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Old 19th February 2003, 04:05   #21  |  Link
bobby8798
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Quote:
Originally posted by neuron2
I guess you don't understand the significance of blended fields *in the source clip*, do you?
You are suggesting the field extraction is out of sync? Reversing the order may help this particular frame, but there could be a thousand of these in the entire movie, and they could be reversed again at any time. I think these blends are intentional, and the duration may be a few frames in some cases. I don't mind them either -- as long as they don't get corrupted during processing.

Or are you referring to Blend vs. Interpolate??

Decomb is the fastest de-interlacer that I've tested, and it would be nice to have this fixed by the time avisynth 3 is out so I can really use the speed advantage from YV12.

(Can't use YV12 now because of the DOT problem)

I will cut out that section of the VOB for your analysis.
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Old 19th February 2003, 04:11   #22  |  Link
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I'll await your VOB, have a look, and then answer your questions.
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Old 19th February 2003, 07:23   #23  |  Link
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OK, got your VOB and analyzed it.

Frame 18 has one field that is a strong blend of two pictures. The other field is also a blend but so slight you can pretend it isn't. You can prove this to yourself using SeparateFields().

Now, to deinterlace frame 18, one field will be used and the other interpolated from the used field. If the used field is the blended one, your deinterlaced frame will be a blend. If your used field is the non-blended one, the frame will be clean. So it is a matter of which field the deinterlacer uses. SmoothDeinterlacer got lucky, while FieldDeinterlace got unlucky. It all depends on which field the blend falls in, the top or bottom field.

The deinterlacers use a fixed choice of field for interpolating on. They don't have a way to identify a blended field and then avoid it.

You can make FieldDeinterlace do your VOB right by putting this first:

Crop(0,1,720,479)

This in effect makes it use the other field for interpolation. And now SmoothDeinterlacer gets it wrong, as expected!

Look at your whole movie. I'll bet you'll find the scene cut blends are sometimes in the top field and sometimes in the bottom field. If that is the case, then you'll find cuts that SmoothDeinterlacer will get wrong too.

If you find that the cut blends are always in the top or always in the bottom, please tell me. It will suggest that a new option for FieldDeinterlace may be in order: force interpolation on top/bottom.

Try to keep things in perspective, when the clip is played at normal speed, everything looks fine. You only object because you single step through the frames and see it.

Last edited by Guest; 19th February 2003 at 07:37.
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Old 19th February 2003, 07:32   #24  |  Link
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Oh, and here is SmoothDeinterlacer compiled for Avisynth 2.5 (RGB32 and YUY2 only).
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Old 19th February 2003, 12:19   #25  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally posted by neuron2
This in effect makes it use the other field for interpolation. And now SmoothDeinterlacer gets it wrong, as expected!
Even with tff=false ?

[EDIT]Crop(0,1,720,479) will fail in AviSynth2.5 due to crop restrictions.[/EDIT]
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Last edited by hakko504; 19th February 2003 at 12:21.
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Old 19th February 2003, 13:05   #26  |  Link
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Why is MPEG2DEC3 0.94 included in the decomb package?
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Old 19th February 2003, 14:15   #27  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally posted by hakko504
Even with tff=false?
Yes. The filter uses the tff parameter only to determine the temporal order of the fields, not to select the field to interpolate on. Even if it did, it would still get half the cuts wrong if they are distributed in both fields.

Quote:
Crop(0,1,720,479) will fail in AviSynth2.5 due to crop restrictions
It doesn't fail, but you can use Crop(0,1,720,478). The point is to remove one line from the top.

Last edited by Guest; 19th February 2003 at 15:29.
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Old 19th February 2003, 14:22   #28  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally posted by sh0dan
Why is MPEG2DEC3 0.94 included in the decomb package?
Just haven't updated it yet. But that DLL is equivalent to the 1.0 release. EDIT: Website release updated with mpeg2dec3 1.00.

Now my question for you: why does your plugin package not include the Decomb help file? That's a rather serious omission isn't it? Please add the help file ASAP. Thank you.

Last edited by Guest; 19th February 2003 at 15:18.
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Old 19th February 2003, 21:41   #29  |  Link
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neuron2,

Crop(0,1,720,479) makes a difference when Blend = OFF.

But, when Blend = ON, Decomb has the corrupted patches regardless of the Crop(0,1,720,479) setting. Smooth Deinterlacer has NO corruptions whatsoever.

When Decomb is used with Blend=ON, check his eyes, mouth and ears. Those patches do not occur with Smooth Deinterlacer. You may have to change the settings (brightness, contrast?) on your monitor to see them. I am using 800x600, 32Bits.


Thank you for re-compiling Smooth Deinterlacer.
I will try it out.
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Old 19th February 2003, 21:55   #30  |  Link
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I do to all this work for you and you don't bother to answer my questions.

