Muxman - simple DVD authoring - Page 3

mrslacker · 9th December 2004, 22:39

Quote:

Originally posted by SeeMoreDigital
May I ask... what do the figures you've posted represent. Are they "seconds"?

Frame numbers.

SeeMoreDigital · 9th December 2004, 22:53

Quote:

Originally posted by mrslacker
Frame numbers.

Okay.. I understand.

In the past I've been used to creating "bookmark" files, to represent chapter points, that look like this: -

Quote:

But I reckon I can get used to frame numbers instead

Many thanks

Uruk-hai · 10th December 2004, 00:24

[QUOTE]Originally posted by jsoto
[B]@Uruk-hai
So please check with VobEdit to see if the subs are there. May be the problem is in the colour palette
QUOTE]

Subs are there and the color palette looks ok but still no subs when playing back:

Title Set (Movie) attributes:
Video: MPEG-2 704x480 (NTSC) (NTSC 525/60) (4:3) (not specified perm.display)
Audio 1: English (Mpeg-1 ) 2ch 48Kbps 16bps normal (ID: 0xc0)
SubPicture 1: Chinese (2-bit rle ) (ID: 0x20)
SubPicture 2: English (2-bit rle ) (ID: 0x21)
PG Playback mode = sequential
[000000a3] Still time in seconds 0 [00]
[000000a5] Color 0 Y Cr CB 40 109 240 [28 6d f0 ]
[000000a9] Color 1 Y Cr CB 81 240 90 [51 f0 5a ]
[000000ad] Color 2 Y Cr CB 16 128 128 [10 80 80 ]
[000000b1] Color 3 Y Cr CB 234 128 128 [ea 80 80 ]
[000000b5] Color 4 Y Cr CB 144 34 53 [90 22 35 ]
[000000b9] Color 5 Y Cr CB 106 221 202 [6a dd ca ]
[000000bd] Color 6 Y Cr CB 210 146 16 [d2 92 10 ]
[000000c1] Color 7 Y Cr CB 91 73 146 [5b 49 92 ]
[000000c5] Color 8 Y Cr CB 123 128 128 [7b 80 80 ]
[000000c9] Color 9 Y Cr CB 209 128 128 [d1 80 80 ]
[000000cd] Color 10 Y Cr CB 48 182 109 [30 b6 6d ]
[000000d1] Color 11 Y Cr CB 79 81 91 [4f 51 5b ]
[000000d5] Color 12 Y Cr CB 28 119 182 [1c 77 b6 ]
[000000d9] Color 13 Y Cr CB 97 207 207 [61 cf cf ]
[000000dd] Color 14 Y Cr CB 205 149 81 [cd 95 51 ]
[000000e1] Color 15 Y Cr CB 60 174 164 [3c ae a4 ]

jsoto · 10th December 2004, 00:38

@Uruk-hai
Sorry, I'm lost. But I can confirm your palete is the same than mine. My subs play fine and I see them red in powerDVD.

@SeeMoreDigital
If you are backing up a DVD you can get the original frame numbers in a "Celltimes.txt" file using IFOedit. Just select the PGC and from Menu Tools->Save Celltimes to a file

jsoto

mpucoder · 10th December 2004, 01:35

The colors are a default set of colors, since there is no color information in a .sup file.

I tried a Chinese and English set of subs, and on one player the Chinese played, as it was first. On another the English played, as it is my "preffered subtitle language", but I had to turn subtitles on.
Unless they are forced subpictures you may have to enable subs, Muxman adds no PGC commands to select a stream.

Uruk-hai · 10th December 2004, 03:41

Quote:

Originally posted by mpucoder
Unless they are forced subpictures you may have to enable subs, Muxman adds no PGC commands to select a stream.

I had selected the subs, both Chinese & English in PowerDVD but still nothing appeared before I posted my problem here,

The video stream came from CCE without closing the GOP. Does it matter? In the UI, I selected normal for sub1 & sub2.

