Custom Standalone Matrix?

[iNFO-DVD]

Really would like to know whether any custom matrices are available that are specifically targetted towards standalones. I love to have say, 3 matrix (low|med|high) bitrates, that will work on all standalones.... any available?

[Sharktooth]

h.263 (it's not a matrix though).
Standalones are not always compatible with custom matrices.

[unskinnyboy]

@Sharktooth, How can we know for sure whether a matrix is standalone compatible (apart from encoding a clip with it, burning it onto a CD-R and actually playing it)? Which intra/inter values to check?

(I have read that Yamada has a problem playing matrices with intra matrix values >=15).

[Sharktooth]

Well, there isnt a perfect rule.
Every chipmaker can do whatever he wants because there's no interest in adding a custom matrix playback feature in standalones (blame DivX for not including CQMs in the DivX certification).
So, the safest way is to go with h.263/MPEG quantization or test it.
However most of the times it's enaugh to keep the inter-matrix coefficients >= 16.

[unskinnyboy]

Thank you for the reply.

So I take it that everytime someone comes up with a CQM, you go ahead and test it on your standalone before you declare that it isn't compatible?

Your must have a stack of coasters sky-high by now then. :D

[Sharktooth]

Well, if a matrix have some below 16 coeffs in inter-matrix then it's not compatible...

[unskinnyboy]

Thanks. All clear now. I will keep my eyes open for <=16.:)

[iNFO-DVD]

I've tried some right strange matrices on my standalone and it seems to play them all, hmmmm, but my m8's one is really picky, I have an ellion and he has a cello.... where's my screw-driver, I'm checking out what chipset I have.

[unskinnyboy]

It should say in your player's manual or the player's homepage as to which chipset it is using.

What is your Ellion's model number?

[bond]

Originally posted by unskinnyboy
How can we know for sure whether a matrix is standalone compatiblewhen a player supports mpeg-4 advanced simple profile @ level 5 you can be sure that all custom matrices are supported

or the player manufacturer lies :D

[iNFO-DVD]

No, didn't say in the manual or web site and search since yesterday to find out, had it for over a year now anyway so I took a peek inside.

Ellion DVX-520C (used to be sold at Scan UK)

Chipset:

SIGMA DESIGNS
REALmagic
EM8500

[unskinnyboy]

@bond, That would make sense. And what about ASP@L0-L4? That also allows CQMs.

Also I was just poking around a bit about DVP642.

Looking at a consumer's comment here (http://ces.engadget.com/entry/1234000300026706/#c96903)..

the Philips DVP642 supports anything which stays within the ASP@L5 DivX/XviD standard. While I have found in my own testing that you can actually do more than 1 consecutive B-frame (I've tested the Philips DVP642 with streams which have 3 consecutive B-frames with no issues), if you have 3-warp GMC (XviD) or anything other than standard H.263 or MPEG quantization matrices (read: Custom Matrices = Won't play correctly in Philips DVP642)... It's not going to play in the player.Doesn't his 2 statements contradict each other? Or he doesn't know what he is talking about?

[bond]

Originally posted by unskinnyboy
@[b]bond, That would make sense. And what about ASP@L0-L4? That also allows CQMs. supports cqms too

Doesn't his 2 statements contradict each other? Or he doesn't know what he is talking about?sounds like "supports asp@l5, except ..."

[feedback]

@iNFO-DVD

The BDVD matrix gives very good results on two of my three standalones.
The first value in the intra-matrix is 16, to be compliant the first value should be 8, everything else is okay. Still, like I said even with the 16 value it works and gives good results in 2 out of 3 standalones. I am using it at 3000 bitrate and up. The colors seem to be more pronounced than with the default matrix. I am using the HC encoder in DVD-RB Pro. Try it you might like it.

I wish like you, that more matrices were identified as "will work or not work with standalones". Also, a little info. about what range of bitrate to use it with would be helpful.

The information about having to be above 16 in the inter-matrix from Sharktooth, is helpful, as is the info. that the first value in the intra-matrix should be 8. I also notice that the first intra value in the "Custom Quantization Matrix Editor 1.0" is Always set at 8.
Regards,:)