madVR - high quality video renderer (GPU assisted)

[pose]

madshi, v0.91.7 works as fast as v0.91.5 for me on RX470. Image upscaling doubling menu looks a bit confusing. NGU Anti-Alias looks great. I noticed that some content which NGU sharp quadruples, NGU Anti-Alias is doubling instead with the same "let madvr decide" settings. Is that normal behavior?

[Anima123]

Originally Posted by madshi

So the real problem for you are just the crazy slowdowns? No idea how to debug that, unfortunately... And you can reproduce it 100% that you get those slowdowns with NGU-AA, but not with NGU-pixart? Does it also happen if you just do a simple 2x upscale without any downscaling involved, and without 4x?

Just found that the AR with the downscaling is the one to blame. Tried bicubic 60 with or without AR in downscaling make huge difference. The bicubic 60 without AR is as fast as old versions, when AR is in play, the stuttering began to present.

Edit: Quality-wise, NGU-AA is quite impressive even at low level with natural movies. The prominent one is that the edge of human faces is sharp and non-aliased with NGU-AA, which is pleasing to watch.

[madshi]

Originally Posted by Anima123

Just found that the AR with the downscaling is the one to blame. Tried bicubic 60 with or without AR in downscaling make huge difference. The bicubic 60 without AR is as fast as old versions, when AR is in play, the stuttering began to present.

Ah, interesting. Well, I've changed the AR filter from "strict" to "relaxed", which should result in a sharper looking result. But the "relaxed" AR filter is slightly slower. If you want to go back to "strict", you can setup the downscaling algo in the "image downscaling" section with "strict" AR, and then in the "image upscaling" section you can use the option "use image downscaling settings". That should get you back to NGU-pixart performance levels, on the cost of some sharpness.

Originally Posted by Anima123

Edit: Quality-wise, NGU-AA is quite impressive even at low level with natural movies. The prominent one is that the edge of human faces is sharp and non-aliased with NGU-AA, which is pleasing to watch.

Glad to hear that! NGU-AA "low" has changed quite a bit compared to the first NGU pixart test builds. It now has somewhat less anti-aliasing capabilities than before, but looks much more natural with normal film content, while still being better at AA than NGU Sharp.

Originally Posted by pose

I noticed that some content which NGU sharp quadruples, NGU Anti-Alias is doubling instead with the same "let madvr decide" settings. Is that normal behavior?

Sounds weird. Can you make a screenshot of the OSD (Ctrl+J) and of your "image upscaling" settings page, please?

[andybkma]

madshi, after playing around with mVR v91.4 I realized that NGU-Low for Image Upscaling was the best I can do without stuttering and dropped frames on my laptop's GT650M. Which of the new mVR settings is comparable to the quality and load use of what seems to be the now defunct NGU-Low? Thanks much...

[madshi]

There's nothing defunct. NGU-Low still exists, just the downscaling after doubling got a bit slower. See one post above for more information about that.

[Anima123]

It would be nice and more logical to me to keep the downscaling AR strict for low.

Or a lot of people would be confused on this.

BTW, AR relax is not 'a bit' slower, you sure there're no bug there in latest changes? The sporadically stuttering is quite suspicious to me.

[madshi]

Have you tried my suggestion of "use image downscaling settings"? If so, do you get the same speed as with the pixart test builds? If you do, there doesn't seem to be a bug. Maybe your GPU simply doesn't like the relaxed AR downscaling algo, for some weird reason.

It's worth considering strict AR for "low" doubling quality. Or maybe even for all Anti-Aliasing quality levels, because Anti-Aliasing isn't as sharp to begin with. I'll consider it for the next build.

[andybkma]

Originally Posted by madshi

There's nothing defunct. NGU-Low still exists, just the downscaling after doubling got a bit slower. See one post above for more information about that.

madshi, sorry but I can't find a "NGU-Low setting" inside the Image Upscaling options in the new mVR version 91.7. I upgraded from 91.4 to 91.7 with same settings and now instead of NGU-Low for Image Upscaling it automatically bumped me down to Lanczos 3. And on the right side under the new heading "Doubling" I only have options for NGU Anti Alias and NGU Sharp with another two NGU's greyed out. There is no option available to me for NGU-Low as I said....