MvB · 10th December 2004, 15:24

Hi,

that's a nice tool you've written there.
Couldn't test it because it crashes all the time when muxing.
It seems to crash when loosing focus and it does not respond after the green bar has reached 100%.
After killing it some time later there where all the files i needed except video_ts.ifo and video_ts.bup.
Recreated them whith ifoedit, but the muxed video seems to have problems at the beginning of cells. My DVD-Standalone stops there for about a second and continues to play after that. Strange.

I have a dual processor machine, could that cause the problem with muxman?

Thanks
MvB

mpucoder · 10th December 2004, 17:17

Don't stop it, it's not hung (which is what I assume you mean, rather than crash). Even though the progress bar is at 100% there is still more work to do. I'll be changing the progress bar to acknowledge that work as well. What Muxman is doing is backfilling all the NAV pointers. After that it creates the ifo files. If you interrupt it the vob files will be non-spec.

As for losing focus and then trying to regain it - Muxman doesn't periodically check for Windows messages while multiplexing, so it will not repaint its area.

mrslacker · 10th December 2004, 18:01

Any chance of multiple inputs in MuxMan? Or at least a recommendation for a quality joining program? Can I just "copy /B file1+file2 output" because m2v has no container? I've read the forums but most solutions feel like hacks. Sorry if I am getting off topic. I like to do things the right way. Thanks for helping a rookie!

[EDIT]Think I'll just join the vobs with VobEdit or the like. Also, all MuxMan vobs from my CCE encodes have worked in my standalone.[/EDIT]

mpucoder · 10th December 2004, 22:39

New version 0.3 is available here

Added another sub file and the buttons needed to assign 16:9 subs to their track and display mode.
The "short VOBU" has been fixed, although this should not have bothered very many people.

A hint for those using 16:9 subs - start with the first file. As you assign sub streams/files to tracks and display modes the streams/files below will have buttons greyed out to prevent double assignment. It is possible to assign a higher file/stream to a track/display mode combination used by a lower file, in which case the button of the lower file will be pushed but greyed. This is OK, the first file has precedence and took its place.

SeeMoreDigital · 11th December 2004, 14:45

Nice one... It's getting bedderer and bedderer!

Any thoughts about adding a third audio stream?

Also, when you select "About" to obtain the "About MuxMan" information window, the "White/Red X" close button does not function

Cheers

Trahald · 13th December 2004, 00:54

I did a mux with some low bitrate stuff (4 60 min episodes on 1 dvd-5) i muxed with scenarist. since i still had the files on the hd i had muxman take a shot with the original unprocessed file for episode 4. windvd played it smoothly but audio went out of sync slowly. muxman warned of underruns during mux. i'll try the encoded file later.

Code:

Opened video file D:\doit4\VTS01\VTS__01_P04.I-TFF.4~3_1.M2V, 1483355002 bytes.
Opened audio 1 file D:\doit4\VTS01\VTS__01_P04-80-384K-[-66]ms(fixed)-ch6English.AC3.
AC3 audio, frame size = 0x600.
Opened audio 2 file D:\doit4\VTS01\VTS__01_P04-81-96K-[-66]ms(fixed)-ch1Español.AC3.
AC3 audio, frame size = 0x180.
18:06:27 Begin multiplex.
P-STD buffer underflow by 1726 bytes at 133939572, sector 411340.
P-STD buffer underflow by 30577 bytes at 149495112, sector 459771.
P-STD buffer underflow by 11476 bytes at 180468054, sector 547935.
P-STD buffer underflow by 2722 bytes at 180513099, sector 548115.
P-STD buffer underflow by 1903 bytes at 180558144, sector 548285.
P-STD buffer underflow by 772 bytes at 180603189, sector 548458.
P-STD buffer underflow by 10029 bytes at 206558118, sector 623229.
P-STD buffer underflow by 8952 bytes at 263498001, sector 799777.
P-STD buffer underflow by 4415 bytes at 265969470, sector 806467.
SeqEnd at 586A1E15.
SeqEnd at 586A3376.
Bytes remaining in buffer = 72572.
18:17:10 End multiplex.
Fields: 182806, VOBU: 6148, Sectors: 832576.