Do your blends occur in only the top or bottom field or are they distributed between both?

I will check your other point when I get home this evening. Again, please do not talk about "corruption". It is meaningless. What are you seeing around those areas when blend is On and the crop is done?

I can tell you that SmoothDeinterlacer *is* making a blend for frame 18. It is just very faint.

Last edited by Guest; 20th February 2003 at 01:22.
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Old 20th February 2003, 00:48   #31  |  Link
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Looked over 2000 Fields

The Blend fields are random

Sometimes odd, sometimes even.

The "corrupted" areas are patches of red, green, and blue? lines.
You have to see the sample for yourself.

Blend ON, no Crop, patches around his eyes, mouth, and ear. Patches all over her face.

Blend ON, with Crop (shifted), more patches on his face, but from another field. Patches all over her face that is more apparent than from before.

The patches are similar, but not identical.
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Old 20th February 2003, 01:11   #32  |  Link
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I just noticed your dthreshold (=50!) is WAY WAY too high. Where the heck did you pull that from???? That is why you see some combing.

Try the default 9 or lower and then report back.

Anyway, if the blends are random, neither deinterlacer is going to fix them all. You can't even see them at normal speed so why are you obsessing about it?

One last question. Did you read and understand the help file? Is there something confusing in there that I can improve?

Last edited by Guest; 20th February 2003 at 01:21.
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Old 20th February 2003, 04:25   #33  |  Link
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dthreshold=20 lots of lines are visible
dthreshold=9 some lines are still visible, but much better
dthreshold=1 99% clear !!

Thanks for answering the question about the dthreshold setting.

I'm just testing the filter to find a comfortable setting that won't de-interlace too harshly. It was during the testing phase that I found those lines. I won't be stepping through each frame once a setting is found.

Your help file is VERY l o n g and looks like it covers everything. Good Job! I will probably only use FieldDeinterlace, and later read the other parts when required.

Your help file: dthreshold (0-255, default 9)

Maybe you can add:
At what value of dthreshold does the de-interlacing esentially become ineffective ? Maybe 30?, eventhough the numerical value goes up to 255

Can you modify decomb to increase the de-interlacing whenever blend fields of that nature is encountered, and resume normal processing afterwards ?

Thanks a lot for looking into this neuron2
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Old 20th February 2003, 04:43   #34  |  Link
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>dthreshold=1 99% clear !!

That's way too aggressive. If you like strong, probably 5 is good. If you go too low, you might as well capture one field and then resize. You're not getting any benefit out of the algorithm.

>Maybe you can add: ...

That's a good idea. I'll do it in the next release.

>Can you modify decomb to...

That's very difficult and complicated for a small gain.

>Thanks a lot for looking into this neuron2.

Glad to be of assistance.
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Old 1st April 2003, 12:48   #35  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally posted by neuron2
>dthreshold=1 99% clear !!

That's way too aggressive. If you like strong, probably 5 is good. If you go too low, you might as well capture one field and then resize. You're not getting any benefit out of the algorithm.
@neuron2

I was searching around and stumbled upon this thread. I'm currently using fielddeinterlace(full=false, dthreshold=3) on a series. Would you say that is too high too?

I found the number 3 by comparing 1 and 5. 1 was clean while 5 still had some soft lines left. I tried 3 and the lines were gone so that's what I'm using (only on this particular series, normally I use default 9).

Any general comments? Is it normal that different materials require different dthreshold values?

Also, is it very hard to understand how dthreshold works? If it is, you needn't bother, but if it isn't I'd appreciate any information or links you could give me.
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Old 1st April 2003, 12:55   #36  |  Link
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The dthreshold parameter is like the threshold parameter of my VirtualDub Smart Deinterlace filter. With the latter, you can see the effect of different values by enabling the "Show motion areas only" option. The next release of Decomb will add this option to allow you to properly set dthreshold. In general, I would consider that if you go below 5, you are getting very little benefit from the adaptive algorithm.
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Old 1st April 2003, 13:03   #37  |  Link
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Thanks for your reply. I'll check your VirtualDub Smart Deinterlace filter and see what I'll find.
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Old 30th December 2005, 23:55   #38  |  Link
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hi neuron2, i know this is an old thread, but could you please post a link to smooth deinterlace plugin for avisynth 2.5x? thanks!
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Old 31st December 2005, 00:52   #39  |  Link
Wilbert
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SmoothDeinterlacer: http://www.geocities.com/wilbertdijk...erlacer_25.zip
I don't have this Area plugin.

Last edited by Wilbert; 31st December 2005 at 00:56.
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Old 31st December 2005, 01:49   #40  |  Link
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thankyou very much wilbert, much appreciated

should i be using this, do you think? is there a newer deinterlacer that can do the job better?

by the way, i'm looking to output to 50fps, from 25fps interlaced

Last edited by futurex; 31st December 2005 at 03:25.
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