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Old 27th May 2007, 14:39   #41  |  Link
tebasuna51
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SealTooGreat View Post
You didn't understand me. I was referring on unnecessary Elektra999's mixing SC into SL&SR before feeding it to encoder.

You mean to obtain adequate mix before encoding and than set the flag? Isn't it encoder job to set adequate mix and flag at encoder time?
But seems the ac3 pro encoder in SoundForge 9 don't accept 7 channels (6.1), only 6 (5.1). Then the mix proposed is a workaround to obtain 5.1 EX without a true 5.1 EX encoder.
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Old 27th May 2007, 22:12   #42  |  Link
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^That's^ why I've said V.I enough. I didn't say that Elektra999's workflow is wrong. And workaround can also be just deleting SC, too.
Do you know any EX encoder who will except 7 channels?
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Old 28th May 2007, 15:33   #43  |  Link
Elektra999
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Hello
SealTooGreat,
This is a File.test DD EX of 7 channels: FL, FR, CENTER, LFE, SL, SR., SC. Worked with Sony Sonud Forge 9, to-3dB channel SC.

Thank you Tebasuna51 for the file.test
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Old 28th May 2007, 20:58   #44  |  Link
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I don't get it what this File.test has to prove? (although is working fine)
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Old 26th August 2007, 09:22   #45  |  Link
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Now im a little bit confused

Quote:
Originally Posted by SealTooGreat View Post
Direct Information from http://www.dolby.com
Dolby Digital EX
Dolby Digital Surround EX

Taken from www.yamaha.co.jp
Dolby Digital EX:
Dolby's latest surround format, this is Dolby Digital with an added center rear channel. The rear center channel is actually matrixed into the two rear channels, and is extracted upon playback. (Formerly called Dolby Digital Surround EX, or Dolby Digital Matrix 6.1.)

...so DD EX = DD Surround EX ...and EX is just matrix-encoded flag and nothing more.

Conclusion, if you want to encode to DD EX you only need 5+1 ch, 'cause DD EX sound mix is not encoded as true 6.1 audio. In DD EX capable encoder select: "Digital Surround EX encoded". Depending on your decoder(if it's EX certified) and speaker configuration (6.1 or 7.1) you will get EX 6.1 or EX 7.1 surround, respectivelly, during playback.
Help me to understand...2 Questions :

1. When i decode DD EX to wave i get 6 mono Waves, right ?
L R C LFE SL SR, Or is it possible to decode it to 7 mono waves ?

2. When i want encode DD EX ,i need "6 mono waves" as Source .Theres no real phy. SC Channel. The Source is only L R C LFE SL SR
Then simply set the EX Flag and the Matrix "generates" a SC Channel from SL/SR by using psycoacoustic filters ?

- "OR" is there a "real" phy. SC Channel wich will be "5.1" matrix encoded into SL SR .So i need "real" 7 Channels as Source .
The i set the Encoder to EX and the 5.1 Output is encoded with SC into SL SR ? The Decoder "extract" the SC to 6.1 Output while Playback?

What is correct 1 or 2 ?

PS,
Sry for my bad English

Last edited by ACrowley; 26th August 2007 at 09:49.
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Old 26th August 2007, 10:50   #46  |  Link
tebasuna51
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@ACrowley (BC = Back Center an so on)
At first time you need a source with 6.1 channels then:

6.1 -> (matrix encode BL-BC-BR -> BL'-BR') -> 5.1 -> (AC3 EX encode) -> ac3 5.1 EX

The encode have two phases and the decode is similar:

ac3 5.1 EX -> (AC3 decode) -> 5.1 -> (matrix decode BL'-BR' -> BL-BC-BR) -> 6.1

1) Of course you can obtain 7 mono waves if apply the two phases (maybe with PowerDVD or similar) because you need play the 7 channels also in PC not only with a receiver.

If you decode with azid or NicAc3Source only obtain 6 channels because the matrix decode is pending.

