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Old 31st March 2003, 19:13   #1  |  Link
sh0dan
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Using ffvfw to create AviSynth AVI files

Apparently milan has been doing his wizardry again, and this time he has come up with an experimental AVI wrapper for AviSynth.

It is included in his "ffvfw" codec, and enables YV12 data to be passed to any application accepting AVI files.

I found some links to binaries:

[Removed - see below]

Milan says it is at an experimental stage so far, but so far it has worked fine for me.
You create a script - open the "makeAVIS" utility that is a part of ffvfw - open the script here and save the new AVI file. Now you should be able to open this AVI anywhere.

So far I have only tested YV12 colorspace, which milan suggests you to use. You might also have to force ffvfw to use RGB32 or RGB24 for programs like AfterEffects, etc. Open the codec configuration, select this in the "Decoding" tab.
Edit: It does however seem to be hard to get other than YV12 output working.


A thread in the XviD forum discussing ffvfw (although no AviSynth specific stuff).
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Old 31st March 2003, 22:08   #2  |  Link
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Sh0dan, thanks for mentioning this. I did a few preliminary tests with Vegas and unfortunately it has problems. With force input colorspace unchecked in the decoder tab it will load but Vegas doesn't grok YV12 so video is whacked. WIth RGB24 forced, it refuses to load at all, which surprised me.

Of all things, Windows Movie Maker 2 will load these fake files just fine. I don't have AfterEffects installed at the moment so I could not check there. Anybody got Premier installed and can check?
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Old 31st March 2003, 22:23   #3  |  Link
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I can't make After Effects work - it still got closer than anytime before - I'll see if I can fix it.
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Old 31st March 2003, 22:39   #4  |  Link
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VFAPI will serve to AfterEffects so maybe a comparison of the outputs might provide some useful info? I put some current links in the NLE forum that might save you some time if you want to try and don't already have it set up.
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Old 31st March 2003, 22:48   #5  |  Link
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Seems like AfterEffects will only properly decode RGB data, even though it claims to be able to open it. ffvfw still outputs YUV data - so I guess it doesn't force the output colorspace.

Probably quickly fixed by milan.
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Old 31st March 2003, 22:56   #6  |  Link
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Sh0dan, well that is why I am a bit confused. I used avisource ("fake.avi").info to open the fake.avi. Showed rgb24 when I checked force input color as RGB24 and showed YV12 when I unchecked it. So, the force input color space IS doing something, don't you think?
--------------------------------
@Milan, again thanks for this work!
When I loaded the fake.avi into CCE 2.5 it complained it could not find a handler for AVIS. Just goofing around I added vidc.avis=ffvfw.dll in registry. CCE then encoded although output was half duck doody green and sort of looked like the video in Vegas when it tried to open the fake.avi in YV12. Perhaps this is useless info, but we see this a lot with CCE and new codecs/handlers. For instance with avisynth 2.5, CCE complained about not being able to find a handler for YV12. Although it turned out to be better to use a ConvertToYUV2 statement in the script, setting vidc.YV12=Divx.dll allowed CCE to encode a Avisynth 2.50 script outputting YV12. Anyway, just some CCE background for you as I do not know if you use it or not.


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Old 1st April 2003, 13:46   #7  |  Link
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Thank you for testing makeAVIS.

I'm just downloading Adobe After Effects tryout and hopefully I'll able to make ffvfw compatible with it soon. I'll look for some Vegas demo version too.

@DDogg
I might modify ffvfw installer to add vidc.avis=ffvfw.dll to registry. AVIS would be fine, because AFAIK no other software uses this FOURCC (please correct me if I'm wrong, it's still time to change it).

I'll check the forcing of output colorspace too.

