ffdshow tryout project : HD audio discussion

[Skinleech]

Thanks guys.

I had forgotten about the EDID override, so that's useful.

With regarsd to the 5450 vs a higher specced card, useful info again. The one I've bought will be used for ver occaisional playback @60hz on a machine that is mostly used for TV storage. Performance is not much of an issue for that.

If I like how it works though, an ATI card might need to be purchased for the HTPC, and I would go for something beefier, as I would use the oppotunity to use something that gives me the required oomph to use Madvr as my renderer, which my 8300 chipset can't handle.

[Richardw322]

Everyone recomends the 5670 for full processing, wouldn't the 5570 work as well? Is it just a driver limitation?

[hoborg]

Originally Posted by nevcairiel

With Catalyst 10.4, the EDID Override is not necessarily needed anymore. It can still improve your expierence in some cases, but AMD/ATI fixed the issue that absolutely required the EDID override.

A note on the 5450.. It is powerful enough to decode up to 1080p at L5.1. However, to achieve this you might have to turn off some of the post-processing tasks. If you use the Enforce Smooth Video Playback options, it'll automatically turn those off. This includes the rather good vector adaptive deinterlacer, which imho, does a terrific job.

The lowest card that can run all post-processing while decoding is the 5670, at least according to the specifications coded into the Catalyst drivers.

Do you have any proof of that?

[nevcairiel]

Anandtech reviewed both the 5450 and the 5570, and came to the conclusion that both cards disable at least the Vector Adaptive Deinterlacer, if not even more post-processing. I believe they even confirmed their findings with AMD directly.

Remember that this is just a recommendation in the driver. You can turn off Enforced Smoth Video Playback, and it may still work perfectly. However AMD believes that the power of those cards is not enough to handle it in every case.

5450: http://www.anandtech.com/show/2931/4 (there was a bug in the CCC at the time of testing, its mentioned again in the 5570 article)
5570: http://www.anandtech.com/show/2935/3

[hoborg]

@nevcairiel:

That is exactly what i was thinking. Anandtech was testing 5450 on beta drivers and you are right, there was an bug it this beta drivers. Too bad they didnt correct thier article

I have 5450 in my HTPC and 5770 in my working PC - both are working without any isue including vector adaptive deinterlacing (i using it for LiveTV).

[nevcairiel]

The bug actually was that with ESVP enabled, it didn't show all features as disabled, that it actually did disable. But like i said, those are recommendations by AMD, you can turn ESVP off, and all the post-processing may work perfectly. They just don't guarantee it on those cards. ESVP is basically just an option that makes sure, that the card can provide smooth and flawless playback of any material, so it turns post-processing off on the lower models.

I rarely use interlaced material myself, so i'm still considering getting a 5450, just because its a passive card.

[Richardw322]

I read both those articles, that's why I ask. Anandtech seemed to think AMD was being too conservative.

Originally Posted by nevcairiel

Anandtech reviewed both the 5450 and the 5570, and came to the conclusion that both cards disable at least the Vector Adaptive Deinterlacer, if not even more post-processing. I believe they even confirmed their findings with AMD directly.

Remember that this is just a recommendation in the driver. You can turn off Enforced Smoth Video Playback, and it may still work perfectly. However AMD believes that the power of those cards is not enough to handle it in every case.

5450: http://www.anandtech.com/show/2931/4 (there was a bug in the CCC at the time of testing, its mentioned again in the 5570 article)
5570: http://www.anandtech.com/show/2935/3

[nevcairiel]

I just saw this quote in the article that kept me thinking a bit. They tested it with the 5450, and it seemed to work fine, however, apparently not for everyone. It was mostly just a fact that i wanted to get out here. If you watch alot of interlaced material (especially sports from 1080i broadcasts), its something you might have to consider.

Originally Posted by Anandtech

In our testing we didn’t notice any obvious playback issues with the 5450 or 5570 when we had ESVP disabled, but we’ve seen enough forum posts of this feature magically fixing poor video playback performance that we’re not confident enough to recommend disabling this feature. It’s something we think should be left enabled, at least for the time being.