<Edit> Ok.. muxed the encoded version with muxman. The encoded version (about 800mb video) results in 0 underflow warnings and plays in sync the whole length of the video. Just to be sure i remuxed the source video again with muxman and same issue.. wether playing it straight through or scanning, by the end of the show its about 3/4 second out of sync. scenarist muxes either source fine with 0 underflows and sync the whole way.

mpucoder · 13th December 2004, 16:08

Well, since it's not practical to send 1.4GB files, I came up with a way to convey the factors that influence the multiplex. MuxMan can now create a "profile" that conveys just the essential information so that I can analyze the failure. The total file size of this profile, called muxman.mxl, is 4*frames bytes, plus a little more for the audio factors. A more detailed explanation of the file created is here

To generate it you need the newest, ver 0.4, available here

Other changes since 0.3 are:
added bitrate stats to log (these also show in the success dialog box)
fixed potential crash (logging scoreboard)
fixed about dialog to close on "X" and alt-f4
added audio delay

@Trahald - if you don't mind, could you run that again with "make profile?" checked and send the file to muxman@mpucoder.com

@others - please don't flood me with profiles

I'm not looking to collect them. But if you have underruns and you are very sure there should not be any, then go ahead and make a profile. Send it along with the log to muxman@mpucoder.com so that I can find out why the multiplex failed.

Trahald · 13th December 2004, 19:08

done

mpucoder · 13th December 2004, 19:35

Thanks, now comes the fun part. I can see one thing right off, even though the average bitrate is low, the peak was 10.55Mbps. Even so, it obviously is short enough to handle. I just have to find out why MuxMan didn't.

In case anyone is wondering, the bitrates shown are not the multiplex stream, but from the player's buffers to the decoders. They reflect the data delivered in one VOBU divided by the total presentation time of the VOBU.

jptheripper · 14th December 2004, 02:33

Just a few thoughts

i have remuxed a number of times now and about half i forget to add the chapter list

anyway to get that moved to the main page?

other than that great program.. perfect output

Sir Didymus · 14th December 2004, 15:40

Excellent work mpucoder... really excellent.

I just performed some (very little and preliminar) compliancy checks against the following:

1. Verify that SCR timings are sufficiently apart (relative differences among contiguous packets > 146.xx 90 KHz ticks).

2. Verify that Vob Unit lenghts less than 0.4 seconds are absent.

3. Verify that STD buffer overflow events are not present (this is especially tricky, since the big majority of muxing and authoring tools I know are very strongly concerned about STD buffer underflows, but the same care about overflows is rarely present...).

I am very glad to report that all checks passed. I was especially surprised and impressed by the passing of the third check...

In the next days I will do some more (severe and complete...) compliancy checks. Your work deserves appreciation, and (on what I see) the authoring quality of the results of your program is already at a level comparable to the one of Scenarist...

Cheers,
SD

SeeMoreDigital · 14th December 2004, 16:22

Jeez... I wish I understood what Sir Didymus was talking about... but it sounds very important... so thank God it works

I've used v0.4, half a dozen times and it's worked perfectly even with importing chapters.

With regard to importing chapters, I would really find it helpful if you had choice of importing either by, "frame number" or by, "hh:mm:ss".

With regard to future releases. How difficult would it be to add an "audio/video window", so we could check the A/V and subtitle streams. And set our own chapter points?

Many thanks

mpucoder · 14th December 2004, 18:41

Well, I understood what Sir Didymus said, and am very pleased that someone has taken the time to make these checks and post them. And even if MuxMan fails the more stringent tests, I'd like to know.