BTW there are still crashes when closing some players if ffvfw was used for decoding. I'm investigating this.
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Old 1st April 2003, 19:12   #8  |  Link
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milan, some folks (like me) would only use the filter for frameserving. Would it be possible for MAKEAVIS to allow the choice of initial colorspace? In effect, could it automatically do the reg change equivalent of config>decoding tab>force input color space>colorspace choice, and if possible, reflect the registry setting active when it is opened and in use? This would allow the frameserving tool to be more transparent to people not needing the full power of the filter. I hope you might consider this.
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Old 2nd April 2003, 07:46   #9  |  Link
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I think it's a good idea. It would require a change in fake AVIs header structure, but this shouldn't be a problem. I'll do this today. Perhaps I should try to work with link2 more to see which of its features would be useful in ffvfw too (except for sound support).
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Old 2nd April 2003, 10:44   #10  |  Link
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Actually it should be "easy" to copy audio uncompressed into the AVI file.
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Old 2nd April 2003, 10:49   #11  |  Link
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It may look strange, but I've never developed any application which would work with ACM in Windows, only the video. Maybe it's not difficult, but I'd have to start to learn it from the beginning.
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Old 9th April 2003, 12:24   #12  |  Link
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Quote:
Sh0dan, thanks for mentioning this. I did a few preliminary tests with Vegas and unfortunately it has problems. With force input colorspace unchecked in the decoder tab it will load but Vegas doesn't grok YV12 so video is whacked. WIth RGB24 forced, it refuses to load at all, which surprised me.

Of all things, Windows Movie Maker 2 will load these fake files just fine. I don't have AfterEffects installed at the moment so I could not check there. Anybody got Premier installed and can check?
I tried with Premiere 6.0. I used both YV12 and RGB32, but the image was screwed up in both cases. The upper part was black, and the lower part contained the clip (for YV12 the clip was also doubled, for RGB32 is saw it +/- eight folded) in purple/green.

Now I don't know whether Premiere requires RGB24 or RGB32, but I haven't tried RGB24 yet. I also noted there are two options in makeavis (forgot the names), what's the difference?
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Old 9th April 2003, 16:25   #13  |  Link
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As an update, I did some testing for Milan on a private build he did. That build worked in most of the colorspaces but was having trouble with YUV2. He said he is very busy at work doing a project for his company, but replied:
Quote:
I had problems with YUY2 output too. I don't know yet what's causing this. For debug purposes I'll implement some way how to get info about _real_ output colorspace. When I'll have more spare time, I'll look at it. In addition to this, I'd like to use AviSynth colorspace instead on current XviD ones for more conversions in ffvfw and then finally release ffvfw on SourceForge (I know I promised this week ago ).
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Old 10th April 2003, 15:35   #14  |  Link
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Thx, I will test it this weekend. Btw, your private mailbox is full.
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Old 10th April 2003, 15:43   #15  |  Link
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Thanks, cleaned up now.
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Old 10th April 2003, 18:26   #16  |  Link
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After battling ffvfw for almost an hour before getting it to compile, I can say the results are very promising. I got AviSynth video directly into After Effects, so I guess most other apps will also work now.

I'll ask in the XviD forum for a compile for you all to test.
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Old 10th April 2003, 20:25   #17  |  Link
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Did you use the source from his test build (or newer) or the one from above? I ask because the newer has the force colorspace built in to MakeAvi.

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Old 10th April 2003, 20:38   #18  |  Link
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A newer version from CVS - it allows to force output colorspace. Seems like A.E. will only read RGB24.
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Old 10th April 2003, 21:18   #19  |  Link
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Try it with no forcing checked. This loads fine into Vegas. That surprised me. Only other that worked was RGB24.
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Old 23rd April 2003, 09:17   #20  |  Link
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During last weekend I was experimenting with sound support in ffvfw. Now makeAVIS can store the audio stream in the "fake" AVI. This stream contains only sample numbers and ffvfw acts as ACM decoder and provides the actual audio data to the application. I've tested two clips with simple Avisynth scripts and they worked. Even when I extracted the audio stream to a separate wav file I was able to load it into the Cool Edit Pro 2.1.

Few questions to anyone who knows the ACM:
1. For format tag I've chosen the 0x3313 value. It's not used in MMReg.h file I've got. Is there some more up-to-date database of format tags?
2. ACMDRIVERDETAILS structure contains fields wMid and wPid. Now both are set to zero. Do I really have to obtain IDs from Microsoft before distributing the codec?

Thanks for help.

And as usual this is just experimental. This time _very_ experimental: not all ACM messages are handled nor all message flags.
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