I'll probably still get a 5450 (or a passive 5570 if i can find one). I mostly watch BluRays and proper HDTV in 1080p, not interlaced. The only interlaced material i currently have are some old tv series on dvd, but i'm sure it can handle that just fine

PS:
I actually found a 5670 thats passively cooled. The PowerColor Radeon HD 5670 Go! Green, anyone have any experience with either PowerColor, or this brand of cards specifically?

[fps]

I've read the whole thread now (took some time ) and it seems there is still no other way to handle audio dropouts while bitsreaming in software mode, other than disabling powerplay/setting the clocks manually for the 5xxx, right?

@albain: Could you please update your first post and fill in this post http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.ph...70#post1361670 where it is described how to get rid of those audio dropouts, thanks!

[Sebastiii]

Hi,

@fps : For audio dropouts, we must (again) make a ticket @ AMD support Drivers to hope that they solve this issue with PowerPlay !

Link to the Post that Albain give us the link of AMD Support

We have to re open a ticket to make pressure on AMD.

Thanks,
Seb.

[fps]

Originally Posted by Sebastiii

Hi,

@fps : For audio dropouts, we must (again) make a ticket @ AMD support Drivers to hope that they solve this issue with PowerPlay !

Link to the Post that Albain give us the link of AMD Support

We have to re open a ticket to make pressure on AMD.

Thanks,
Seb.

I'll definitely open a ticket with AMD once I get a new Radeon, which will be soon hopefully .

[Casshern]

I noticed a bug with jitter correction. If disabled ffdshow hangs on a lot dtsma tracks, only a couple of seeks gets it back to play the track (or in my case to extract the normal DTS core). If jitter correction is enabled, there are no such problems. This should not happen, it should work with the untampered timestamps.

[liquidskin76]

Originally Posted by Casshern

I noticed a bug with jitter correction. If disabled ffdshow hangs on a lot dtsma tracks, only a couple of seeks gets it back to play the track (or in my case to extract the normal DTS core). If jitter correction is enabled, there are no such problems. This should not happen, it should work with the untampered timestamps.

What splitter are you using? Haali or MPC Matroska?

Cheers

[rsd78]

Albain,

Any chance you could link to the issue of playing the DTS core of a DTS-MA track, I mentioned here: http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.ph...73#post1401773

Thanks!

[Casshern]

Originally Posted by liquidskin76

What splitter are you using? Haali or MPC Matroska?

Cheers

I am using the inbuild mpc m2ts splitter. The newest version of haali doesn't recognize many dts ma tracks ....

The bug is totally reproducable...something is weird in regard to ffdshows audio timestamp management. Jitter correction should have no influence on ffdshow playing a m2ts track.. (it should just reduce jitter)... but somehow without jitter correction, playback of dts cores does not work at all on some tracks.

[KLP]

I've got a Sapphire Vapor-X 5770 in my HTPC and have been suffering audio dropouts during movie playback (mostly mkv's playing in 7MC, using MPC's standalone splitter and ffdshow tryouts). I had very little hair left to tear out when I found this thread and discovered this is known issue; I'd already uninstalled and reinstalled, gone from x64 to x32 OS, tweaked filters, tried DIVX.... nothing worked.

Having read this thread, I currently have stable playback of most of my movies by getting the ffdshow DXVA video renderer to kick in (THANK YOU). But that doesn't work for stuff like iPlayer (in 'TunerFree MCE').

Unfortunately you guys are way ahead of me in technical understanding. The tweaks needed to disable PowerPlay are a bit beyond me. I have created a 'No Powerplay' profile in CCC 10.5 and the XML for it (from the '..<user>\Appdata\ATI\ACE\Profiles\' folder is below, but I have no idea what values to use... any chance someone could help me here? (I am not gaming on this box, so only need movie/video playback)

I have opened a ticket with AMD too.

Thanks.