Chapters, and other points along the timeline, will be getting much more detailed control. But for now, we have the humble chapter list. Allowing time/frame entries shouldn't be too difficult, so that should be in the next release. As for putting the file on the "main" (asset) page, it would only have to come off again once the timeline gets its own page.

A/V preview is a bit tricky, all I see is huge difficulties with other programs. Library mismatches, codecs missing, etc. And it's all very Windows specific (whereas most code in MuxMan is written for portability, with an eye toward Linux. That means there is no MFC, AFX, DDX, or the dreaded .NET framework). Eventually something will have to be there, but for now I concentrating on some different, hopefully more useful, things like bmp->mpeg I frame for menus.

And releases will slow down now that the engine appears to be stable.

bourtzovlakas · 14th December 2004, 18:42

Quote:

And set our own chapter points?

That is possible right now,just by altering the celltimes.txt....
You can set the chapter points by setting the corresponding frame number...
You can even import new chapter points or you can delete some of the existing ones.
Of course,i am not 100% sure that this action won't affect in any way the muxing,so if anyone disagrees,feel free to correct me....

10th December 2004, 00:38	#44 \| Link
jsoto Just a Member Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Spain Posts: 2,067	@Uruk-hai Sorry, I'm lost. But I can confirm your palete is the same than mine. My subs play fine and I see them red in powerDVD. @SeeMoreDigital If you are backing up a DVD you can get the original frame numbers in a "Celltimes.txt" file using IFOedit. Just select the PGC and from Menu Tools->Save Celltimes to a file jsoto __________________ Web sites with my tools http://download.videohelp.com/jsoto http://jsoto.posunplugged.com/

10th December 2004, 18:01	#49 \| Link
mrslacker Junior Slacker Join Date: May 2004 Location: End-World Posts: 296	Any chance of multiple inputs in MuxMan? Or at least a recommendation for a quality joining program? Can I just "copy /B file1+file2 output" because m2v has no container? I've read the forums but most solutions feel like hacks. Sorry if I am getting off topic. I like to do things the right way. Thanks for helping a rookie! [EDIT]Think I'll just join the vobs with VobEdit or the like. Also, all MuxMan vobs from my CCE encodes have worked in my standalone.[/EDIT] Last edited by mrslacker; 10th December 2004 at 18:21.

10th December 2004, 22:39	#50 \| Link
mpucoder Moderator Join Date: Oct 2001 Posts: 3,398	New version 0.3 is available here Added another sub file and the buttons needed to assign 16:9 subs to their track and display mode. The "short VOBU" has been fixed, although this should not have bothered very many people. A hint for those using 16:9 subs - start with the first file. As you assign sub streams/files to tracks and display modes the streams/files below will have buttons greyed out to prevent double assignment. It is possible to assign a higher file/stream to a track/display mode combination used by a lower file, in which case the button of the lower file will be pushed but greyed. This is OK, the first file has precedence and took its place. Last edited by mpucoder; 10th December 2004 at 22:43.

11th December 2004, 14:45	#51 \| Link
SeeMoreDigital Life looks better in HDTV Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: UK Posts: 10,009	Nice one... It's getting bedderer and bedderer! Any thoughts about adding a third audio stream? Also, when you select "About" to obtain the "About MuxMan" information window, the "White/Red X" close button does not function Cheers __________________ Still confused about anamorphic images? Then look here! \| Main Encoding Interests: Hardware device playback \| My Gear \|

13th December 2004, 19:08	#54 \| Link
Trahald Wewkiee Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: kashyyyk Posts: 2,114	done __________________ AAAArrrrrrggghhh!!!!

