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Old 25th February 2016, 09:41   #36481  |  Link
nevcairiel
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Originally Posted by Arm3nian View Post
Why is this even being discussed here. Let's go flood the lav thread instead. Onward brothers!
You know the forum allows you to create your own threads for entirely unrelated discussions.
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Old 25th February 2016, 10:18   #36482  |  Link
Warner306
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Originally Posted by Manni View Post
Sorry, you are pretty wrong

UHD Bluray encoded with Dolby Vision (all Sony titles, Warner as well I think, Fox is the only one skipping on both Dolby Vision and immersive audio on their initial releases, which is why I'm boycotting them) provide a 10bits HDR10 layer for compatibility with non Dolby Vision displays, and an optional Dolby Vision layer which adds 12bits bit depth using a 1080p layer. Dolby Vision is part of the UHD Bluray specs, it's just an optional layer. Only HDR10 is mandatory.

Dolby (who created PQ gamma) states that 12bits is the minimal bit depth to resolve 4K/UH in PQ Gamma/WCG/HDR without any banding. With HDR10, there is still banding in the picture, especially in the low end.

Of course Dolby could be saying this to justify Dolby Vision, which is why I said "according to Dolby".

Bottom line in no meaningful content will be available in 8bits. UHDTV requires 10bits rec709 minimum, and UHD Bluray requires 10bits as well, WCG or not, and supports 12 bits with Dolby Vision.

Although the new JVCs don't support Dolby Vision, they offer a 12bits path from the input to the panels, hopefully in preparation for Dolby Vision support. The main value of Dolby Vision at this stage is that unlike HDR10, it's possible to calibrate a display accurately with Dolby Vision. Unfortunately it requires hardware support in the source and the display, and a pay-for license.

Of course someone with an 8bits, rec-709 display doesn't care about this, but in that case upscaling bluray is probably a better idea anyway.

Probably time to get back on topic, I'm sure Madshi has better things to do than reading all this in his thread...
I see. Wouldn't this just be the metadata layered on top of the 10-bit source? Or is the entire pipeline 12-bits?

At any rate, is it possible to decode Dolby Vision with madVR, or is this proprietary to select TV manufacturers?
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Old 25th February 2016, 12:18   #36483  |  Link
David
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What do i need to watch hdr with madVR if my TV is 10 bit and WCG?

- Last LAV nightly build
- Setting madVR ex. fullscreen+d3d11+10 bits and (?) DCI P3 in set is already calibrated
- Maximizin luminance and contrast TV setting(?)
- Setting TV WCG
- Ajusting madVR nits

With this settings i think madVR will send 10 bits DCI P3 (REC 2020) with dinamic range compressed to luminance settings. Am i correct?

What about PQ EOTF (ST 2084)? What does madVR with it?

Last edited by David; 25th February 2016 at 12:21.
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Old 25th February 2016, 12:23   #36484  |  Link
nijiko
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I've a long time no watching FHD films.
Is there some problem with Intel videocard driver for Win10 now? (HD4600 and newest 4380 driver)
It's heavy tearing with MPC-HC svn 101 + LAV 67.134 + madVR 90.12 in Win10 10586.104.

Addon:
The same settings in Win8.1, there is no problems.
And in Win10 now, if I use NV card, there is no problems, too.

Last edited by nijiko; 25th February 2016 at 12:30. Reason: Addon
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Old 25th February 2016, 12:40   #36485  |  Link
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hi guys, i want buy and use a gtx 970 only for madvr but my processor is Intel i3 3110M (dual core 2.4Ghz), Madvr use only gpu? Is possibile this or is cpu limited?
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Old 25th February 2016, 12:52   #36486  |  Link
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Originally Posted by starlight2 View Post
hi guys, i want buy and use a gtx 970 only for madvr but my processor is Intel i3 3110M (dual core 2.4Ghz), Madvr use only gpu? Is possibile this or is cpu limited?
Yup. You're very limited with using your onboard GPU.
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Old 25th February 2016, 13:05   #36487  |  Link
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so the CPU is used anyway? I am currently using graphics card GT610, use only 1080p and use bilinear 100 + AR + SuperRes and the cpu is only used 10%
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Old 25th February 2016, 13:16   #36488  |  Link
Sunset1982
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hi guys, i want buy and use a gtx 970 only for madvr
I would wait till summer when next GPU generation will be released... it will be more power efficient and more powerful with support for HDMI 2.0a, HDR and HEVC 10 bit decoding...
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Old 25th February 2016, 13:19   #36489  |  Link
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depends.

