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Old 22nd March 2002, 13:32   #1  |  Link
DJ Bobo
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Ultimate IVTC settings?

Hi everybody!
I've been transcoding Anime for a long while now. I tested GreedyHMA, Decomb & IVTC 2.2

I've found that IVTC 2.2 delivers the best results with the following settings:
ivtc(32,11,110)

That gives so far smooth and clean output of every difficult scene I've seen til now.

I want to ask you to test these settings and see if they work universally on any hard scene you know. If it doesn't work properly, please try to find better settings, or give me an alternative setting in another ivtc plugin.

thank you!
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Old 22nd March 2002, 14:33   #2  |  Link
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IVTC22 fails on (for example) "Tenchi The Movie 2". It also fails on much of the Cowboy Bebop material.

Decomb is also having trouble with Tenchi (as are all other IVTC programs). I hope to improve its behavior in the next release.
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Old 23rd March 2002, 00:24   #3  |  Link
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Havn't you find good settings for those two?

I mean, tweaking the different settings helps much, my goal is to find a setting that works perfectly with any source.
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Old 23rd March 2002, 16:54   #4  |  Link
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>my goal is to find a setting that works perfectly with any source

If there were such settings, don't you think the program author would have made them the immutable defaults?
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Old 23rd March 2002, 18:59   #5  |  Link
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That's excatly the point: with the recommended settings in the help file, I get almost in every Anime some jerky output. And I kept optimizing the parameters and I found til yet, that (32,11,110) work very good (a lot better than the recommended settings, "perfect" may be!), that's why I was asking if there are scenes where IVTC fails with this parameters, in hope to optimize further if it's possible or if it is needed
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Old 23rd March 2002, 21:24   #6  |  Link
Milkman Dan
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Quote:
Originally posted by neuron2
IVTC22 fails on (for example) "Tenchi The Movie 2". It also fails on much of the Cowboy Bebop material.

Decomb is also having trouble with Tenchi (as are all other IVTC programs). I hope to improve its behavior in the next release.
Decomb did a pretty good job on TMiL2, as I just ripped it the other day. Granted, there is still some artifacting around mouths and such at times, but considering the 'telecining' is awful to begin with, I think it did rather admirably.

For the Tenchi OVA's, eps' 1-6, Decomb does fine with the default settings, as does IVTC 2.2. Episodes 6 and 7 have a screwed field order, which Decomb handles by specifiying reversed fields. IVTC2.2 handles it just fine with the default settings. 8-13 are fine so far as I've done them.


But hey, if you're lookin' to improve the output, I'm certainly not going to complain. ; )
I own TMiL 1 and 2, and the OVA's on DVD, so if you need me to run tests on unreleased builds, feel free to drop me an email. Should be in my profile.

EDIT: Nevermind. This isn't one of those forums. email is jhickman at parallaxmedia dot net

Last edited by Milkman Dan; 23rd March 2002 at 21:26.
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Old 24th March 2002, 14:21   #7  |  Link
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@ Milkman Dan
Perhaps you misunderstood me, I just want to find the right parameters, since I can't change the code (I'm no programmer).
With the default settings of IVTC, I got almost in every anime some bad output. So I adapted the parameters every time, and I've come til now to (32,11,110) that gives me very nice output with the difficult scenes I've seen til now (I'm collecting them )

You may test those parameters with difficult scenes in Tenchi Movie 2 und reply here if you want. You may try to find better parameters if it doesn't work properly.
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Old 24th March 2002, 20:29   #8  |  Link
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Erm...I wasn't replying to you, I was replying to neuron2, and pretty much exclusively to what he said...
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Old 25th March 2002, 08:06   #9  |  Link
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@bobotns:

what was ivtc2.2 again? wasnt that old Wiz's IVTC routine used as default in gknot?

can you list here some of the anime sources you think that setting will work best for (dvd region included)?

(mmm, i am sceptical about that post, i have several decomb settings for several sources i have (which i believe work best). i have some source where you gotta make a field drop to make things work smooth(no avisynth dlls, tmpeg only and tons of tweaking). and here comes that guy and claims he found an ultimate setting for each anime out there using old tool.)
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Old 25th March 2002, 11:22   #10  |  Link
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Hi OUTPinged_

Where you been hiding?

Yeah-IVTC 2.2 is from The Wizard. His version 2.1 is the one included in GKnot.
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Old 25th March 2002, 11:25   #11  |  Link
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It's not the same routine as in GKnot. GKnot uses version 1.x or something, which is slow and brings lot of shit.