10th December 2004, 00:24	#43 \| Link
Uruk-hai Registered User Join Date: Aug 2004 Posts: 6	[QUOTE]Originally posted by jsoto [B]@Uruk-hai So please check with VobEdit to see if the subs are there. May be the problem is in the colour palette QUOTE] Subs are there and the color palette looks ok but still no subs when playing back: Title Set (Movie) attributes: Video: MPEG-2 704x480 (NTSC) (NTSC 525/60) (4:3) (not specified perm.display) Audio 1: English (Mpeg-1 ) 2ch 48Kbps 16bps normal (ID: 0xc0) SubPicture 1: Chinese (2-bit rle ) (ID: 0x20) SubPicture 2: English (2-bit rle ) (ID: 0x21) PG Playback mode = sequential [000000a3] Still time in seconds 0 [00] [000000a5] Color 0 Y Cr CB 40 109 240 [28 6d f0 ] [000000a9] Color 1 Y Cr CB 81 240 90 [51 f0 5a ] [000000ad] Color 2 Y Cr CB 16 128 128 [10 80 80 ] [000000b1] Color 3 Y Cr CB 234 128 128 [ea 80 80 ] [000000b5] Color 4 Y Cr CB 144 34 53 [90 22 35 ] [000000b9] Color 5 Y Cr CB 106 221 202 [6a dd ca ] [000000bd] Color 6 Y Cr CB 210 146 16 [d2 92 10 ] [000000c1] Color 7 Y Cr CB 91 73 146 [5b 49 92 ] [000000c5] Color 8 Y Cr CB 123 128 128 [7b 80 80 ] [000000c9] Color 9 Y Cr CB 209 128 128 [d1 80 80 ] [000000cd] Color 10 Y Cr CB 48 182 109 [30 b6 6d ] [000000d1] Color 11 Y Cr CB 79 81 91 [4f 51 5b ] [000000d5] Color 12 Y Cr CB 28 119 182 [1c 77 b6 ] [000000d9] Color 13 Y Cr CB 97 207 207 [61 cf cf ] [000000dd] Color 14 Y Cr CB 205 149 81 [cd 95 51 ] [000000e1] Color 15 Y Cr CB 60 174 164 [3c ae a4 ]

10th December 2004, 01:35	#45 \| Link
mpucoder Moderator Join Date: Oct 2001 Posts: 3,398	The colors are a default set of colors, since there is no color information in a .sup file. I tried a Chinese and English set of subs, and on one player the Chinese played, as it was first. On another the English played, as it is my "preffered subtitle language", but I had to turn subtitles on. Unless they are forced subpictures you may have to enable subs, Muxman adds no PGC commands to select a stream.

10th December 2004, 15:24	#47 \| Link
MvB dings! Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Under the roof? Posts: 197	Hi, that's a nice tool you've written there. Couldn't test it because it crashes all the time when muxing. It seems to crash when loosing focus and it does not respond after the green bar has reached 100%. After killing it some time later there where all the files i needed except video_ts.ifo and video_ts.bup. Recreated them whith ifoedit, but the muxed video seems to have problems at the beginning of cells. My DVD-Standalone stops there for about a second and continues to play after that. Strange. I have a dual processor machine, could that cause the problem with muxman? Thanks MvB

10th December 2004, 17:17	#48 \| Link
mpucoder Moderator Join Date: Oct 2001 Posts: 3,398	Don't stop it, it's not hung (which is what I assume you mean, rather than crash). Even though the progress bar is at 100% there is still more work to do. I'll be changing the progress bar to acknowledge that work as well. What Muxman is doing is backfilling all the NAV pointers. After that it creates the ifo files. If you interrupt it the vob files will be non-spec. As for losing focus and then trying to regain it - Muxman doesn't periodically check for Windows messages while multiplexing, so it will not repaint its area.

13th December 2004, 16:08	#53 \| Link
mpucoder Moderator Join Date: Oct 2001 Posts: 3,398	Well, since it's not practical to send 1.4GB files, I came up with a way to convey the factors that influence the multiplex. MuxMan can now create a "profile" that conveys just the essential information so that I can analyze the failure. The total file size of this profile, called muxman.mxl, is 4*frames bytes, plus a little more for the audio factors. A more detailed explanation of the file created is here To generate it you need the newest, ver 0.4, available here Other changes since 0.3 are: added bitrate stats to log (these also show in the success dialog box) fixed potential crash (logging scoreboard) fixed about dialog to close on "X" and alt-f4 added audio delay @Trahald - if you don't mind, could you run that again with "make profile?" checked and send the file to muxman@mpucoder.com @others - please don't flood me with profiles I'm not looking to collect them. But if you have underruns and you are very sure there should not be any, then go ahead and make a profile. Send it along with the log to muxman@mpucoder.com so that I can find out why the multiplex failed.