but in most cases you have to scale the image more which could be slower.

and removing blackbar without resizing the image is unreliable so you can really take advantage of the performance boost.
I'm seeing an insignificant performance boost so I've decided to just disable "crop black bars".

Half of the time I don't even understand why madVR is scaling, so I guess I'm better off not using that feature, LOL. For example, because of the scaling, some videos even end up playing under a different/unexpected madVR profile (i.e. not the profile that would be used if "crop black bars" was disabled).

Last edited by Uoppi; 25th February 2016 at 13:28.
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Old 25th February 2016, 13:21   #36490  |  Link
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Originally Posted by Warner306 View Post
I see. Wouldn't this just be the metadata layered on top of the 10-bit source? Or is the entire pipeline 12-bits?

At any rate, is it possible to decode Dolby Vision with madVR, or is this proprietary to select TV manufacturers?
No, as I said it's not just metadata, Dolby Vision achieves 12bits on top of the UHD HDR10 mandatory layer with a 1080p layer which is used to recreate the UHD 12bits original bitdepth.

Dolby Vision is only supported if both the source and the display have the necessary hardware and license. This is what makes third party HDR calibration possible, because the characteristics of every licensed display features in a Dolby maintained database, shared with licensed calibration software companies. With HDR10, each manufacturer does what they want - and seems unwilling to share what they do exactly - as there is no standard defined for consumer playback (although the ITU might publish something in the next few months).

As MadVR isn't tied to any display (it does what a display manufacturer does, but it's not doing it to any fixed target) and doesn't support HDR passthrough yet, I don't think it's possible to license it for its current HDR to SDR conversion feature.

When/if MadVR handles HDR metadata passthrough (which Madshi has indicated will not happen until there is HDR support at GPU/Driver/API level, so not until this summer with Arctic Islands at best), it might be possible to do something if the display supports Dolby Vision. But honestly, it looks like a lot of work for a minimal benefit for most people.

I leave it to Madshi to answer this question in more details, but it might be difficult for him to do so at this stage as there is little technical information publicly available on Dolby Vision if you're not a licensee.
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Last edited by Manni; 25th February 2016 at 13:26.
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Old 25th February 2016, 14:46   #36491  |  Link
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Originally Posted by Sunset1982 View Post
I would wait till summer when next GPU generation will be released... it will be more power efficient and more powerful with support for HDMI 2.0a, HDR and HEVC 10 bit decoding...
Thank you, but i want buy and use now :P
Guys Help me?
Your processor, what percentage of use have when working with madVR?
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Old 25th February 2016, 15:51   #36492  |  Link
Uoppi
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Thank you, but i want buy and use now :P
Guys Help me?
Your processor, what percentage of use have when working with madVR?
From my experience, CPU doesn't matter much.

I've got a 1080p TV and GTX 960 with a dual-core Ivy Bridge Pentium from 2013 (cost me around ~60 euros new) and the use percentage gets higher on the graphics card than CPU when maxing out with madVR settings. In other words CPU has never been the bottleneck in my use.

If you want to game on your HTPC, that's a completely different matter of course. But I've been very happy with my GTX 960. I can use at least NNEDI32 for luma on all upscaled material (not 1080p supersampling though!) Power efficiency seems fine, comes with HEVC hardware decoding and fans remain idle most of the time (and even when fans turn on, they're completely inaudible on the MSI card from my viewing position less than 2 m away).