I tested IVTC 2.2 with parameters (32,11,110) on:
1) Some of the Dragon Ball Z US-DVDs
2) the US-DVDs of "Arc The Lad"

I have a lot of other Anime but they were made with worse settings or with other ivtc plugins like GreedyHMA and Decomb.

I'm going to test the newest parameters on the HK-DVDs of Saint Seiya in the next days.
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Old 25th March 2002, 16:30   #12  |  Link
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Hi-

According to the Inverse Telecine Readme found in the Docs folder with GKnot, it's version 2.1. Maybe 2.2 is a big step forward.
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Old 25th March 2002, 22:44   #13  |  Link
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bah.

at least the one in gknot didnt feature smart deinterlace of frames detected as interlaced.

i have tested 2.1(or was it 2.0) myself and it left me a pretty bad memory. no deinterlacing, no guidance, dumb field selection algo.

cmon, it didnt ever detect film content properly on scenechanges for half of anime dvds i have got. i aint talking about pure 30fps sequences at all.

how old is that 2.2 version anyway?

PS> it doesnt even begin with "de", end with "mb" and have "co" in the middle. now will you believe me ? =)

\o/

mamono, i may be wrong for that guidance thresh after all. with clear source it seems you can go up to 90 and be pretty safe, well maybe a couple of interlaces at gay scenechanges will slip through.
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Old 25th March 2002, 23:53   #14  |  Link
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@ Outpinged
Changing the parameters helps a lot, it blows decomb away! with the settings (32,11,110) I get fantastic results and it's faster than Decomb!
I tested also the new parameters with the first episode of Saint Seiya, absolutely fantastic results!

If I find a scene, where those parameters don't catch, I'll report it here.
I'm collecting the difficult scenes so that I can find a universal setting that works with all of them!
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Old 26th March 2002, 04:10   #15  |  Link
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In my experience, Decomb was a great deal faster than IVTC 2.2. About 50%, in fact.

That was on my K6-3 though. Perhaps it's an optimization thing.

All things equal though, I see Decomb as a more versatile solution. And it's actively developed. Wizard is poking around again though, and is talking with neuron2, so perhaps we'll see some code integration. Until then though, I'm sticking with Decomb.
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Old 20th May 2002, 19:10   #16  |  Link
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Almost 2 months now and it comes now to an end: my settings (32,11,110) aren't universal anymore
I found an Anime that doesn't ivtc well with my old settings, because it is really bad telecined (captured from LaserDisc or something).

BUT!
Here are the new settings that I found and that work well with that problematic anime and with my collected "difficult to IVTC" videos:

ivtc(60,11,110)

As always using the old good IVTC 2.2 (you find this on the Doom9 download page)

Please try this brand new setting and tell me if it works well with your favorite problematic anime.
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Old 23rd May 2002, 06:41   #17  |  Link
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Tired of try :(

I try to encode the FLCL DVD(anime) 01 and:

1) IVCT22 nop
2) GreedyHMA not full tested but nop
3) with decomb I use:

Telecide(Post=true,Blend=False,Guide=1,Gthresh=44,Threshold=20,Chroma=True,dthreshold=12)

When use the default "Telecide()" decomb deinterlace some good frames and this is very noticeable, also the motion is not so smooth, when I use guide=1 the smooth is much better(perfect) but in some escenes the guidance is not accurate, the why for Gthresh=44, perhaps when I raise Gthresh escenes with small interlace (some mouths) pass the filter also if I use Post=true.

The question is: anyone have any sugerence for this dvd or other ivtc method (I really don`t want do it with Tmpeg manually )

and excuse the bad english/grammar/errors

Thanks
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Old 24th May 2002, 10:51   #18  |  Link
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Almost 2 months now and it comes now to an end: my settings (32,11,110) aren't universal anymore

*sigh*

they were not from the very beginning.

there are no "universal" settings. how many dvds have you tested that setting with? 3-5? test it with 100 anime dvds and only then claim it "universal".
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Old 24th May 2002, 13:41   #19  |  Link
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@ outpinged
Let me count for you: about 70 DVDs! the last one didn't work with (32,11,110), so I tweaked it again to (60,11,100).
Please don't bother me anymore, you have always something to say when I post my settings.
If you wanna help to find better settings than mine, you're welcome. If not, please don't look into this thread.
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Old 24th May 2002, 17:56   #20  |  Link
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uum.. bobotns, I tried these settings for the first time with a DVD that was giving me a lot of interlaced mouths no matter what settings I used in decomb. Anyway Vampire Princess Miyu R1 is no good with these settings. I'd find better ones.. but I think I'll just stick with decomb, ya know?
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