2) At first time you need 7 physical channels FL-FR-FC-LFE-BL-BR-BC but if you have already matrix encoded BC in BL'-BR' you can use the ac3 encoder directly setting the EX flag.
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Old 27th August 2007, 08:23   #47  |  Link
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OK THX, now i understand

My Target is :
"Sources : DD EX and DTS ES 6.1

1. Decode it to "7 CH mono waves"
2. Timestretch 25-23.976
3. Encode 7 mono waves to DD EX 5.1 SonyVegas ( 6.1 record Project)

I can use my Audigy2 ZS Built in Decoder for DD EX and DTS ES 6.1 :

- Playback with NeroShowtime (with HDDVD/BR Plugin) select SPDIF in Options .
- Set Audigy2ZS Decoder to SPDIF and DTS ES/ DD EX "On" and 6.1 Speakers
- Sony Vegas 6.1 Project ,recording all (already)mapped 7 Channels through Creative ASIO Input


But i would prefer dumping to 7 CH through Graphedit. Especially it looks like Creative Decoder applies DialNorm and even with DRC disabled the DynamicPeaks are very low.
It works fine on DTS ES 6.1 Discrete :
DTS/AC3 Source-CyberlinkAudioDecoder-Wavedest-Filewriter #cyberlinks own decoder set to 7CH. Output is 7 seperate mono Channles

However, maybe working with full Discrete 7 mono Channles makes more Sense when i have a Encoder to encode to a 6.1 Discerte Format, and i dont have

Last edited by ACrowley; 27th August 2007 at 14:07.
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Old 31st August 2007, 18:30   #48  |  Link
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Hello Tebasuna and ACrowley

VST Cicle Surround II, works the channels discretes.
Dolby Surround EX-(6.1) the channel SC, has to be a channel Matrix, not discrete.

My Encoder DTS Pro Series or DTS HD Master Audio, it allows, the channel Matrix or discrete.

I am, trying to create a new method 6.1, with Cubase 4 and Sony Sound Forge 9, but, I still have much that to be employed at this. When some day obtains it, I promise to do another guide
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Old 1st September 2007, 13:44   #49  |  Link
ACrowley
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Elektra999 View Post
I am, trying to create a new method 6.1, with Cubase 4 and Sony Sound Forge 9, but, I still have much that to be employed at this. When some day obtains it, I promise to do another guide
Lucky guy....wish i could work with dts pro Series or better DTS HD Master Suite too Would be a Dream, i can only work with Surcode

Last edited by ACrowley; 1st September 2007 at 13:50.
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Old 4th September 2007, 16:16   #50  |  Link
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Will sound forge do 5.1 as well for DTS or should I stay with Audition 2.0
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Old 6th September 2007, 12:13   #51  |  Link
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- Surcode DVD DTS, work to 16/44100 and 16/48 - Files Padded or DTS WAV in DTS 5.1
- DTS Nuendo, work to 16/44100, 16/48 and 24/48 - Files Padded or DTS WAV in DTS 5.1
- DTS Pro Series, work to 16bits/44100/48000, 20bits 44.1, 88.2 (I believe) for HDCD?, 24bits/48000/96000
DTS 2.0, 2.1, 4.0, 4.1, 5.0, 5.1, 6.0 or 6.1 - Files Padded or DTS WAV.

- DTS-HD Encoder™:

DTS Stream Types:

DTS-HD Master Audio™, "bit for bit" variable bitrate with embedded core of DTS Digital Surround® constant bitrate up to 1,509 kbps.
DTS-HD High Resolution Audio™ constant bitrate from 2046 kbps up to 5,760 (Blu-ray Disc) or 3,018 (HD DVD) kbps.
DTS Digital Surround constant bitrate up to 1509 kbps for DVD-V and DVD-A, 1,234 kbps for Music CDs, Sub / Secondary Audio low bitrate streams.


