NEC ND-3500A and Media

[malkion]

Hi folks, especially long time users of various DVD +- R media.

I will be purchasing an OEM NEC ND-3500A from newegg, my first DVD burner. I have a list of recommended media from NEC as follows.

Mitsubish Chemicals -R by Verbatim 16X, 4X
Fuji -R 8X
PVC -R 4X
Sony -R 8X, +R 8X
Taiyo Yuden -R 4X (max write 8X), +R 16X
Maxell +R 8X
Ricoh +R 8X
MPO +R 8X

This by itself is not so confusing. I will probably be purchasing media from meritline.com Where I see specials on brands like Ritek, GreatAZO, HQAZO, BeAll, ProDisc, SamSung, ApexPro, BenQ, DigitalMatrix, Maxell, Memorex, Mitsui, OptoDisc, Panasonic, PioData, Prime, TDK, etc...

I'd like to compile a list of which media would be safe to purchase. Do you know what media brands are using what discs originally? Any other pointers would be most helpful as well.

[Asmodian]

I recently got that same DVD burner and have been using Ritek 4X +R disks with no problem, the drive will burn them at 8x but I usually use 4x. I think the Ritek disks are from Ricoh.
Not much info but maybe it will help :)

[malkion]

Hey, that's exactly what I'd like to hear.

These Ritek's are the purple writing surface right? Hate to had to have bought a bunch of discs for coasters.

[Asmodian]

Yep, the purple (violet) surface.

[theReal]

Ritek are ok, but if you want to be on the safe side (especially for long-time archiving) then I'd recommend Verbatim (Mitsubishi) or Tayo Yuden.
Tayo Yuden is a manufacturer only, there are no discs labelled "Tayo Yuden" AFAIK
That makes it hard to find TY discs (some batches of Sony or other brand name discs might be TY, other batches are not, you always have to check the manufacturer code).
Verbatim are 90% Mitsubishi and 10% TY - but that only applies to Jewel-Cased and Slim-Cased discs, not spindles...

[alexnoe]

This is what I get good results with in that drive (scanned with plextor 712):

Taiyo Yuden 4x/8x -R @ 8x
Mitsubishi 4x/8x -R @ 8x
TDK 4x -R @ 8x (not optimal, but not really bad either)
Taiyo Yuden 8x +R @ 13x (don't write 16x; error rate is too high)

The drive tries to write Mitsubishi, Taiyo Yuden 8x -R and Ricoh 8x +R at 12x speed, but the error rates are too high. It performs very well at 8x speed (even on 4x media), but you shouldn't write faster than 8x, except for taiyo yuden dvd+r media.

Plextor labeled discs are always Taiyo Yuden, btw

[theReal]

Plextor labeled discs are always Taiyo Yuden, btwGood to know that - where can you buy Plextor discs in Germany (online shops)?

[alexnoe]

www.amazon.de (55 Euro for 25 dvd+r discs on a spindle)
www.alternate.de (11 Euro for 5 dvd-r discs in Juwel cases)

[theReal]

Thanks for the info - but they are pretty expensive compared to Verbatim...

I only have a 4x burner anyways, so I rather get the Verbatim 4x printable for 99 Euro Cent a piece :)

[alexnoe]

Today I got a spindle of 25 DVD+R Verbatim 16x for 27 Euro. I'll see how they work somewhen.... trough I'll have access to the NEC 3500 only in a few days.

[theReal]

Today I got a spindle of 25 DVD+R Verbatim 16x for 27 EuroI heard the Verbatim spindles are often not the same quality as the jewel case media...

[alexnoe]

I've made a different experience... especially as all the Juwel cased Verbatim media I can get here is printable, and printable media seems to be problematic in general when looking at all my plextor 712 - scans...

*Sometimes*, Verbatim has put crap media into the 50pcs spindles, but 25pcs and 10pcs spindles appearently have not been affected.

[alexnoe]

16x writing with the NEC 3500 on Verbatim 16x +R media works well. PI sum 8 max is 29 (scanned with plextor 712)

[richarddd]

As of Sunday, 28 November: Best Buy in the US is selling Verbatim 8x either +R or -R 50 pack spindles for $20. CompUSA is selling Sony 50 packs for $20 (can't tell if it's 4x or 8x from the ad).

Which should I get for my not-yet-ordered NEC 3500?

[ronnylov]

If you have problem with a certain media you can try flashing to a newer official or a hacked firmware (which also may allow higher reading and writing speeds). I got my ND-3500A one week ago and I have flashed it twice, first 2.18 rpc free with bitsetting and riplock removed than Liggy and Dee hacked 2.18 V_1 RC2 (got it from the forums at cdfreak.com). After flashing it became a ND-3500AG (I don't know the difference from ND-3500A). The forums at cdfreak.com have lot of media test results with this burner.

