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Old 15th April 2012, 23:12   #1621  |  Link
IanB
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A thought, dropping the sample rate from 48kHz to 32kHz changes the Nyquist frequency from 24kHz to 16kHz. If the process does not low pass the source then aliasing may occur. A 16.5kHz signal will appear as a 15.5Khz signal. I imagine special signals with significant spectral elements around the 16kHz range are going to be quite spoilt.
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Old 16th April 2012, 02:10   #1622  |  Link
setarip_old
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A point of information - One of the four titles stated by "MRCOCOset" to have generated Cinavia messages, the "Hugo" ("Hugo and his Invention"?) Blu-ray disc, is NOT noted to have Cinavia:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cinavia

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Old 16th April 2012, 02:36   #1623  |  Link
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Perhaps certain regions of "Hugo" have it? Universal has had a few select releases with Cinavia.
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Old 16th April 2012, 04:29   #1624  |  Link
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@omegaman7

I have found NO indication anywhere that "Hugo" for ANY region contains Cinavia protection...
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Old 16th April 2012, 06:40   #1625  |  Link
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Interesting. I wonder if his listing "Hugo" as a sample of cinavia, was an oopsy LOL! Perhaps Hugo was simply on his mind when he was listing the titles he tested
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Old 16th April 2012, 08:51   #1626  |  Link
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Just to quickly note - That Wikipedia page on which movies contain Cinavia is not completely accurate, for example I can tell you that the DVD releases of 'The Social Network' and 'The Adventure of Tintin' DO NOT contain Cinavia. If you have these DVDs you can check for yourself. Neither one has the required AACS folder on the disk. People post inaccurate things on Wikipedia all the time, sigh...

I find that the DVDFab list here:

http://blog.dvdfab.com/cinavia-protection.html

Is more accurate (100% so, I believe) is updated regularly, and includes more info including Studio name & etc....

-xenex

EDIT: I am not affiliated with DVDFab in any way, I just find that list a MUCH better source of info on what releases contain Cinavia.
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Old 16th April 2012, 18:49   #1627  |  Link
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I would like to ask people who own Playstation 3 (with latest firmware) or BD-player with cinavia enabled firmware to test these samples.

DO NOT REWIND WHILE PLAYING!

ORIGINAL
AC3 file (provided by user watermarking from videohelp.com)
http://paste2.org/p/1981582

Attack method: Resampling
http://dl.dropbox.com/u/27599202/Cin...pling_32khz.7z
http://dl.dropbox.com/u/27599202/Cin...pling_40khz.7z
http://dl.dropbox.com/u/27599202/Cin...pling_44khz.7z

Attack method: Low Pass Filter 16khz
file will be uploaded tomorrow

Attack method: HE-AAC 320kbps
file will be uploaded tomorrow
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Old 16th April 2012, 18:59   #1628  |  Link
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Grabbing the 32 and 40 samples now. I don't believe 44 will make a difference as I resampled when i made my test file that I use to test players with. My personal feeling is that resampling will not solve this particular issue. Will have the results of these files in a while.

EDIT: I can't get my PS3 to play that file and don't have a lot of time to mess with it right now. Hopefully someone else can look at it.
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Last edited by SamuriHL; 16th April 2012 at 19:35.
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Old 16th April 2012, 20:42   #1629  |  Link
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@Atak_Snajpera ps3 don't have support for he-aac...
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Old 16th April 2012, 20:44   #1630  |  Link
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i meant original to he-aac and then to ac3.
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Old 16th April 2012, 20:45   #1631  |  Link
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I tried making an AVCHD out of the 32 sample and putting it on a memory stick but my PS3 is being stubborn about reading it. Oh wait....I may know why. Do they need to be in a video sub-folder on the ps3?
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Old 16th April 2012, 20:49   #1632  |  Link
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maybe multiavchd could help.
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Old 16th April 2012, 20:52   #1633  |  Link
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No, it was just what I said. The PS3 requires a VIDEO folder. Now I can play the file directly and/or the AVCHD I made. So it's running now. I'll see how it goes.
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Old 16th April 2012, 21:13   #1634  |  Link
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32Khz sample at 21:18 triggers the Cinavia content message code 3.
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Old 17th April 2012, 06:17   #1635  |  Link
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@xenex

Hi!

