Deshaker by Gunnar Thalin - Page 12

guth · 13th June 2010, 17:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by Boulder

What sort of improvements are expected to be in the next version? I'll start working on the second passes of my projects and was wondering whether I should wait a while for the new release?

The changes for pass 1 will make it possible for that pass to become more robust.
For pass 2, you will be able to use future frames without having to delay audio, append clips etc. The actual output from pass 2 will be the same, however.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Boulder

It would be nice to have limits for horizontal and vertical corrections in pixels so that I could enter a value that I know I can live with (for example I've measured that my TV has approximately 16 pixels of overscan).

The best way to control how big the borders will be (or to make them completely dissappear under overscan) is to select an "edge compensation" mode that gives no borders and then zoom out using an "extra zoom factor" below 1 ( ((width_or_height - 16) / width_or_height) to make borders dissappear under overscan in your case).
You can then use the smoothness settings and correction limits to find a good balance between motion smoothness and the amount of edge compensation zooming needed to get the amount of borders you wanted.

Undead Sega · 14th June 2010, 03:22

Hello guth, thanks very much for the suggestion but during the past couple days, i have tried what you've said and ive tried everything else with no luck, therefore i was still wondering if you can help me with it:

http://www.megaupload.com/?d=G98LVF0E

was hoping if you could have a go with it and see if you get any good results. Hope its okay

guth · 14th June 2010, 21:38

I'm afraid I can't really deshake that clip either. There's too little detail in the background, and the details that are there are mostly straight lines, which are "unmatchable". A feature based matching algorithm would probably do better in this case. Deshaker uses area based matching. Sorry...

guth · 14th June 2010, 21:40

Boulder, in case you care, the formula I gave above should probably be ((width_or_height - 32) / width_or_height) instead, since I guess you meant 16 pixels on each side...?

Undead Sega · 14th June 2010, 23:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by guth

I'm afraid I can't really deshake that clip either. There's too little detail in the background, and the details that are there are mostly straight lines, which are "unmatchable". A feature based matching algorithm would probably do better in this case. Deshaker uses area based matching. Sorry...

Damn, and i thought i was doing something terribly wrong. Probably a feature based matching algorithm might be your next feature for Deshaker?

regarding this, what image stabilization software could probably deshake my footage?

Boulder · 15th June 2010, 03:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by guth

Boulder, in case you care, the formula I gave above should probably be ((width_or_height - 32) / width_or_height) instead, since I guess you meant 16 pixels on each side...?

Yes, I meant ~16 pixels on each side. Thanks, I'll see how it works when I get to run the second passes some time this week

guth · 15th June 2010, 18:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by Undead Sega

regarding this, what image stabilization software could probably deshake my footage?

Don't know...

Undead Sega · 16th June 2010, 02:27

fair enough, however I came across Mokey by imagineer systems which uses their 2.5D planes to track footage and etc. and if i am correct, you can also export that tracking data into After Effects. May i ask, could something rom that software be used in the logfile for Deshaker?

guth · 16th June 2010, 17:41

The Deshaker logfile contains the change (in pannaing, rotation and zoom) between one frame and next frame. I don't know what that software can produce.

Undead Sega · 17th June 2010, 01:19

This:

any of it looks familiar by any chance?

Undead Sega · 21st June 2010, 19:37

take it what you saw doesnt look familiar or useful?

poisondeathray · 21st June 2010, 20:21

planar trackers (like mocha and mokey) and point trackers (like AE) work differently than deshaker. They don't report the difference between subsequent frames (one frame and the next) like deshaker does. They track difference between a reference frame or x,y,z position and rotation/scale/sheer etc.., ie. where you set the point tracker or 2d plane . The reason is they are more geared for compositing work and they need precision against a specific reference point (e.g you want to replace an object in a movie, like a poster with another poster etc...)

You could translate them I suppose, if you made a program and converted the numbers to make them differences between consecutive frames

guth · 22nd June 2010, 19:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Undead Sega

take it what you saw doesnt look familiar or useful?

I've told you what Deshaker wants. Now it's up to you to see if you can get those values from somewhere else. (I'm definitely not saying it's impossible. I just don't want to do the work myself.

