Scenarist error

[trigger638]

I am working with a title in which the main video stream contains two angles. Angle one is the main film and angle two contains a video commentary. I have never seen this before, but when played with video commentary there is a picture in picture effect where they filmed clips of the commentary. To complicate matters, the commentary angle is interlaced while the main film is progressive (ntsc).

I ran the big 3 using the updated guide to ensure that cce got the correct parameters for encoding the angles. Instead of automating the entire process, I started batchccews manually to make sure that the settings were correct. The only thing that looked off to me was the end frames were different between the angles, but this is due to pulldown/nopull for the interlaced verses progressive video.

Everything went well with the encode and the import. When attepting a build I recieve the following error in scenarist:

......

Error Scene "VTS_03_V2_C1" and "VTS_03_V1_C1" "VTS_3(VTS Title Domain)" would be connected Seamlessly but the following conditions are illegal:
Error Logically Adjacent is No.(see DVD Book VI3-85)
Error Cell "Cell: "VTS3_Title1_PGC1_PG1_C2"PGC:<VTS3_Title1_PGC1> (Title:<VTS3_Title1> VTS:<VTS_3>) " has an illegal seamless connection.
Error Scene "VTS_03_V2_C1-a1" and "VTS_03_V1_C1" "VTS_3(VTS Title Domain)" would be connected Seamlessly but the following conditions are illegal:
Error Logically Adjacent is No.(see DVD Book VI3-85)
Error Cell "Cell: "VTS3_Title1_PGC1_PG1_C3"PGC:<VTS3_Title1_PGC1> (Title:<VTS3_Title1> VTS:<VTS_3>) " has an illegal seamless connection.
Warning The subpicture (stream 1 in Video Track "VTS07_014_Track") is across scene break at 00:21:14:15. The subpicture will not display when jumping into the scene. Please adjust the subpicture start time or scene start time.
Error Validate From DB failed.
Error DVD Video files could not be created

......

Cell 1 in pgc 1 is basically a still, I modified the no-cce avs file for this cell so that Scenaid would replace it with a dummy track to avoid short video errors. Cell 2 has angles and is flagged NSM in the scenario editor.

I am using the following tool versions:

DoitFast4U 1.4.7.0
DVD Decrypter 3.2.3.0
BatchCCEWS 0.9.1.5 beta
Sceanaid 1.0.0.0 final
Scenarist 3.0.0

Thanks in advance.

[influenza]

Did you dummy any audio? Because it's very ahrd to do vobid demuxes while dummying audio.

What you can do to solve the problems is to demux to an other dir (including all audio). Copy the audio to the first demux dir and run scenaid again. Let scenarist compile etc. Your disc will be too big of course, because of the extra audio. You should strip the audio with any program of choice to reach the desired size.

Hopefully this will work :)

Good luck.

[D3s7]

It's unlikely that's it's audio causing that particular error...

the fact that the angles are different lengths is an issue though... you'll need to shorten up the longer angle track to = the shorter one...

If that doesn't work, send me the ifo and I"ll take a look (btw.. pulldown shouldn't effect asset lengths unless the original is different)

The other thing it could perhaps be is if the angles are suppose to be non-seamless but the cell before is flagged as seamless.. not sure what that would do as I only really know of 1 movie w/ non-seamless angles (DaD)

[influenza]

Non seamless angles and non seamless connections between cells are two different things if you ask me. And non seamless angles are very rare indeed.

For some reasons the script is set to have seamless connections between the cells why physically it's not possible. I do think audio could be an issue here. So information on dummy audio would be usefull.

[D3s7]

Yes true but usually you get a different error from audio (although i'm not toally ruling that out)...

Either way we need more info :)

and btw.. you can have SM between cells / vobid although under rare conditons... (insomnia has such a situation)

[trigger638]

When I ran the process I did indeed dummy out one of the audio tracks. I followed your instructions exactly by reruning the demux including the audio, and then copying all the relivent files to the original directory. I made sure that I cleaned everything up from the last attempt and re-ran scenarist. I got the exact same results as above.

Actually I am not sure that the length of the angle is a problem. I recall specifically on a different title I had made an error and encoded the angle shorter than the main. Scenarist gave me an error stating that the angle must be at least as long as the main. That stuck me to mean that it can in fact be longer, just not shorter. I have no idea what scenarist does in this situtation, but it would suggest that it is legal.

At any rate I have no problem reencoding the angle material and setting the end frames equal. I will attempt that right away. I will forward the ifo for your review.

Thanks for all the help.

[D3s7]

The angle asset can be longer IIRC just not shorter... you are correct on that..

I'll take a look at the info and see what I can see... very wierd that error is

[influenza]

I've seen this error more than once. SOmetimes it's just not possible to create a seamless connection. If you set the cell to nsm it probably compiles fine.