Anyway I have had great results with all the firmwares and all discs I have tried yet. Probably best not going over rated speed of the disc. Even if using rated speed the hacked firmware may have better writing strategies.I must say it is better than my girlfriends NEC-2500 (better results and faster burns) and much better than my old Pioneer A04 (same or better results but much faster burns).

[alexnoe]

Just tested Maxell 8x DVD-R (MXL RG03, Juwel Cased, Real maxell, no fake stuff). You can write them at 16x in the nec 3500, and the result is acceptable. Not optimal, but acceptable

[mikeX]

I buy TYs from a local wholesale shop, their price listing for Jewel Cased TYs is as follows:

THAT'S +R 4x CERAMIC COAT JAPAN Made by TAIYO YUDEN (50+) 0,54 (100+) 0,54
THAT'S -R 4x CERAMIC COAT JAPAN Made by TAIYO YUDEN (50+) 0,78 (100+) 0,74

THAT'S +R 8x CERAMIC COAT JAPAN Made by TAIYO YUDEN (50+) 0,71 (100+) 0,67
THAT'S -R 8x CERAMIC COAT JAPAN Made by TAIYO YUDEN (50+) 0,91 (100+) 0,87

[prices in EURO, tax not included]

They are all described as Compatible to double their reported speed.
I 've only tried -/+R 4x so far, and 1 -R 8x which burned at 12x if i recall correctly.
I can burn the -R 4x at 6x. Can't force speed for +R media.

I generally have no complaint against these TYs.

A Verbatim 8x Certified I tried to burn today with speed=auto (k3b), while reporting 12x as the sellected speed, could not go beyond 6x and fell at 4x after it tried to.

note that my writer is enclosed in a Plextor USB 2.0 case/

[alexnoe]

Can't force speed for +R media.You can't force any speed on anything.... the thing is that the NEC 3500 officially supports a lot of discs at higher speeds than certified, which is
maxell 8x -r @ 16x
taiyo yuden 8x +r @ 16x
taiyo yuden 8x -r @ 12x
mitsubishi 8x -r @ 12x
ricoh 8x +r @ 12x
tdk 4x -r @ 8x
verbatim 4x -r @ 8x
taiyo yuden 4x -r @ 8x
taiyo yuden 4x +r @ 8x (according to nec's official list yuden000-t01 work at 8x, whereas yuden000-t00 don't; haven't tried it on my own)

[mikeX]

this is what dvd+rw-mediainfo reports on the +R 4x TYs i mentioned above:

INQUIRY: [_NEC ][DVD_RW ND-3500AG][2.F8]
GET [CURRENT] CONFIGURATION:
Mounted Media: 1Bh, DVD+R
Media ID: YUDEN000/T01
Current Write Speed: 6.1x1385=8467KB/s
Write Speed #0: 6.1x1385=8467KB/s
Write Speed #1: 5.1x1385=7056KB/s
Write Speed #2: 4.1x1385=5645KB/s
Write Speed #3: 3.1x1385=4234KB/s
Write Speed #4: 2.0x1385=2822KB/s
Write Speed #5: 1.0x1385=1411KB/s
GET [CURRENT] PERFORMANCE:
Write Performance: 4.0x1385=5540KB/s@[0 -> 2295104]
Speed Descriptor#0: 00/2295104 R@5.0x1385=6925KB/s W@4.0x1385=5540KB/s
Speed Descriptor#1: 00/2295104 R@5.0x1385=6925KB/s W@2.4x1385=3324KB/s
READ DISC INFORMATION:
...


so as you can see either NEC's claim is unfounded or the firmware i have on it messed things up [or maybe they aren't genuine TYs] ...

[alexnoe]

You are using a b0rked firmware. 2.F8 is not an official one, so whatever goes wrong, blame it on the firmware hacker

[mikeX]

People at the cdfreaks forums say that there are 2 revisions of YUDEN000/T01:

59 55 44 45 4e 30 30 30 54 30 31 00 01 -> [YUDEN000T01 ] 2.4 4.0
59 55 44 45 4e 30 30 30 54 30 31 01 01 -> [YUDEN000T01 ] 2.4 4.0 6.0 8.0

link (http://club.cdfreaks.com/showthread.php?p=784994#post784994)

I guess i'm using the 1s one :(

The firmware I have on (at least this one now) claims no change on the TY writing strategies...

I am having problems burning T02 > 8x though :( (they should burn @16x)
I don't get coasters, but the drive fails to switch from 8 to 12 or 16 (and instead falls back to 6x)

[Wolfman]

just use ANY reasonable price media .. its a great drive and if it encounters problems it simply drops the speed .. thats what the walking OPC is for .. I use 4x media as they are both Good AND cheap (Ritek printables @ around 22p each). Hacked firmwares? I'm dubious .. how do the hackers test their results? There is simply too many different brands of media for them to afford to do too much testing. I would go for bitsetting and riplock and region free nothing else. fw 2.18