Channel Layout Support:
Up to 6.1 ch. for DTS 5.1 Music Disc
Up to 6.1 ch. for DVD-V & DVD-A
Up to 7.1 ch. for Primary/ Main stream for Blu-ray Disc / HD DVD


Downmixes:
7.1 to 5.1
5.1 to 2.0 channels (Stereo)


Sample rates:
44.1, 88.2** kHz for DTS Surround Music CD*
48 and 96 kHz for DVD-V and DVD-A
48, 96 and 192 kHz for HD-DVD and Blu-ray Disc
12, 24, and 48 kHz for Secondary / Sub Audio on HD-DVD and Blu-ray Disc.
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Old 6th September 2007, 12:32   #52  |  Link
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Dolby TrueHD

is a lossless audio technology designed for the new high-definition packaged media. Only Dolby TrueHD guarantees lossless HD audio playback from every HD DVD player and from supporting Blu-ray Disc players, and Dolby TrueHD also offers the most efficient lossless coding available. It supports up to eight channels (7.1-channel surround) of 24-bit/96 kHz audio, with expandability to accommodate more channels in the future while retaining compatibility with all Dolby TrueHD decoders. (For fewer than eight channels, Dolby TrueHD allows sampling frequencies as high as 192 kHz.) Dolby TrueHD gives content creators new capabilities to position sounds for the most realistic effects. And with audio playback that is bit-for-bit identical to the highest-resolution studio masters, listeners experience sound as stunning as the high-definition picture.

Demo for Mac
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Old 8th September 2007, 14:04   #53  |  Link
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Hello Elektra999,

Quote:
Lucky guy....wish i could work with dts pro Series or better DTS HD Master Suite too Would be a Dream, i can only work with Surcode
ACrowley

A little question:
Have you tried to encode a true DTS HD MA? and perhaps listen a track..

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Old 8th September 2007, 19:02   #54  |  Link
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Quote:
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Hello Elektra999,

ACrowley

A little question:
Have you tried to encode a true DTS HD MA? and perhaps listen a track..

Not, I am waiting for " DTS SAS Upgrade from DTS Pro Series Encoder ", until the year 2008, I will not have, DTS HD Master Audio.

DTS Pro Series, Maximum resolution 24/96 DTS 5.1 y 6.1 ES.
DTS HD Master Audio, Maximum resolution 24/192 7.1
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Old 10th September 2007, 18:37   #55  |  Link
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Will the V.I. plug ins work with Sound Forge 9.0?, also can you create surround files like with Adobe audition? I tried to find the multitrack option like in audition but got lost...Is there a walkthru or guide anywhere on this or Vegas?
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Last edited by Rck60s; 10th September 2007 at 19:04. Reason: added more questions
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Old 18th October 2007, 20:16   #56  |  Link
Zaim7890
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hi can sum1 help?

after i create track, it's playing a bit faster than it should. i tryed pwerdvd/nero showtime both the same, only plays faster after encoding.

also after i create these tracks how i can burn them (keeping the audio untoched) so that it will play back on my dvd recoder/player

thanks
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Old 19th October 2007, 16:25   #57  |  Link
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Re

ah i have found out what app can burn the ac3 files to dvd with untouched audio!

use AudioDVDCreator, this keeps the RC channel, on my amp when i used nerovision only 6 channels showed up, and when i tryed AudioDVDcreator it showed 7 channels.

Last edited by Zaim7890; 25th October 2007 at 12:21.
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Old 19th October 2007, 16:36   #58  |  Link
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Hello
Track AC3 5.1 is 16/48000 for DVD-Audio, not for CD-Audio.
CD-Audio 16/44100, The AC3 of Aften and the AC3 pro of SF9, do not work well in AC3 44100.
For CD-Audio, It would have to be an AC3 wav, Aften and Sony Forge 9 not work in AC3 WAV.
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Last edited by Elektra999; 22nd October 2007 at 19:45.
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Old 21st October 2007, 23:03   #59  |  Link
Zaim7890
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do u have the DTS Pro Series Encoder

Last edited by Zaim7890; 25th October 2007 at 12:19.
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Old 22nd October 2007, 01:42   #60  |  Link
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Quote:
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if u have the DTS Pro Series Encoder it would be appreciated alot if u could host it rapidshare etc
That's against the rules. Obviously you haven't looked at it before you made your post.
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