes for x265.

480p:--vbv-bufsize 12000 --vbv-maxrate 12000
1080p:--vbv-bufsize 20000 --vbv-maxrate 20000
2160p:--vbv-bufsize 25000 --vbv-maxrate 25000

These have all resulted in DXVA compatible files.
encoding 2160p with 25000??? Level 5.1 @ High10 allows 160000 for vbv
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Old 7th November 2019, 13:18   #7174  |  Link
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Originally Posted by jlpsvk View Post
encoding 2160p with 25000??? Level 5.1 @ High10 allows 160000 for vbv
And main teir is 40000.

If the only concern is level compatibility then I usually just set --level in the command line and x265 will automatically set the vbv and limit max ref frames etc to be compliant. But afaik some decoders will not handle such big bufsize even though they specification says that it supports a specific level, so there is viability to set custom (lower) values to ensure playback on an targeted device. But all my hevc level 5.1 devices have had no playback issues with encodes using the values in high teir though.

Last edited by excellentswordfight; 7th November 2019 at 13:40.
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Old 7th November 2019, 18:13   #7175  |  Link
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Originally Posted by aymanalz View Post
What was the total filesize, from which you shaved off 100 Mb? I mean, what was the percentage reduction in bitrate? Also, what was the video resolution?

I'm trying to figure out if HME is worthwhile for me, given that the encoding is significantly slower.
Resolution was 1080p and file size with HME on was 3.7 GiB while with HME off was a bit over 3.8 GiB. Slowdown, IIRC, was about 5-6%

In the end, I recommend doing your own tests and see if it's worthy
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Old 7th November 2019, 23:29   #7176  |  Link
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Originally Posted by jlpsvk View Post
encoding 2160p with 25000??? Level 5.1 @ High10 allows 160000 for vbv
I guess I could expand my reasoning as for why I would use those settings, since I do only encodes of 29.97fps video, then according to the graph I only need level 5.0, (4,096x2,160@30.0). I could set 5.1 spec, which allows up to 60fps, I don't encode 60fps, but I always use 10bit. I also use the 4k Ultra Blu-ray specifications at http://www.blu-raydisc.com/assets/Do...per_150724.pdf which says Main10 (which I understand to be Main10bit) or High (which I understand to be High8bit) or 5.1 Level max settings.

So I try to make sure I am as compatible with all my encodes as I can possible be. I hope I read the specs correctly.

Last edited by Majorlag; 7th November 2019 at 23:31.
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Old 8th November 2019, 04:13   #7177  |  Link
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Originally Posted by excellentswordfight View Post
And main teir is 40000.

If the only concern is level compatibility then I usually just set --level in the command line and x265 will automatically set the vbv and limit max ref frames etc to be compliant. But afaik some decoders will not handle such big bufsize even though they specification says that it supports a specific level, so there is viability to set custom (lower) values to ensure playback on an targeted device. But all my hevc level 5.1 devices have had no playback issues with encodes using the values in high teir though.
Lots of real-world devices support > main tier but not all of high tier. UHD Blu-ray supports 80 Mbps Level 5.1, for example. For typical long-GOP distribution encoding, the Main Tier limits are fine for transparent quality with most sources.
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Old 8th November 2019, 12:14   #7178  |  Link
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Lots of real-world devices support > main tier but not all of high tier. UHD Blu-ray supports 80 Mbps Level 5.1, for example. For typical long-GOP distribution encoding, the Main Tier limits are fine for transparent quality with most sources.
Table 2-3–Specification of BD-ROM Primary video streams: Primary VideoCodec: HEVC (Main 10, High Tier,Level 5.1) Max. bitrate 100Mbps

http://www.blu-raydisc.com/assets/Do...per_150724.pdf

The different disctypes will then have different maximum ts bitrates though, I guess that the discs that allow for 81.7 Mbps are the most common.

But when it comes to bufsize, is it common that that devices has a smaller buffer then the allowed maxrate for the supported level? If I remember it correctly HD blurays specified a smaller one (30 vs 40Mbps), and the same was true for PS3 and xbox360 compliant encodings.

If I read the whitepaper correctly, it looks like this is the bufsize specificaiton for UHD-Bluray for the HEVC stream:

"DPB1 Decoded picture buffer for HEVC stream: 93312000 [bytes]"

Last edited by excellentswordfight; 8th November 2019 at 13:52.
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Old 8th November 2019, 23:48   #7179  |  Link
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Other than using external film grain filter,
Is there any x265 parameters to ignore bluray film grain/noise to further reduce size ?
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Old 9th November 2019, 04:01   #7180  |  Link
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Other than using external film grain filter,
Is there any x265 parameters to ignore bluray film grain/noise to further reduce size ?
Anything with high grain should only be encoded in x264 (or just remuxed) as x265 still can not handle it anywhere near as well. I believe the last time someone tested it, they were doing the original Alien, and the re-encode came out larger than the source.

Unless it's magically gotten better since then.
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