13th December 2004, 19:35	#55 \| Link
mpucoder Moderator Join Date: Oct 2001 Posts: 3,398	Thanks, now comes the fun part. I can see one thing right off, even though the average bitrate is low, the peak was 10.55Mbps. Even so, it obviously is short enough to handle. I just have to find out why MuxMan didn't. In case anyone is wondering, the bitrates shown are not the multiplex stream, but from the player's buffers to the decoders. They reflect the data delivered in one VOBU divided by the total presentation time of the VOBU.

14th December 2004, 02:33	#56 \| Link
jptheripper Registered User Join Date: Aug 2003 Posts: 913	Just a few thoughts i have remuxed a number of times now and about half i forget to add the chapter list anyway to get that moved to the main page? other than that great program.. perfect output

14th December 2004, 15:40	#57 \| Link
Sir Didymus Registered User Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Italy Posts: 864	Excellent work mpucoder... really excellent. I just performed some (very little and preliminar) compliancy checks against the following: 1. Verify that SCR timings are sufficiently apart (relative differences among contiguous packets > 146.xx 90 KHz ticks). 2. Verify that Vob Unit lenghts less than 0.4 seconds are absent. 3. Verify that STD buffer overflow events are not present (this is especially tricky, since the big majority of muxing and authoring tools I know are very strongly concerned about STD buffer underflows, but the same care about overflows is rarely present...). I am very glad to report that all checks passed. I was especially surprised and impressed by the passing of the third check... In the next days I will do some more (severe and complete...) compliancy checks. Your work deserves appreciation, and (on what I see) the authoring quality of the results of your program is already at a level comparable to the one of Scenarist... Cheers, SD

14th December 2004, 16:22	#58 \| Link
SeeMoreDigital Life looks better in HDTV Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: UK Posts: 10,009	Jeez... I wish I understood what Sir Didymus was talking about... but it sounds very important... so thank God it works I've used v0.4, half a dozen times and it's worked perfectly even with importing chapters. With regard to importing chapters, I would really find it helpful if you had choice of importing either by, "frame number" or by, "hh:mm:ss". With regard to future releases. How difficult would it be to add an "audio/video window", so we could check the A/V and subtitle streams. And set our own chapter points? Many thanks __________________ Still confused about anamorphic images? Then look here! \| Main Encoding Interests: Hardware device playback \| My Gear \|

14th December 2004, 18:41	#59 \| Link
mpucoder Moderator Join Date: Oct 2001 Posts: 3,398	Well, I understood what Sir Didymus said, and am very pleased that someone has taken the time to make these checks and post them. And even if MuxMan fails the more stringent tests, I'd like to know. Chapters, and other points along the timeline, will be getting much more detailed control. But for now, we have the humble chapter list. Allowing time/frame entries shouldn't be too difficult, so that should be in the next release. As for putting the file on the "main" (asset) page, it would only have to come off again once the timeline gets its own page. A/V preview is a bit tricky, all I see is huge difficulties with other programs. Library mismatches, codecs missing, etc. And it's all very Windows specific (whereas most code in MuxMan is written for portability, with an eye toward Linux. That means there is no MFC, AFX, DDX, or the dreaded .NET framework). Eventually something will have to be there, but for now I concentrating on some different, hopefully more useful, things like bmp->mpeg I frame for menus. And releases will slow down now that the engine appears to be stable. Last edited by mpucoder; 14th December 2004 at 18:44.

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