)

dedfish · 2nd July 2010, 20:15

Any recommendations specifically for vehicle, motorcycle in my case, mounted videos? Are there particular settings that would work better for high speed movement?

guth · 3rd July 2010, 09:20

I know a lot of people seem to be using Deshaker for those kind of videos, but it's not really designed to handle videos where the camera "moves around", at least not where it moves very fast. Deshaker can only handle panning, rotation and zoom. That said, I've seen some very good deshaked videos of that kind.

As always, make sure you're using a high enough shutter speed, if possible. There shouldn't be any motion blur in each frame.
Also, you would probably get *a lot* better results if the camera didn't have a rolling shutter. But I believe most helmet mounted cameras today have a rolling shutter. Deshaker can remove rolling shutter effects but only if the shaking isn't extreme.
I would also recommend trying to stabilize only on the most distant parts in the frames, since the "moving inwards"-effect is less there. You can do that by ignoring the other areas.
And turn off zoom smoothing by settings zoom smoothness to 0. You will also need to change the edge compensation type if you do that. Start with "None", maybe.
Finally, you should probably increase the value for "discard motion of blocks that move > X pixels in wrong direction". That's to allow the blocks to move "freely" a little, since Deshaker can't handle the "moving inwards"-effect.

But maybe you should ask someone who's actually stabilized these kind of videos. I haven't.

dedfish · 3rd July 2010, 17:59

Thanks, I appreciate you taking the time to answer my question.

If anyone else has any tips they've found to work well for this type of video I would love to hear them.

Cheers!

Undead Sega · 9th July 2010, 03:27

Hello once again guth, it is I

I am actually still having problems trying to deshake my footage, I have created a new image sequence from the original, but this time it was deinterlaced using TGMC to 50p and I removed the noise using Neat Video resulting me with a (slightly sharp but) clean image, I dont know if that is going to make any differences?

...but I have been trying it with formentioned software, but it is not as effective as your filter, especially when it comes to border filling, wouldnt you happen to know of other software or filters that can literally do what your filter does interms of borderfilling effectively?

Also, you say your filter uses area based matching, is this something that is limited in ur filter or in Avisynth? Possibly there could be an avisynth filter that uses a more sosphisticated algorithm for the searching of the footage (and possibly be used in Deshaker)?

guth · 9th July 2010, 09:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by Undead Sega

I am actually still having problems trying to deshake my footage, I have created a new image sequence from the original, but this time it was deinterlaced using TGMC to 50p and I removed the noise using Neat Video resulting me with a (slightly sharp but) clean image, I dont know if that is going to make any differences?

Me neither. But removing noise can be very bad for Deshaker if the smoother uses some kind of temporal smoothing. That kind of smoothing often leaves traces of earlier frames that Deshaker can match on, incorrectly.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Undead Sega

wouldnt you happen to know of other software or filters that can literally do what your filter does interms of borderfilling effectively?

No, I don't. But I haven't been looking much either.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Undead Sega

Also, you say your filter uses area based matching, is this something that is limited in ur filter or in Avisynth? Possibly there could be an avisynth filter that uses a more sosphisticated algorithm for the searching of the footage (and possibly be used in Deshaker)?

I'm not sure I understand your question. The matching algorithm is inside Deshaker. You can't change it without me doing something.
Could there exist filters with a more sophisticated search algorithm? Sure, but Deshaker can't use it without me doing something. Unless it can produce logfiles for Deshaker pass 2.

guth · 19th July 2010, 12:36

Deshaker 2.5 is now released.
(New versions don't seem to come very often lately, so I thought I should mention it.)

Get it here.

2Bdecided · 12th August 2010, 12:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by guth

Deshaker 2.5 is now released.
(New versions don't seem to come very often lately, so I thought I should mention it.)

Get it here.

Thank you!

You should post this in the news section.

Cheers,
David.

17th June 2010, 01:19	#230 \| Link
Undead Sega Registered User Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 713	This: any of it looks familiar by any chance? Attached Images

19th July 2010, 12:36	#239 \| Link
guth Registered User Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Uppsala, Sweden Posts: 157	New version of Deshaker Deshaker 2.5 is now released. (New versions don't seem to come very often lately, so I thought I should mention it.) Get it here.

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14th June 2010, 03:22	#222 \| Link
Undead Sega Registered User Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 713	Hello guth, thanks very much for the suggestion but during the past couple days, i have tried what you've said and ive tried everything else with no luck, therefore i was still wondering if you can help me with it: http://www.megaupload.com/?d=G98LVF0E was hoping if you could have a go with it and see if you get any good results. Hope its okay

14th June 2010, 21:38	#223 \| Link
guth Registered User Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Uppsala, Sweden Posts: 157	I'm afraid I can't really deshake that clip either. There's too little detail in the background, and the details that are there are mostly straight lines, which are "unmatchable". A feature based matching algorithm would probably do better in this case. Deshaker uses area based matching. Sorry...