- <Profile>
- <Caste name="Graphics">
- <Groups>
- <Group name="Overdrive5">
<Feature name="TimeUnlocked" />
- <Feature name="OverclockEnabled">
<Property name="OverclockEnabledProperty" value="True" />
</Feature>
<Feature name="AutoTuneSupport" />
- <Feature name="CoreClockTarget_0">
<Property name="Want_0" value="15700" />
<Property name="Want_1" value="60000" />
<Property name="Want_2" value="86000" />
</Feature>
- <Feature name="MemoryClockTarget_0">
<Property name="Want_0" value="30000" />
<Property name="Want_1" value="120000" />
<Property name="Want_2" value="120000" />
</Feature>
- <Feature name="CoreVoltageTarget_0">
<Property name="Want_0" value="950" />
<Property name="Want_1" value="1000" />
<Property name="Want_2" value="1125" />
</Feature>
- <Feature name="MemoryVoltageTarget_0">
<Property name="Want_0" value="0" />
<Property name="Want_1" value="0" />
<Property name="Want_2" value="0" />
</Feature>
- <Feature name="FanSpeedProtocol_0">
<Property name="FanSpeedProtocolProperty" value="Percent" />
</Feature>
- <Feature name="FanSpeedAlgorithm_0">
<Property name="FanSpeedAlgorithm" value="Automatic" />
</Feature>
- <Feature name="FanSpeedRPMTarget_0">
<Property name="Want" value="0" />
</Feature>
- <Feature name="FanSpeedPercentTarget_0">
<Property name="Want" value="50" />
</Feature>
</Group>
</Groups>
- <Adapter name="PCI_VEN_1002&DEV_68B8&SUBSYS_E147174B&REV_00_4&2FAE9228&0&0008A">
<Aspect name="Overdrive5" />
</Adapter>
</Caste>
</Profile>

[mremulator]

Hello to all... first post here, been waiting 5 days to post about this.

I'm also having problems with DTS, DTS-MA & DTS-MA (core only) with ffdshow (latest) Haali/Gabtest (latest).

Basically, I have 2 rigs... main rig = i7 920, Nvidia GTX280 (x3) & Sound Blaster PCI-E Titanium. HTPC = I3 530 & ATI HD5570.

Anyway, no matter what I do on my Nvidia rig (optical out to Denon AVR-1909 receiver) it will not play nice with DTS-MA (core only). The DTS light is on but I get no channels lit up/no sound, even with DTS HD unchecked in ffdshow. I also get drop-outs with a regular DTS track.

It seems that ffdshow and Haali/Gabtest seem not to be passing DTS MA (core only) from a MA track properly to the receiver via S/PDIF or HDMI??

However, I can get the full DTS MA track working on my Radeon 5570 rig (HDMI out to Pioneer LX60 receiver), but not core only (DTS HD unchecked in ffdshow). The DTS light goes bonkers on my Pioneer receiver and the audio cuts in and out rapidly. I also get drop-outs with a regular DTS track too on this machine.

As my Nvidia rig only has a standard soundcard (no HD audio) I can't watch an MKV with a DTS HD MA track (core only). As mentioned above, DTS also plays up on both rigs.

What is up with ffdshow/MKV splitters at the moment?

Thanks

[rica]

Originally Posted by mremulator

Hello to all... first post here, been waiting 5 days to post about this.

I'm also having problems with DTS, DTS-MA & DTS-MA (core only) with ffdshow (latest) Haali/Gabtest (latest).

Basically, I have 2 rigs... main rig = i7 920, Nvidia GTX280 (x3) & Sound Blaster PCI-E Titanium. HTPC = I3 530 & ATI HD5570.

Anyway, no matter what I do on my Nvidia rig (optical out to Denon AVR-1909 receiver) it will not play nice with DTS-MA (core only). The DTS light is on but I get no channels lit up/no sound, even with DTS HD unchecked in ffdshow. I also get drop-outs with a regular DTS track.

It seems that ffdshow and Haali/Gabtest seem not to be passing DTS MA (core only) from a MA track properly to the receiver via S/PDIF or HDMI??