1) As I said in my earlier post, I was unable to find an indication ANYWHERE of a "Hugo" BD containing Cinavia protection - including the DVDFab listings

2) You state, "I can tell you that the DVD releases of 'The Social Network' and 'The Adventure of Tintin' DO NOT contain Cinavia. If you have these DVDs you can check for yourself. Neither one has the required AACS folder on the disk." You may or may not be correct. Also noted (by an asterisk) in the DVDFab listings is the fact that, although a U.S. release may contain Cinavia protection, releases for other regions by different studios (Warner, Universal, etc.) may not contain Cinavia.

BTW - It appears that the source material used by "MRCOCOset" may be "cams" and/or other non-original, commercial discs - which might explain why his/her "Hugo" contains Cinavia protection...(Reference to this appears to have been deleted)

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Old 17th April 2012, 08:30   #1636  |  Link
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setarip_old-

No disagreement from me. I also was unable to find any use of Cinavia on the "Hugo" movie, either BD or DVD. I believe as you do that poster "MRCOCOset" is talking about "camrip" files. That's a whole other issue than official BD or DVD releases.

As for 'The Social Network' and 'The Adventure of Tintin' DVDs, mine do NOT have the required AACS folder. People in other regions are free to check their disks for the presence of such. I speak only for myself. I personally believe that only the seven DVD releases listed on the DVDFab list above contain Cinavia.

And technically, I just don't see this re-sampling working to remove Cinavia. There are two aspects to any audio. The "Frequency Domain" - call it X, and the "Time Domain" - call it Y. Cinavia is primarily in Y. The "Time Domain." Short term, spread spectrum echoes. It's not just a "tone" or "frequency" to remove. It's tiny echoes over the entire audio spectrum.

-xenex

Last edited by xenex; 17th April 2012 at 08:35.
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Old 17th April 2012, 13:10   #1637  |  Link
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Somewhere tin tin contains cinavia because the samples posted are from a DVD copy of it...audio only of course. And the resampled version I grabbed and tested tripped cinavia message 3, which as we know only shows up on commercial discs. In any case I didn't believe resampling would work either as I did plenty of that on the losers. Changing formats, resampling, removing channels...none of that affects cinavia. Still it was easy enough to try.

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Old 17th April 2012, 15:37   #1638  |  Link
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Last attempt
AC3 -> HE-AAC 192kbps -> AC3 192kbps
http://dl.dropbox.com/u/27599202/00000.7z
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Old 18th April 2012, 19:01   #1639  |  Link
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Atak just a question did you removed the previous files or did dropbox ?
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Old 21st April 2012, 12:54   #1640  |  Link
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Quote:
Originally Posted by setarip_old View Post
@SamuriHL

Hi! In addition to your PS3, did you try playing this on a (any) standalone BluRay player(s)?

1) It would be a good idea for someone to try a BD-RB-compressed version on PS3s and standalones (As I stated, my equipment predates the protection). Although the audiostream(s) would be unaltered, it would be interesting to see whether the changed correlation to videoframes might impact the watermark detection.

2) As a point of information, I did not hear or see anything unusual at the 20:03 point when playing back the video on my equipment - so I'd guess that customer complaints about the protection "interfering" with or diminishing playback quality for ALL players would fall on deaf ears.

3) Did anyone else notice a strange visual glitch at somewhere around the 9:30 mark of the movie. As the helicopter rises, a 2 dimensional green graphic appears briefly and seems to be "pulled up" to the helicopter. I woder if this could possibly have something to do with the protection...
What if you changed the Original Lossless audio track timecode from 23.967 to 24 and did the same to the video to keep it in sync, would that work?

And if that dosen't work, we need to stop fooling around and build an app that will download a list of movies with a list of each and every Cinavia beep, and remove them from the audio.

There are two ways we can do that, we can either analyze each track the whole time and find out if the beeps are systematic, if they are, we can choose to only include the original beep time code and the frequency of the beeps, to save time.

Last edited by marcusj0015; 21st April 2012 at 12:58.
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