[huhn]

they are renamed: https://forum.doom9.org/showpost.php...ostcount=42866

[andybkma]

Originally Posted by huhn

they are renamed: https://forum.doom9.org/showpost.php...ostcount=42866

Trying to read between the lines here... am assuming new name for NGU-Low is NGU-Soft but unusable in 91.7?

[pose]

Originally Posted by madshi

Sounds weird. Can you make a screenshot of the OSD (Ctrl+J) and of your "image upscaling" settings page, please?

https://imgur.com/a/X3Nzj

[tranfa]

Originally Posted by huhn

it's not that easy.


no.

Not sure it's a subject that will bring us OT, but I'd be really grateful to have more clarity around these concepts and the chain needed...

For instance, coming to 4:4:4, I'm in a weird situation in which the .png file that Madshi graciously made available shows a clear 4:4:4 if read on the browser, and doesn't once passing through Potplayer + MadVR...I think it's an issue with the internal Potplayer decode, but I'm not 100% certain...

[madshi]

Originally Posted by andybkma

Trying to read between the lines here... am assuming new name for NGU-Low is NGU-Soft but unusable in 91.7?

You're confusing the algo name with the quality level. "NGU", "NGU Anti-Aliasing" and "NGU Sharp" are all algorithm names. "Low" is the quality level. In v0.91.7, "NGU" was renamed to "NGU Sharp". There's an extra dropdown box which allows you to select the quality level.

Originally Posted by pose

https://imgur.com/a/X3Nzj

Crazy! Can you find any pattern to when NGU AA is used vs Sharp?

[andybkma]

Originally Posted by madshi

You're confusing the algo name with the quality level. "NGU", "NGU Anti-Aliasing" and "NGU Sharp" are all algorithm names. "Low" is the quality level. In v0.91.7, "NGU" was renamed to "NGU Sharp". There's an extra dropdown box which allows you to select the quality level.

Thanks madshi, ya that's exactly what happened. And you are as patient as a saint :-)

However new NGU Sharp-Low is using much more gpu load/higher gpu temps than the previous NGU-Low that was in 91.4... what can I do about this? All I did was change the Image Upscaling in the new version 91.7 to NGU Sharp Low that was previously NGU-Low in 91.4. Intentional to make it much more intensive?

[madshi]

Originally Posted by andybkma

And you are as patient as a saint :-)

I'm trying to. But in order to not test my any further, why don't you read the last 20 posts in this thread or so?

[pose]

Originally Posted by madshi

Crazy! Can you find any pattern to when NGU AA is used vs Sharp?

It happens with every video with 4:3 aspect ratio and resolution 640x480+.

Edit. Actually x480 seems to be the culprit.

[huhn]

Originally Posted by tranfa

Not sure it's a subject that will bring us OT, but I'd be really grateful to have more clarity around these concepts and the chain needed...

For instance, coming to 4:4:4, I'm in a weird situation in which the .png file that Madshi graciously made available shows a clear 4:4:4 if read on the browser, and doesn't once passing through Potplayer + MadVR...I think it's an issue with the internal Potplayer decode, but I'm not 100% certain...

feel free to make a new thread but i usually don't care about potplayer and i don't have a clue how potplayer is working internally. you may just scale it i don't know.

[andybkma]

Originally Posted by madshi

I'm trying to. But in order to not test my any further, why don't you read the last 20 posts in this thread or so?

Lol, I've been reprimanded by madshi

Am looking forward to your new NGU versions soft and extra extra soft for old laptops haha thanks again for your help today and have great night :-)

[madshi]

Originally Posted by pose

It happens with every video with 4:3 aspect ratio and resolution 640x480+.

I'm not sure if I have such a video at hand, could you maybe upload a very short/small cut of such a video?

Originally Posted by andybkma

Am looking forward to your new NGU versions soft and extra extra soft for old laptops

NGU Soft will have the same speed as NGU Sharp.

[pose]

Originally Posted by madshi

I'm not sure if I have such a video at hand, could you maybe upload a very short/small cut of such a video?

I think i figured it out. Anything with vertical resolution of 450+ pixels gets doubled by NGU AA and quadrupled by NGU sharp. Anything below x451 gets quadrupled by both NGU AA and NGU sharp. Aspect ratio doesnt matter. You can check it by creating image with desirable resolution in paint and then changing file's extension to .mkv.