[D3s7]

all right.. not sure why it attempted to link those seamlessly (and why Scenarist didn't auto correct like it normally does) but if you go into your layout and look at PGC1, Cell 1 and the angleblock (vobid 2/3) are probably selected as SM - select them both and you should be able to change that to NSM (non seamless)

I'm interested to see if it's JUST that one or if your going tog et the same error in CH2 with vobid 4/5

[trigger638]

Ok this is weird but here goes. Cell 1 in pgc 1 is flagged NSM. The cells contained in the first angle set (vob 2/3) are both set NSM. Cell 3 is a non angle cell and is flagged SM as is the entire rest of the video stream.

With cell 1 selected the seamless flag dropdown allows only Default(Not Seamlessly) and Not Seamlessly as options. When you select one of the cells in the cell block, the error flashes again on the build tab. Also note that no selection is possible on the seamless flag dropdown and the box itself is blank. This is true for both of the cells in this angle block.

The linked scene shortcut has an additional seamless connection dropdown. For cell 1 it can be changed from non seamless to seamless, but this change will not reflect in the scenario editor. For the first cell in the cell block (vob id 2) this can be done as well, however, it makes no change either in the scenario editor flags or in the error. When I attempted this shift, it complained that a change cannot be made with audio and sub info on the track so I removed them and tried it, and it appeared to hold the setting change, but it did not reflect on the scenario editor nor did it effect the error status.

I noticed that I neglected to mention the state of the selections under the linked scene section before I messed with them. Cell 1 (vob 1 no angle) is set to seamless. Cell block 2 (vob 2/3) is set to non-seamless. But again, changing these seems to have no effect.

I played around with it so I am going to clean it up and run another import, I got a feeling that log files are next.

Thanks for the help guys, its always great to work with you guys.

[influenza]

yeah I occasionally ahd those problems as well. I usually ended up manually reauthoring. What happens if you build this scenario (partially) by hand. So you manully drag the video to the title etc. You could just do it for a couple of vodids to see if it will compile that way.

[D3s7]

Other thing to check is how the angles are joining to each other (from the track manager)

If you wanna send me the .scp I can take a look at that too and see where it's fubar

[trigger638]

Ok here is some more info. I took the suggestion and attempted to manually put this back togather. Rather than over complicate things I went totally from scratch starting with importing all of the assets then working everything by hand.

When I first attempted this I used the dummy video clip from the Scenaid folder to take the place of cell 1. After everything was put togather I attempted a build. Scenarist complained that the clip was too short preceeding an angle cell block and said it must be at least 90 frames in duration. Well ok, I used the Muli-File data function in scenarist to create a data assit that contained like 4 of the dummy files stringed togather. So now I had a dummy track that was over 90 frames.

It should be noted that everything was seemless, the connections between the cells themselves as well as the angles. On attempting to compile this time I got a very different error:

......

Info Multiplexing VOB Main Stream
Info Multiplexing VOB Angle Stream 1
Info Interleaving VOB, Block No 1
Error ERROR in Interleaving.
Error ERROR in making ILVU.
The PTSs are different at ILVU#1 in CELL#1 between angles.
Error Dvd_ilv : Reconfig Vobset Tree Error
Error Terminated Interleaving (with2-VTS__03_V002.I-TFF-UFF.4~_1_t.vob).
Error Start PTS of ILVUs in each angle are deferent. The encoding paremeters should be same between angles.
Error Interleave is failed.
Error Multiplexing failed, Track "VTS__03_V002.I-TFF-UFF.4~_1"

Error MuxFromDB:MuxVTS failed
Error Multiplex failed
Error DVD Video files could not be created

......

It should be noted that I used the assets exactly as they exsisted from the original process. This appears to suggest an encoding problem, but I have no idea how that is possible. I triple checked the settings of the angles myself, and I still have them.

The aspect ratio and all the bitrates are identical between both clips. In the source field: Top Field First, Alternate Scan, and Angle are all checked and this is common for both clips. 2:3 pulldown is checked for vob 2 but not vob 3. Close all GOP's is checked, and the GOP (N/M) settings match at 3/4. The end frames are different as the main is 1549 and the angle is 1936.

It was suggested that the end frames must match so now I am going to rerun the clips in question changing the end frames to match exactly. I will post the results here. There is something strange going on here. Oh I sent the scp file just in case.

Thanks again for all the help.

[influenza]

Yes this is a more familiar error. Angles must have the same duration (=number of frames0 so that's a problem for sure in your case. Besides that make sure that auto insert I-frame and close gops have the correct values. (checking the angle checkbox should take care of that)

[trigger638]

Ok well that will not work. If you set the end frames to exactly the same value, when you import the assets vobid 2 has a duration of 00:01:04:17 and vobid 3 ends up with a duration of 00:00:51:18. This is an illegal situation because vobid 3 is the angle. I repeted this process a total of 3 times, everything from scratch to be sure there were no silly mistakes. Because I dont fully understand the tech details around pulldown im not going to make any assumptions, but the only difference between the way these two clips are being handled is that vobid 2 is pulldown and vobid 3 is nopull.

So I am still at the same place, any additional help would be appriciated, thanks.