Last edited by Uoppi; 25th February 2016 at 16:01.
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Old 25th February 2016, 16:04   #36493  |  Link
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Originally Posted by starlight2 View Post
Thank you, but i want buy and use now :P
Guys Help me?
Your processor, what percentage of use have when working with madVR?
As Uoppi said, if you don't want to play games with it (or don't need that amount of power) AND want to buy something now (which I don't) then I'd vote for 960, although it's less powerful than 970 but it has 4k 10bit HEVC full acceleration (so your current cpu will be enough).
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...rce_900_Series
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Old 25th February 2016, 16:54   #36494  |  Link
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I'm using the 960 too for upscaling 1080p mkv to 4k. This is a great card for HTPC use and for the price. I would buy a 960 and maybe upgrade later this year and maybe sell this card again.
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Old 25th February 2016, 18:17   #36495  |  Link
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Thank you guys, i want use graphics card only for MAdvr+SVP (smooth video Project) at the same time
I want to improve only mkv to 1080p and would like to use the best possible settings to obtain the best possible picture. I own a VPR JVC RS10, has a type of soft image. I would like to strengthen the image as much as possible.
I did not understand whether it is better to take a 960 or a 970 !?
Thank you so much advice!
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Old 25th February 2016, 18:57   #36496  |  Link
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Originally Posted by starlight2 View Post
Thank you guys, i want use graphics card only for MAdvr+SVP (smooth video Project) at the same time
I want to improve only mkv to 1080p and would like to use the best possible settings to obtain the best possible picture. I own a VPR JVC RS10, has a type of soft image. I would like to strengthen the image as much as possible.
I did not understand whether it is better to take a 960 or a 970 !?
Thank you so much advice!
Then 970 (or 980 if you have enough money).
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Old 25th February 2016, 19:28   #36497  |  Link
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Then 970 (or 980 if you have enough money).
Yes, madVR and SVP both want your GPU resources. Get as much power as you can afford.

EDIT: Be sure to turn off madVR's Smooth Motion when using SVP. You'll free up significant resources.

Last edited by jkauff; 25th February 2016 at 19:31.
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Old 25th February 2016, 23:37   #36498  |  Link
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Off-topic, but wow.... ripping with HEVC produces BETTER image quality at HALF the size than ripping with medium-high quality h.264, but at the same time it seems kind of a tiny bit smoother-smeared looking, different from h.264, with less noise for sure.\

Is HEVC expected to become the future for both 4K and 1080p content? That leaves everyone without GTX 950/960 at a pretty big disadvantage unless they plan on upgrading GPU when Pascal and AMD's new cards come out...

Last edited by XMonarchY; 25th February 2016 at 23:40.
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Old 25th February 2016, 23:52   #36499  |  Link
Warner306
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Off-topic, but wow.... ripping with HEVC produces BETTER image quality at HALF the size than ripping with medium-high quality h.264, but at the same time it seems kind of a tiny bit smoother-smeared looking, different from h.264, with less noise for sure.\

Is HEVC expected to become the future for both 4K and 1080p content? That leaves everyone without GTX 950/960 at a pretty big disadvantage unless they plan on upgrading GPU when Pascal and AMD's new cards come out...
It is already the future for 4K content and rips that might one day result from 4K content (4K -> 1080p).
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Old 26th February 2016, 00:29   #36500  |  Link
nevcairiel
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Originally Posted by XMonarchY View Post
Off-topic, but wow.... ripping with HEVC produces BETTER image quality at HALF the size than ripping with medium-high quality h.264, but at the same time it seems kind of a tiny bit smoother-smeared looking, different from h.264, with less noise for sure.
Most people consider the loss of detail by smoothing a bad property of a compression. But thats what HEVC does when you lower bitrate, other codecs artifact, HEVC smoothes details to make compression easier.
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