However, I can get the full DTS MA track working on my Radeon 5570 rig (HDMI out to Pioneer LX60 receiver), but not core only (DTS HD unchecked in ffdshow). The DTS light goes bonkers on my Pioneer receiver and the audio cuts in and out rapidly. I also get drop-outs with a regular DTS track too on this machine.

As my Nvidia rig only has a standard soundcard (no HD audio) I can't watch an MKV with a DTS HD MA track (core only). As mentioned above, DTS also plays up on both rigs.

What is up with ffdshow/MKV splitters at the moment?

Thanks

DTSHD-MA: forget Haali first, you should use Gabest Matroska Source or new Solveig Matroska Splitter. (http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.ph...60#post1406460)

And it's not clear for me what you are using exactly?

1) main rig = i7 920, Nvidia GTX280 (x3) & Sound Blaster PCI-E Titanium with a Denon 1909
2) secondary rig= I3 530 & ATI HD5570 with a Pio? Correct?
We can't understand where you get the audio? over Clarkdale or external VGAs?
Do you use combo or not?
Do you use Edid override or not?

Pls have a look at this:

http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.ph...34#post1370134

And here you'll find here how to setup a combo: (I get video over my nVidia card while i get audio over my Clarkdale.)
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...5#post18348835

[mremulator]

Originally Posted by rica

DTSHD-MA: forget Haali first, you should use Gabest Matroska Source or new Solveig Matroska Splitter. (http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.ph...60#post1406460)

And it's not clear for me what you are using exactly?

1) main rig = i7 920, Nvidia GTX280 (x3) & Sound Blaster PCI-E Titanium with a Denon 1909
2) secondary rig= I3 530 & ATI HD5570 with a Pio? Correct?
We can't understand where you get the audio? over Clarkdale or external VGAs?
Do you use combo or not?
Do you use Edid override or not?

Pls have a look at this:

http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.ph...34#post1370134

And here you'll find here how to setup a combo: (I get video over my nVidia card while i get audio over my Clarkdale.)
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...5#post18348835

Hi,

Yes... on my HTPC (I3 530 / HD 5770) I'm using the Radeon's HDMI output (audio & video) to my Pioneer LX60 receiver (no override required). The Intel GPU is disabled and I have no intention of using it as it's not powerful enough (using shaders etc). Basically, all DTS audio tracks (unless using MPC HC + internal filters) suffer from drop-outs, despite having registered the standalone filters for WMP/WMC7 and disabling Media Foundation etc. I do not want to use MPC HC at the moment as there are problems with lip sync when I go from a window to a full screen (or vice-versa) or pause/un-pause. I've tried EVR, EVR Custom Pres. & EVR Sync... all do exactly the same. Also it does not integrate that well with Media Browser IMHO.

On my main rig (Nvidia GTX 280 Tri-SLI / Sound Blaster via optical out) I can't get DTS (core) from any DTS MA track. The DTS lamp is lit on my AVR-1909. However, only one channel lamp flickers and I get no audio. Again, no override is required as I'm using S/PDIF and not trying to bitstream HD audio.

[rica]

Originally Posted by mremulator

Hi,
On my main rig (Nvidia GTX 280 Tri-SLI / Sound Blaster via optical out) I can't get DTS (core) from any DTS MA track. The DTS lamp is lit on my AVR-1909. However, only one channel lamp flickers and I get no audio. Again, no override is required as I'm using S/PDIF and not trying to bitstream HD audio.

Here are the test files:

Originally Posted by rica

THD.m2ts:
http://www.mediafire.com/?jzmijuzgdq4

DTSHD.m2ts:
http://www.mediafire.com/?odmgz2ymd1j

Pls give it a go with this way:

http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.ph...25#post1406725

You will get core ac3 or just dts core with that setup.
Or if you re-tick THD or DTSHD boxes, you will get blue light back as well

BTW i'd suggest you to use combo systems if you have Giga mobos. Video over your VGA and audio over your Clarkdale.