14th June 2010, 21:40	#224 \| Link
guth Registered User Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Uppsala, Sweden Posts: 157	Boulder, in case you care, the formula I gave above should probably be ((width_or_height - 32) / width_or_height) instead, since I guess you meant 16 pixels on each side...?

16th June 2010, 02:27	#228 \| Link
Undead Sega Registered User Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 713	fair enough, however I came across Mokey by imagineer systems which uses their 2.5D planes to track footage and etc. and if i am correct, you can also export that tracking data into After Effects. May i ask, could something rom that software be used in the logfile for Deshaker?

16th June 2010, 17:41	#229 \| Link
guth Registered User Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Uppsala, Sweden Posts: 157	The Deshaker logfile contains the change (in pannaing, rotation and zoom) between one frame and next frame. I don't know what that software can produce.

21st June 2010, 19:37	#231 \| Link
Undead Sega Registered User Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 713	take it what you saw doesnt look familiar or useful?

21st June 2010, 20:21	#232 \| Link
poisondeathray Registered User Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 5,550	planar trackers (like mocha and mokey) and point trackers (like AE) work differently than deshaker. They don't report the difference between subsequent frames (one frame and the next) like deshaker does. They track difference between a reference frame or x,y,z position and rotation/scale/sheer etc.., ie. where you set the point tracker or 2d plane . The reason is they are more geared for compositing work and they need precision against a specific reference point (e.g you want to replace an object in a movie, like a poster with another poster etc...) You could translate them I suppose, if you made a program and converted the numbers to make them differences between consecutive frames

2nd July 2010, 20:15	#234 \| Link
dedfish Registered User Join Date: Jun 2010 Posts: 2	Any recommendations specifically for vehicle, motorcycle in my case, mounted videos? Are there particular settings that would work better for high speed movement?

3rd July 2010, 09:20	#235 \| Link
guth Registered User Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Uppsala, Sweden Posts: 157	I know a lot of people seem to be using Deshaker for those kind of videos, but it's not really designed to handle videos where the camera "moves around", at least not where it moves very fast. Deshaker can only handle panning, rotation and zoom. That said, I've seen some very good deshaked videos of that kind. As always, make sure you're using a high enough shutter speed, if possible. There shouldn't be any motion blur in each frame. Also, you would probably get a lot better results if the camera didn't have a rolling shutter. But I believe most helmet mounted cameras today have a rolling shutter. Deshaker can remove rolling shutter effects but only if the shaking isn't extreme. I would also recommend trying to stabilize only on the most distant parts in the frames, since the "moving inwards"-effect is less there. You can do that by ignoring the other areas. And turn off zoom smoothing by settings zoom smoothness to 0. You will also need to change the edge compensation type if you do that. Start with "None", maybe. Finally, you should probably increase the value for "discard motion of blocks that move > X pixels in wrong direction". That's to allow the blocks to move "freely" a little, since Deshaker can't handle the "moving inwards"-effect. But maybe you should ask someone who's actually stabilized these kind of videos. I haven't.

3rd July 2010, 17:59	#236 \| Link
dedfish Registered User Join Date: Jun 2010 Posts: 2	Thanks, I appreciate you taking the time to answer my question. If anyone else has any tips they've found to work well for this type of video I would love to hear them. Cheers!

9th July 2010, 03:27	#237 \| Link
Undead Sega Registered User Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 713	Hello once again guth, it is I I am actually still having problems trying to deshake my footage, I have created a new image sequence from the original, but this time it was deinterlaced using TGMC to 50p and I removed the noise using Neat Video resulting me with a (slightly sharp but) clean image, I dont know if that is going to make any differences? ...but I have been trying it with formentioned software, but it is not as effective as your filter, especially when it comes to border filling, wouldnt you happen to know of other software or filters that can literally do what your filter does interms of borderfilling effectively? Also, you say your filter uses area based matching, is this something that is limited in ur filter or in Avisynth? Possibly there could be an avisynth filter that uses a more sosphisticated algorithm for the searching of the footage (and possibly be used in Deshaker)?