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17th March 2019, 20:43 | #101 | Link | |
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Passthrough in madVR isn't misleading. If madVR isn't doing the tonemapping, it either reports to the display the original metadata (no measurements files) or the optimized metadata. You can ignore the measurements files if you want to keep them but not use them. The OS has nothing to do with this, and up until 398.11, it stays out of the process, as it should. If it's not a bug, it's certainly not desired for the OS to interfere with the content. If you're using the OS HDR, sure, but not if the player/game is using the NV HDR API. I certainly hope that this bug is fixed. MS can do whatever they want with their HDR implementation, which isn't useful for a video player unless you want to convert everything to HDR. This isn't an option for projector users as you can't use the same calibration for SDR and HDR without losing a lot of performance. By the way I went back to 397.93 because 398.11 occasionally leads my projector to detect HDR when I send SDR WCG. So for me the latest usable driver (as long as I want proper passthrough) is 397.93.
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17th March 2019, 21:15 | #102 | Link |
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My understanding is that the manufacturer-specific APIs for HDR are to be deprecated after HDR support was made official in Windows.
What support exists will not be removed because there are games which were made before HDR support was made official in Windows by Microsoft, but I guess they don't care to properly support it anymore. The DV stuff is certainly only possible by using the graphic card manufacturer APIs, however. |
17th March 2019, 21:49 | #103 | Link | |
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Nevcairiel (developper of LAV) said a bit earlier in the thread that it might be fixed in the next major branch in April. If you don't have any solid information, please refrain from posting
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18th March 2019, 21:38 | #104 | Link | |
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I think I posted references for what I said in this thread, btw. |
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18th March 2019, 22:24 | #105 | Link | |
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But if you want to keep posting on the subject, please go on, it's a free forum
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18th March 2019, 22:50 | #106 | Link |
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Actually I never stated any such thing. I actually think it would be beneficial to try to work with the OS, instead of around it.
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18th March 2019, 23:21 | #107 | Link |
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the point is a bug like this is unlikely to be fixed in a new driver which is mostly made for some new games unlike a new branch driver.
the nvidia HDR api is unlikely to leave anytime soon unlike 3D vision none windows 10 gaming isn't dead yet and the dx12 support for win 7 clearly shows old OS still matter so the API is still needed. |
18th March 2019, 23:30 | #108 | Link |
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Come on, you know you want to write some test code and send it to Manni so he can see if the metadata is being sent correctly. :P
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19th March 2019, 00:13 | #109 | Link | |
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Though it is true that you said you had a preference for things to work with the OS instead of around it. That doesn't mean that the NV API bug isn't a bug, or I completely misunderstood what you said. I offered to send a Vertex to Nevcairiel so that he could do all his tests but for some reason he didn't seem interested.
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19th March 2019, 00:30 | #110 | Link | |
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I don't even have a HDR display currently, so that would probably be a bit fruitless.
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19th March 2019, 17:13 | #111 | Link | ||
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Note that the Vertex is precisely meant for handling non HDR displays with HDR content. It can be configured to send the source any EDID, including telling it that the display is fully HDMI 2.0a / 600Mhz / HDR compliant. That allows you to get the source to send all the content and HDR metadata as if your display was HDR. You can then configure the Vertex to strip the HDR metadata, so you can activate/select an SDR calibration on your non-HDR screen, as well as downconvert the output so that it fits the bandwidth limits of your screen (for example changing resolution, chroma or bit depth to fit a 300Mhz limit). It's basically an Integral and a Linker combined, with a few more things on top. The only thing it doesn't do is converting the frame rate (I used an X4 for that temporarily to drive a display that didn't support 23p, I can send it to you as well if you need that). Yet, and that's the important part, you can still have the Vertex display in its OSD info the full incoming HDR metadata, even when it strips it so it doesn't reach your non HDR display. So you get to see exactly which HDR metadata a fully compliant HDR display would receive, even if you don't send it to your non-HDR display and downconvert/downscale the content for bandwidth or any other reason. If this makes any difference and would allow you to run your tests, or if at any point you get a HDR display, please get in touch by PM/email, and my Vertex will be on your way (provided I still have it!). If it doesn't help, you can always send it back to me. If it helps, then you can keep it (as a gift). I'm not using it currently as it's been replaced by a Maestro. If you don't need the decoded HDR metadata info on the OSD, I can send you my Integral (splitter) or my Linker (scaler). They give you the HDR infoframe in the GUI on a PC but they don't decode it (it's the raw data), so it's more time consuming for me to translate it, but it might suit a developper better! I also don't use them at the moment.
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21st March 2019, 10:26 | #112 | Link |
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Nvidia 419.67 Creator Ready Driver have been Released.
Going to check them tonight, maybe Manni will do first
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21st March 2019, 10:29 | #113 | Link |
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did someone try this driver:
https://www.nvidia.com/download/driv...ts.aspx/145411 this a driver with professional applications in mind like quadro cards. this driver aims to improve workloads with video applications like adobe premiere pro so correct video playback should be far more important. |
21st March 2019, 11:03 | #114 | Link | |
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[EDIT: unless someone reports any significant change, of course!]
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21st March 2019, 11:31 | #115 | Link |
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Me neither until a new GPU/TV (which won't happen tomorrow)
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21st March 2019, 13:37 | #116 | Link | |
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- HDR still only trigger when madVR is set to 10-bit - moving my mouse cursor disables HDR (this one is really annoying) I surely won't be buying another nvidia card until this mess gets fixed.... Last edited by j82k; 21st March 2019 at 13:45. |
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21st March 2019, 14:13 | #117 | Link |
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Thanks for reporting back, hopefully we get our fix in the next major branch which suppose to be released after Windows 10 april update aka 19H1.
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21st March 2019, 14:51 | #118 | Link | |
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21st March 2019, 15:43 | #119 | Link |
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21st March 2019, 21:30 | #120 | Link | |
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The short version: - applications that do not use fullscreen exclusive mode can not expect min/max/avg luminance values to be sent as-is to the display, because the Windows display compositor is the one that actually mixes the output of all the applications (some HDR, some SDR, each with their own settings) on a common surface, and the parameters of that surface are used to tonemap the content and get exposed to the display. - an application which does use fullscreen exclusive mode however, might be entitled to expect its min/max/avg values to be the one advertised to the display; this is the only case where the issue may be seen as a bug. - the presentation that I posted has the nVidia guy saying that turning HDR on changed with the release of Windows RedStone 2, which brought the initial HDR support in Windows; that doesn't mean the NvApi is not going to work anymore, but the path forward for proper support of HDR for windowed (borderless and not) applications is through the Windows DXGI API. - I did not "question" in a malicious way what you did, as you seem to have interpreted it; I wanted a clarification out of curiosity; the explanation that the driver was simply advertising an avg luminance fit for your projector would have been simpler to explain the low 20 nits value you noticed; but since you added afterwards that you are getting the same with a display monitor, then this simple explanation is not true. The references I have posted are very relevant and helpful. But you have to watch/read and understand them. If madshi or nevcariel find what I said to be wrong, they can easily speak against it themselves. I doubt they will have much to speak against of, though. |
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